God ordered abortions?

Julie

Greetings to you all:

I have a question. I have asked it in a private discussion with a fundamentalist who cowardly ignored the whole premise of the thought and am hoping there is someone here who can address it.

I am aware of the fact that abortion is one hot button topic. It is not my intention to make this a debate about abortion. As far as I know "believers" tend to be strongly against abortion. They consider it the very worst of crimes taking the life of an innocent with no voice of it's own. Ok that view is established.

My question is that when God ordered the slaughter of entire races (apparently very *bad* people who deserved it by all accounts I've had explained) by "his people" I don't read anything about those women who are with child to be spared. Nowhere do I see anything about "kill everyone but those with child should be spared until the innocent child in the womb is born, then you can eliminate the wicked mother" or anything like that.

Today a person who is a Right to Lifer thinks any and all babies are innocents and should be spared no matter what the faith of the parents. They would fight to save the baby of Muslim, Atheist, or any other faith/un-faith. Would this not apply a few millenia ago? Weren't unborn children innocent in 500 bc as they are today?

Does this not make God a practicing (and highly successful I might add) abortionist?

Just a thought for the day.

Regards,
Julie

Pathofthorns

I think your comparison is a bit of a stretch but it does make a point.

I haven't heard of any explanations from believers that make any sense as to why their "loving God" has acted so violently and cruelly in the past.

When such verses were discussed at venues such as the theocratic ministry school bible readings or highlights parts, I know many were uncomfortable with them and the tendancy was to gloss over those particular verses with simplified statements.

I just personally think the debate is rather old. I'm tired of being preached to or others trying to legislate what I believe. Let everyone believe what they want in their own homes, and if there is a god and he judges me unworthy, then we'll find out what happens then.

Path

Seeker

That's an interesting point, Julie, and one that never occured to me. Of course pregnant women were slaughtered back then under God's orders. After all, they weren't virgins, that's for sure. So it would stand to reason that God was ordering the death of their unborn children. Hmmm....an interesting twist to this usual conundrum.

Julie

Hi Pathofhorns,

:I think your comparison is a bit of a stretch but it does make a point.

I can see how, out-of-the-blue, this may seem the case but in the discussions that were going on it was within context.

:I just personally think the debate is rather old. I'm tired of being preached to or others trying to legislate what I believe. Let everyone believe what they want in their own homes, and if there is a god and he judges me unworthy, then we'll find out what happens then.

It is old and tired. I agree wholeheartedly with you on everyone beling left to live their lives. Religion has no place in legislation. It's been tried (Taliban being our latest example--religion law of land) and we know what a failure that was.

I just wondered if there were any possible explanations regarding this blatant disregard for loss of innocent life at the hands of God's people. It was ok then but not now? How does a believer reconcile this?

Seeker,

This thought just occured to me during somewhat heated discussion involving a merciful God ordering/condoning genecide and the topic of abortion (the latter couldn't be left alone by other correspondent).

Glad you found it interesting. What say you that we attend a Right to Life convention and go around asking people about it?

Warm regards,
Julie

Seeker

What say you that we attend a Right to Life convention and go around asking people about it?

The Right-to-Lifers would kill us...

mommy

I agree Seeker, I never thought of this either. Of course the very reason god ordered the death of so many is completly asinine to think of as well. But christians have no problem with him doing that. I suspect the answer you will recieve will be along the lines of...if someone lived X million more than you...etc Of course I would love to see someone's defense of the mass abortions.

BTW The abortion protesters just won a battle here. They are very excited that they can now go within 50 feet(I believe) of the entrance to the clinic. They are within earshot of those inside. I wish I had the stamina to go and protest the protesters. It makes me ill to think that they can blatanly push their views on those who have already made a choice. I have mentioned this before, but could you imagine if we went and picketed the poll booths with signs saying, woman are not worthy of voting?

I think the saddest thing is that that they are not showing love, but in their mind they think they are.
wendy

When I leave, you will know I have been here

willy_think

hi Julie,

to my mind, when the jews killed off all the people of an area it was for the same reason that thay stayed in the desert for 40 years. that was to break the people of Isreal form there habit of going back to the worship of forein gods. with a nation destroyed a culture is destroyed and the knowledge of there gods with them. in this way isreal could never be absorbed into another culture and the people would have no other god in there kingdom to stumble them.

the reason to me that it was good for the jews to kill who thay did, was god told them to. that would be the same reason that would make abortion good, if we had been told to do it by god. but we have not.
Jesus in fulfillment of the law gave us New Commandments or New law of love. abortion is, to my mind, a violation of that law and against all that jesus taught us. if god said kill then kill if he said love then love. to kill for conveince....that is beyond my understanding.
Billy

25ashitaka25

I have no feeling one way or the other about abortion, but the killings in the old test. have always been a problem with me. He was a God of Love...to his own people alone. But, I always thought how he said he would have saved Sodom if even one man was good, but how he killed possibly thousands of good people in Caanan. It just doesn't match up.

Julie's point about the fundies not recognizing the blood spilled in the name of God, written down in their holiest books,(whatever holy books those may be) is very true. The old test is filled with it, and perhaps that's why a lot of violent fundies bomb clinics and such.

Again, I don't care one way or the other, but Julie had a couple of interesting things, there.

ashi

SixofNine

Interesting question, but I doubt it would have much impact on an anti-abortionist. They are in the habit of comparing abortion of a fetus to killing a new-born baby. An argument not totally w/o merit.

Obviously, an anti-abortionist has figured out how to rationalize God's killing of babies, ie: Willy think's post above, or is in active denial about God's killing of babies, ie, me when I was a witness.

I can think of an example much closer to the heart of the abortion debate, but since this discussion is not about that, I won't go there.

Naeblis

Hosea 13:16
Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up.

God ordered abortions?

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