If its not the way. Which way is?

by maryacclaim 30 Replies latest jw friends

  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff

    Hi Mary -

    First off - Welcome to the forum. I hope you are finding us to be a decent bunch.

    From only two posts, it is hard to discern with any certainty, where you are in the matter of religion, God. You seem to believe that Jehovah's Witnesses have at least some 'truth', perhaps at least as much, or perhaps more, than other religions? May I address a couple of your doctinal mentions?

    First let me say this: If one wishes to establish any 'new' agenda, sell any new product, he is well advised to find innovative ways to advertise it as 'new', 'different', 'better','improved'. This is what CT Russell was faced with - selling a new religion. His doctrines were derived from others mostly, but have survived, and to most modern Jw's they seem 'unique', which to many translates as 'correct' in their eyes. Perhaps this is because one can readily accept that such radical positions, seemingly supported by scripture, must be visible only to the 'faithful'.

    It is with this sales job ahead of him, that Russell began to adopt his doctrinal platform. Here are the doctrines you mentioned, in order:

    • Jesus always spoke of his Father as greater. Jw's fight hard to show themselves 'different' in this area. Yet, they are not alone in such beliefs. There are many religions who believe that Jesus is God's son, that he is not God himself. Yet - if one examines the arguments, pro and con, it becomes evident that both have flawed reasoning. Both can be 'proven' by biblical reference, or perhaps biblical exegisis. Jw's are by no means exclusive in this belief system, though they will attempt to make us believe otherwise. Christadelphian's, The Way, come to mind, and there are others.
    • what happens when we die, the prospect of living on earth forever. Another of the Jw 'hooks'. We don't have to die at all. If we do, we don't have to wonder what it will be like when we come back to life - it will be an earth just like we left, only better. No angelic choirs. No spirit body. Just what we already love - the earth, rain, childrens voices, petting lions, smelling the clover. Again, Jw's are not unique in this belief.
    • not being involved with the worlds governments and wars Sounds like what Jesus was selling, right? And yet most historians believe that Jesus was highly involved in protest against the Roman government, thus leading to his death [although the gospel accounts clean it up a bit]. Even Jw's are not totally separate from the world though. We are all interlinked to the effects of government in our lives. Jw's are more than happy to accept help from the government when they need it. They don't vote - but then some other religions don't vote either. Amish don't vote, don't pay taxes, don't take welfare, don't drive, etc, all in an effort to observe the same belief. As for involvement in wars - the vast majority of 'consciencious objectors' in prison are not Jehovah's Witnesses. Many abstain from killing others based on conscience.
    • preaching the word I dare say that most, if not all, churches would disagree on this one. I have had people come to my door from several other religions 'preaching the word'. THe Jw interpretation of 'preaching' is not unique. But in other ways, other religious people seek to spread the gospel. Mostly, it could be said that Jw's don't actually preach the word at all - they distribute, publish, sell. But preaching is not what they do mostly. [This from one who wasted a decade pioneering, and another 25 years selling Watchtower magazines and 'Bible studies'.]
    • the blood issue This is a deep one - not easy to cover in a few words. Suffice it to say, that just 5 years ago, and probably up until 3 years ago, I believed that Jw's had this one more right than wrong. Let me just suggest taking a look at AJWRB. org

    Where does this leave us? With a ton of choices. You can look around and find a religious group that accepts/believes just about anything. You can 'mainstream' it - just become a 'Sunday go to meetin' type. Or, you can accept that religion, including Jw's 'is a snare and a racket'.

    There are as many choices as there are people who used to be Jehovah's Witnesses. I concur with a previous poster. If you have not done so - then please get Ray Franz' books "Crisis of Conscience" and "In Search of Christian Freedom" and read them. In fact, my best advise is to 'read read read'. Read anything and everything. Get the cobwebs out. And it takes a few years to do that.

    Good to have you. I hope to see how your perspective and opinions grow and expand over time. Freedom is wonderful.

    Peace and Namaste

    Jeff

  • thomas15
    thomas15

    The answer to your question Mary is found in John Chapter 14- as others have already mentioned.

  • no more kool aid
    no more kool aid

    Hi Mary, I have had to get comfortable with the idea of not knowing the answers to every mystery of life. I felt very smug as a witness that we had special enlightenment to every aspect of life, now I don't think anybody does. Maybe someday I will have the energy to start to investigate other religion/doctrine but right now am just enjoying my freedom. I hope that helps a little and welcome.

