by John Doe 26 Replies latest jw friends

  • still_in74

    the odd cigar but not cigarettes. Yuk. Even if I get a bad cigar (not much taste) i ditch it cause it will just taste like a cigerette. i cant stand that taste.

    BUT - the double standards imposed by the WTS has never been more apparent than with smoking. You cant smoke cause it causes cancer, its not like alcohol that is digested and has a purpose.
    well excuse me but aspartame causes cancer. So why is diet soda banned? Chewing gum is not digested and serves no purpose and may even cause cancer if its sugar-free gum so why isnt it banned?

    Oh well diet soda is ok if its consumed modestly. You need to drink a lot of aspartame according to studies. - oh really? well what about one cigerette a month? That seems rather balanced and harmless. Maybe one cigar, why you dont even inhale cigars!



    What about pipes and cigars? Though the tobacco industry has long promoted pipes and cigars as status symbols, the smoke they deliver is just as deadly as that from cigarettes. Even if smokers don’t inhale cigar or pipe smoke, they have an increased risk of developing lip, mouth, and tongue cancers.

    Is smokeless tobacco safe? This comes in two different forms: snuff and chewing tobacco. Snuff is a powdered tobacco, usually sold in cans or pouches. Often, users place it inside the lower lip or cheek. Chewing tobacco is sold in long strands, usually in a pouch. As the name suggests, it is chewed, not sucked. Snuff and chewing tobacco both cause bad breath, stained teeth, cancer of the mouth and pharynx, addiction to nicotine, white sores in the mouth that can lead to cancer, peeling back of the gums, and bone loss around the teeth. Clearly, sucking or chewing tobacco is not a wise alternative to smoking it.

    hmmmm..... so then I assume you have done your research on this since you didnt include any references to support any of your statements here.
    But basically anything that is known to cause any form of cancer is the same as smoking then? After all one has "increased risk" of lip, mouth & tongue cancer if they smoke but dont inhale. Yet an aspartame addict has an "increased risk" of any cancer. A regular sun-tanner has "increased risk" to skin cancer.

    So can one be DF'd for performing these cancer risk increasing activities? Even one diet soda could technically increase ones risk of cancer right? but if diet soda is ok in moderation why arent cigerettes?

    Oh but nicotine is an addictive drug ! - oh really? then coffee and cola should be banned too then right? after all caffiene is an addictive drug !

    "oh no, well uhm... i guess but.... uh..... (scratches head) uhm.... why are you being this way? whats your problem? You sound like an apostate!"

    The above would likely be a response to reasonable logic. This is what JW's do. If you dont agree with everything they or the WTS say without any disagreement then you are a "bad person" and you dont love Jehovah because you arent humble. Oh and how about that comment about bad breath and stained teeth? PRICELESS! So I guess garlic is out of the question and mexican food. Ever eaten that and not grabbed a piece of sugar-free mint gum to cover that?! Hell coffee contains an addictive drug AND stains your teeth.

    This is the ultimate double standard....

  • still_in74

    In large amounts, and especially over extended periods of time, caffeine can lead to a condition known as caffeinism. [74] [75] Caffeinism usually combines caffeine dependency with a wide range of unpleasant physical and mental conditions including nervousness, irritability, anxiety, tremulousness, muscle twitching (hyperreflexia), insomnia, headaches, respiratory alkalosis [76] and heart palpitations. [77] Furthermore, because caffeine increases the production of stomach acid, high usage over time can lead to peptic ulcers, erosive esophagitis, and gastroesophageal reflux disease. [78]

    There are four caffeine-induced psychiatric disorders recognized by the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fourth Edition: caffeine intoxication, caffeine-induced anxiety disorder, caffeine-induced sleep disorder, and caffeine-related disorder not otherwise specified (NOS).

    [edit] Caffeine intoxication

    An acute overdose of caffeine, usually in excess of about 300 milligrams, dependent on body weight and level of caffeine tolerance, can result in a state of central nervous system over-stimulation called caffeine intoxication, [79] colloquially "caffeine jitters". The symptoms of caffeine intoxication are not unlike overdoses of other stimulants. It may include restlessness, nervousness, excitement, insomnia, flushing of the face, increased urination, gastrointestinal disturbance, muscle twitching, a rambling flow of thought and speech, irritability, irregular or rapid heart beat, and psychomotor agitation. [77] In cases of much larger overdoses mania, depression, lapses in judgment, disorientation, disinhibition, delusions, hallucinations, psychosis, rhabdomyolysis, and death may occur. [80] [81]

    In cases of extreme overdose, death can result. The median lethal dose (LD 50) given orally, is 192 milligrams per kilogram in rats. [1] The LD 50 of caffeine in humans is dependent on weight and individual sensitivity and estimated to be about 150 to 200 milligrams per kilogram of body mass, roughly 80 to 100 cups of coffee for an average adult taken within a limited time frame that is dependent on half-life. Though achieving lethal dose with caffeine would be exceptionally difficult with regular coffee, there have been reported deaths from overdosing on caffeine pills, with serious symptoms of overdose requiring hospitalization occurring from as little as 2 grams of caffeine. [82] [83] [84] [85] Death typically occurs due to ventricular fibrillation brought about by effects of caffeine on the cardiovascular system.

