Sciptures? Help???

by lostsheep82 20 Replies latest jw friends

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  lostsheep82

  So, I need some help. I know this subject is touchy, and I dont want to stir feathers.....but with my most recent convo with my mom and her "anointed" husband, they dont have as much of a problem with me discrediting the society as I do, as they do with the fact that I'm gay. As he puts it....ignore the society and what they teach....go to the bible...so I asked him what about David and Jonathans relationship, how can you prove they didnt have a sexual love for eachother and he says...'Amanda, do you think they were bum holing eachother?'. Well when you put it that way I dont know, but that has nothing to do with the fact that most gay relationships have nothing to do with the actual act of sex, they have to do with the love two people share, cause they can't share it with someone else.

  His response was simpathetic, and cause of my abusive past, that is what they blame it on........if i wasnt abused i wouldnt be gay. in response i said i wouldnt be abused had the elders let my mom leave the bastard. and then oh well your mom was vulnerable. YEAH I EFFIN KNOW. BUT, she was 26. i understand why my mom stayed. that has nothing to do with the fact that I"M GAY!!!!!

  So he made me this deal. I can send them anything about the society and i can have a problem with it, however now they are wanting me to prove in my right conscience from ANY bible that says gays are ok. i said i didnt think i could, because well for one....maybe it is wrong. for two THAT WASN'T MY POINT. my point was that i felt i didnt want to follow a man made religion, and they seemed fine with it. His reasoning was that if i didnt want to be a JW, that was ok, but prove that what you are doing is RIGHT.

  u know what...i cant.

  in my heart of hearts...i dont feel i am doing anything wrong. i feel Jehovah(and i'll always call him that) loves me no matter what. IF me being gay and my wife being gay has to do with the fact we were beaten and raped my men before we were 10......so be it. But how can Jehovah blame us for how we feel.

  I told my mom i never felt "normal" when i was with a guy, and beleive me i became a bit of a premiscousious person trying to make it feel 'right'. DIDNT WORK!!!!

  My question and I ask for help....is there any way of defending myself in any way as to the fact that i feel Jehovah still loves me even though I'm wiht a woman. and that I don't feel i'll die at armageddon because i'm gay....

  I'm so effed up now i dont even know......
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  SixofNine

  'Amanda, do you think they were bum holing eachother?'. Well when you put it that way I dont know, but that has nothing to do with the fact that most gay relationships have nothing to do with the actual act of sex, they have to do with the love two people share, cause they can't share it with someone else.

  The answer is "yes". If they were indeed gay, then they were having sex together. No need to shy away from that just because your father wants to pretend it is shocking (hint for dad: it's not). Tell your father that (X) % of women enjoy being "bumholed". Maybe even mom. Steal the shock from him.

  Scientifically, biologically, this is a winning argument if you keep it to just sex. I don't think your dad really cares who wants to be best.friends.forever. He cares about who is having sex with people of the same sex. Gay sex is common in animals, and it's common in humans. It's the way God made many people and animals, if indeed there is a God.
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  megsmomma

  I don't have any scriptures for you, but I wanted to just say I think Jehovah God knows our hearts and knows more about how we are made and work than we could ever know....and if you are gay, or love someone who is the same sex as you....I am sure he understands why....and you are no better or worse than anyone who loves someone opposite their sex. If I, as an imperfect human can have understanding and compassion for someone in your situation....then a loving God would have soooo much more.

  The Bible has so much in it that is not literal, and so much is lost in translation.....the basics I learn from the Bible are if you love people and respect people...your life will be happier than if you don't.

  One other hard lesson in life is figuring out how to VALIDATE yourself. You don't need to worry about what anyone else thinks or says (especially your parents) You just do what you think is right....and be okay with that. It takes time and practice to get good at doing this, but you will be so glad when you don't need anyone else's approval in your life. Respect yourself and don't allow others to treat you without respect.

  Hang in there.......I wish you all the best :)
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  lostsheep82

  Please no one think i'm in support of what happened at 9-11. i was simply trying to make a point.

  if JW's think they are right, and those flying the plane were willin to lose their lives......the same as JWs who lose thier lives cause of blood transfusions.........who are we as lowly humans to judge.

  I truly have the worst opinions of those who flew those dam effin planes. but it isnt up to ME to judge. Only God and Jesus.