  • Narkissos
    Narkissos

    "`Would you tell me, please, which way I ought to go from here?'
    `That depends a good deal on where you want to get to,' said the Cat.
    `I don't much care where--' said Alice.
    `Then it doesn't matter which way you go,' said the Cat.
    `--so long as I get somewhere,' Alice added as an explanation.
    `Oh, you're sure to do that,' said the Cat, `if you only walk long enough.' "

    Caminante, no hay camino: se hace el camino al andar ("Traveller, there is no way: by walking is the way made" - Antonio Machado)

  • wobble
    wobble

    Can I add a very warm welcome as well?

    I concur with all of the above,especially about the books to read,and Ray's "In Search of Christian Freedom" really does what it says in the title,it leads you to Christian freedom.

    I also wish to say that I believe ALL organised religions contain error,and are made by men for men,not by God.

    Love

    Wobble

  • lonestar63
    lonestar63

    How is it possible that you could care less about the false predictions of the wt? A false prophet is a false prophet and if you are a believer in God you would care deeply about ever having followed a false prophet.

    Good post carla.

    Mary, i don't know how far back you go, but the entire pulse of the WBTS in the 80's was based on 1914, and the last generation. My whole preaching experience during the 80's was based on 1914.

    Then when that last generation passes away, and they start saying babies that were alive in 1914, ect., ect., ect., then all of a sudden they recieve "new light".

    No thanks, i'll pass.

    I thank God that i escaped with family intact. From what i've read on here, i'm one of the lucky few.

  • garybuss
    garybuss

    The Watch Tower Corporation along with all philosophy, tries to answer three questions: How did we get here? What are we doing here? Where are we going? All Watch Tower Corporation writings deal with one of these basic three questions.

    For one philosophy book printing business to claim they have the only possible right answers to these three questions is beyond arrogant. It's incredible! When the Watch Tower Corporation states an opinion as a fact, that doesn't make it a fact. That just proves they're idiots.

    I had to get out of the box and look at the box to appreciate the tactics used by the Watch Tower Corporation. The Watch Tower Corporation makes a claim and then makes a rule against challenging any of their claims. Then they enforce the rule by requiring your relatives to snub and shun you. Do ya think they might be trying to hide something? :-)

  • lavendar
    lavendar

    Hello Maryacclaim,

    You said:

    "You have liers, steelers, cheaters, gays, molesters, good, bad, drunks, drug addicts, dumb and smart. No matter where you are, what you believe, people are people."

    You are right.... there are some of these kinds of people in EVERY religion. Not one church or organization is void of them. That's why it's so important to keep your eyes on GOD. Humans are fallible....but God is not. God wants a RELATIONSHIP with you, through His son Jesus Christ.......not your religion. There's a huge difference between RELIGION and a RELATIONSHIP with the Lord.

    The JW's god is NOT the true God of the Bible. He would never be part of this destructive cult. There are many, many people on this board who have been hurt by the WTS. I don't blame them for feeling the anger, resentment, and bitterness towards an Organization that broke up their families, stole precious years from their lives, lied to them, and perhaps even caused the death of a loved one.

    I truly hope you find peace someday, Maryacclaim. All the best to you. :o)

  • happpyexjw
    happpyexjw

    Mary, welcome to this forum. I just discovered it myself recently and have found the posters on here to be very interesting and helpful. Sometimes I agree with them and sometimes I don't. Most importantly though, I have found a place where I can freely express my questions, thoughts and opinions without being judged or attacked -- a freedom one does not have withing the wts.

    I left the organization in 1990. I was not kicked out -- I simply went away. I have experienced many of the same questions you have described. I am still pondering many of the answers even now. I am wary of organized religion, not because of fear of the wts, but rather a reluctance to accept another organization's package of beliefs. There are many ideas that are a part of mainstream churches that I personally have difficulty with. I have learned to be patient with myself and try the best I can to live my life in a way that does no harm to others. I think we all have a sort of moral compass that tells us what is right and wrong, and that is what I do my best to follow these days.

    I look for the spiritual in life and have learned to enjoy the feeling I get when I enter ancient churches for example, or bask in the majesty of nature. These things help me to realize that I am but a small part of a much greater universe. If there is a God I believe he will reach out to me at some point and help me to find him. In the meantime, I am learning to think for myself and enjoy all that this life has to offer, not forcing belief in anything someone tells me I must believe.

    One thing I have learned from this forum is that each of us must find our own way to heal from our wts experience, some more quickly than others, but all in our own way. Here you will find support and ideas to help you along the way. I wish you peace and comfort Mary.

  • Quandry
    Quandry

    Welcome to the forum.

    Ask your questions here. At the Kingdom Hall you do not dare......

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