    Treatment of severe caffeine intoxication is generally supportive, providing treatment of the immediate symptoms, but if the patient has very high serum levels of caffeine then peritoneal dialysis, hemodialysis, or hemofiltration may be required.

    [edit] Anxiety and sleep disorders

    Two infrequently diagnosed caffeine-induced disorders that are recognized by the American Psychiatric Association (APA) are caffeine-induced sleep disorder and caffeine-induced anxiety disorder, which can result from long-term excessive caffeine intake.

    In the case of caffeine-induced sleep disorder, an individual regularly ingests high doses of caffeine sufficient to induce a significant disturbance in his or her sleep, sufficiently severe to warrant clinical attention. [79] A study in the British Journal of Addiction concluded that caffeinism, although infrequently diagnosed, may afflict as many as one person in ten of the population. [75]

    [edit] Caffeine intake during pregnancy

    The Food Standards Agency has recommended that pregnant women should limit their caffeine intake to less than 300 mg of caffeine a day – the equivalent of four cups of coffee a day. A higher intake may be associated with miscarriage. [95] [96]

    Dr De-Kun Li of Kaiser Permanente Division of Research, which appears in the American Journal of Obstetrics and Gynecology, concludes that an intake of 200 milligrams or more per day, representing two or more cups, "significantly increases the risk of miscarriage". [97] However, Dr. David Savitz, a professor in community and preventive medicine at New York's Mount Sinai School of Medicine and lead author of the other new study on the subject published in the January issue of Epidemiology, found no link between miscarriage and caffeine consumption. [6]

    NICOTINE - Toxicology

    The LD 50 of nicotine is 50 mg/kg for ratsand 3 mg/kg for mice. 40–60 mg (0.5-1.0 mg/kg) can be a lethal dosage for adult humans. [19] [20] This designates nicotine as an extremely deadly poison. It is more toxic than many other alkaloids such as cocaine, which has an LD 50 of 95.1 mg/kg when administered to mice. Spilling a sufficient concentration of nicotine onto the skin can result in poisoning or even death since Nicotine readily passes into the bloodstream from dermal contact. [21]

    The carcinogenic properties of nicotine in standalone form, separate from tobacco smoke, have not been evaluated by the IARC, and it has not been assigned to an official carcinogen group. The currently available literature indicates that nicotine, on its own, does not promote the development of cancer in healthy tissue and has no mutagenic properties. Its teratogenic properties have not yet been adequately researched, and while the likelihood of birth defects caused by nicotine is believed to be very small or nonexistent, nicotine replacement product manufacturers recommend consultation with a physician before using a nicotine patch or nicotine gum while pregnant or nursing. However, nicotine and the increased cholinergic activity it causes have been shown to impede apoptosis [citation needed] , which is one of the methods by which the body destroys unwanted cells (programmed cell death). Since apoptosis helps to remove mutated or damaged cells that may eventually become cancerous, the inhibitory actions of nicotine may create a more favourable environment for cancer to develop, though this also remains to be proven.

    So admitedly nicotine is more toxic than caffeine when consumed however nicotine itself does not cause cancer. Yet nicotine is detoxified in the liver by the cytochrome p450 - it is toxic when exceeding the amoutn of .5 - 1 mg/kg of body wieght. For the average person this is 40-60 mg. at 1.89 mg per cig will smoking 20-30 cigs in a row kill you? Obviously we all knw the 2 pack a day smokers so the nicotine is being broken down quickly by the liver.

    So how is it the WTS says chewing tobacco increased cancer risk when nicotine itself has not been proven to do so. Yet aspartame is used to induce cancer in lab rats!!!

  • DoomVoyager

    Public perception is that smoking is a dirty habit, so in order to put out a good image, the Washtowel corporate cult bans smoking. No other reason. Drinking coffee and suntanning have no negative stigma attached, so they're OK. So much for not letting the world dictate your actions.

  • Homerovah the Almighty
    Homerovah the Almighty

    Since smoking and other habits are baned primarily for the sake of public image, the only other habit that they are allowed is alcohol

    and thats why you see a lot of alcoholism within the rank and file.......shame really

  • NewYork44M

    Never have and never will.

  • Dagney

    still in,

    Had this arguement recently with a JW. I "came out" with my raaare smoking activities, but told them I relished the freedom to do it if I wanted. This person is just adamant about smoking being "unclean and a defilement." I said if the society wants to ban their adherents from smoking as one of their membership rules, I understand that. But to quote scripture written 2,500 years ago and then pick and choose one "drug" and ignore 100 others, I'm not buying that.

    This person is a 1970's convert. They led exactly the free life, including all activities that come with being a young adult not under a mind control organization, prior to conversion. I'm sure they look at me as losing any "wisdom" I gained from the all wise FDS. I look at them and think, "how can you be so stooopid as to listen to the FDS? Oh yeah, you pick and choose what you want to believe and enforce on others."


  • Quirky1

    I know it's bad but since leaving the JW's and the turmoil I received or should I say still receive at home I smoke a few cigs a day. Not much, about a pack a week. I'll drop it again once the stress subsides. Before my JW time I was a cigar lover and prior to that I smoked cigarrettes.

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