  Pleas no on take what i said out of turn. it breaks my heart of the tradegy of what happend and i only wanted to make a point.

  thank you,
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  jamiebowers

  More and more, scientific evidence is pointing to physiological reasons for homosexuality. You may want to share some recent articles on that subject with your stepfather. As far as the Scriptures are concerned, I don't recall Jesus ever having anything negative to say about homosexuality. The Apostle Paul, on the other hand, had a lot to say. Some Bible scholars question his relationship with Timothy. Anyway, my question about Paul's stance against homosexuality always has been about the people to which he was speaking. Most were of Greek descent. Ancient Greek society permitted masters of trade to train youngsters both vocationally and sexually. Is it possible that Paul was speaking more to child molestation than homosexuality?

  Another note about Paul; he spoke against other "sins" as well, like adultery, fornication, idolatry, etc. Can you think of one person on this earth who has not engaged in such acts in some form? It seems to me that religion and society would be just as concerned about those, but they really harp on the gay thing.

  IMHO, I think you should provide your stepfather with the abundant information on the child molesters within the WTB&TS and tell him to concentrate his efforts on cleaning up the organization to which he belongs instead of butting into your personal life. If being gay is a sin, which I seriously doubt, it can't be near as bad as molesting a child. Those type of accusations have been made about jws from the rank and file all the way up to at least one member of the governing body.
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  2112

  I don't have any scriptures for you but that is not your only recource. First I wonder what your father would say if you did "Prove that what you were doing was not wrong". Would he accept it, if he did they he would have a problem with the WT. Would he be ready for that?

  How long do you think he is going to be ok with your disagreements/problems with the WT? Could it be thet he is so confident in the WT and his anointing they he can answer all your doubts and get you to come back? I'm sure your parents love you very much so cherrish that.

  I'm not sure where it is or the exact wording but the bible does mention something about if you violate your own conscience that is a sin. Maybe someone can help find that scripture. If it is found then you could tell your folks that it would violate you conscience to hide your true feelings about your lifestyle.

  Hope it all resolves itself and you ens up happy!
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  lostsheep82

  I did actually say that my conscience would bother me going door to door, NOT becuause that's what Jesus did(or did he?), but because I wouldn't be preaching the words fo Christ, i'd be preaching the words of Jehovah's Witnessed. Their answer to EVERTHING is tat when they were praying and unsure of everything, JW's ALWAYS came to their door. That MUST be God's direction!!!
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  5thGeneration

  1 Corinthians 4 (New International Version)

  Apostles of Christ

  2 Now it is required that those who have been given a trust must prove faithful. 3 I care very little if I am judged by you or by any human court; indeed, I do not even judge myself. 4 My conscience is clear, but that does not make me innocent. It is the Lord who judges me.
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  jwfacts

  You are not going to be able to prove to your parents from the Bible that being gay is acceptable. I once found an article trying to show that the Bible does not condemn homosexuality which made some good points, but you need to accept that a JW does not believe the Bible, they believe what the Watchtower tells them is in the Bible.

  There comes a time when you need to make a stand for yourself; a person is not supposed to go through life living for others approval, otherwise you will never find peace and happiness. An interesting book is from Joseph Campbell, The Hero with A Thousand Faces. This tracks the similarity of the myths through all Holy Books and cultures. One strong message is that the "hero" at some point needs to break away from their parents shadow and forge a life for themselves. I read that book at 35 and finally realised way too late that I had wasted too much of my life miserable at being not good enough for my parents and not being true to myself. It hasn't helped my relationship with my parents but at least I feel such a weight off my shoulders.

  if i wasnt abused i wouldnt be gay

  So basically your father is suggesting that abuse shaped your personality and for the evil of someone else you deserve to die at Armageddon. Whether the Bible accepts homosexuality or not, it is proven that people are born gay. To classify it as wrong and worthy of eternal damnation paints a very cruel God.
• 

  yknot

  it is proven that people are born gay.

  While I am not going to dispute Paul's comments..... I do wanna add some insight to your family's thinking....

  My sister swore up and down she was a lesbian...... we grew up with a lot of abuse, and she was very sensitive to male domination and rejection... but drawn of course to men who regurgitated the abuse also for her teen years..... so in her early adult years for a long while she was a lesbian.....then about 3 year ago .... she began to be a 'hasbian'...... now she is unofficially 'Vegas Bi"....... but stories of women (can't say men, cuz I haven't heard of any) that go through sexual phases in the course of their personal healing and self reclamation from abuse tend to be the source of JW ideas.

  They are fearful of what they do not fully understand....... also another thing to keep in mind... society has changed a great deal.... just look at one of the most popular songs of the summer..... Katy Perry's "I kissed a girl'......bi curiousity in women is strongly being promoted.

  You are you now matter what path you find yourself on the journey of life. ......

  Second set of HUGS