confession (page 3)

joelbear

The problem is that Santa mythology conflicts with JW mythology and people don't like to have their mythology tampered with.

Joel

Mulan

Thank you, everyone, for the great comments. I knew you would all come through for me. Not one negative.........that is so great!!

Joel, you did it best! I was trying to think of an example of how witness parents let their kids believe in fantasy people, and Disney characters is the best!! For my boys, it was Ronald McDonald!

When my eldest son was about 3, we were at a small mall, at Christmas time, and went past the place where kids were getting their pictures taken with Santa. The Santa didn't have any kids behind the fence yet, and came out to talk to Randy, who immediately started screaming, and saying "that Christmas man is going to get me." I was mortified, but also felt pretty good, that my little boy was being loyal to Jehovah. But then, he also thought the Big Dragon, from the old Paradise book, lived in all the churches, so I wasn't too bright, was I, to let him believe that???

Seeker4, I love the story about your granddaughter. That is what my parents told me too, not that there was no Santa, but that he wasn't coming to our house anymore. Sad.

Marilyn (a.k.a. Mulan)

Princess

Mulan and I are off to the mall to visit with Santa today. I'll ask him if he is real and will let y'all know what he says. I suppose we could even post a picture and you can judge for yourself!

Princess

ballistic

I used to know a compulsive liar and I often wondered whether this kind of thing is caused by up-bringing. (this guy was pathological and couldn't give a straight answer to whether he had just turned left or right.)
Has anyone seen any studies on it? I suppose it comes down to balance like many things. I don't have kids, but if I did, I think I would like them to have the Santa I didn't. There are those parents, however, who seem to have a lie stashed away for everything from how they were born to where we go when we die.
Must be bloody confusing to be a kid!

Andee

I have something else to add.

Born into the JW's, as a young child, it was always made very clear to me that there was NO Santa Claus. I remember feeling rather smug during holiday time when all my school chums were anticipating his visit, while I KNEW is was just their ole Mom and Dad wrapping presents and putting them under the tree themselves. I know now, that my smugness was to cover up my envy. Geez, I gave Jehovah another reason to incinerate me!

Anyway, after reading all the responses on this thread, the absurdity of how JW's justify why it's so superior of them to teach their children that Santa Claus doesn't exist.

From a JW perspective:

Believe in demonized Smurfs.

Believe in demonized garage sale items.

Believe when someone does something bad, it's
because they listen to Satan. Careful of him,
he's that evil vapor that is always attempting to lead
people astray.

Believe that dragons reside in churches.

However!!! Make sure that they don't believe in Santa
Claus! He's a nice guy! Wouldn't want to corrupt my
kid with THAT belief!

I'm so grateful my kids don't have to deal with all that nonsense.

Andee

Yerusalyim

I told my kids early on (probably age 4 or 5) about the Santa Saint Nicholas connection (we now celebrate the Feast of St Nick on 6 December). They seemed none the worse for knowing it was me buying the presents, and it was still fun for them to go visit SANTA.

YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]

SEAKEN2001

My take is this:

You might as well let the child decide for himself/herself what to "believe" with regard to fantasy/mystery. This will prepare them for the inevitable. They are going to face lies and liars many times in their life. The sooner they learn to distinguish a lie from reality the better. And it's not really that Santa or the Easter Bunny are lies to children, they are fantasy, or pictorial of some mystery of life. Who can explain to a child the concept of charitable giving or sacrafice and not wrap it in some mysterious illustration to make it easier for a childs mind to grasp. The same holds for God and Satan and Demons. Forcing your kids to believe is fruitless. Let them work it for themselves and you will be teaching them to think critically and allowing them to use their own imagination.

I wouldn't recommend any one treatment of the Santa or God issues. Each child is an individual and needs to be respected as an independant thinker. True, as little ones they have less knowledge and are liable to believe in things that are unreal and rediculous from the standpoint of someone older. At some point in their life the timing will be right for them to dispell the illusion and swallow some more reality. That will keep happening all their lives until eventually they get used to digesting the mystery of life for themsleves rather than leaning on the opinions of others.

For some kids Santa will be real for a time. For others he will not. For some Christmas will have a meaning and will compell them to act in some way in the spirit they percieve to be behind the Christmas tradition. Some will never understand even the spirit of Christmas and refuse to participate in what they see as a "lie" and forced behavior. The same can be said about God in our tradition. Kids will ultimately believe what their own experiences have shaped them to believe. What we believe in really does not change the reality of things does it? But it does affect how we live and how we treat other people. So, I would say it's important to explore the mind and personality of your own children and help them work through the mystery without telling them what to believe. Then support their ideas as long a they are making good decisions. Direct them as needed to correct obvious blunders that could end up hurting themsleves or others. But allow for fantasy and imagination as a tool for building the psyche of the young child in preparation for adult life where they will most certainly need the skill to sort out fantasy from reality.

Too much psycho-babble right? All this to say let the kids decide as you help them learn how to use their own brain. Don't ever lie to them but allow room for fantasy and help them learn to distinguish the difference.

Sean

Andee

My kids know that I go out and buy presents. My daughter is old enough now, that she does her own shopping too.

However, there is always ONE special present under the tree, for each kid, from "Santa.

Princess,

My daughter also threw the big question to me a couple of years ago.
Is there really a Santa Claus? I didn't want to lie either. I did the same thing you did, I responded with "What do you think"? She said she believe there was, and I just sort of nodded my head in agreement. This year, she announced to me that she still believes.

Andee

Princess

Maybe I should get Mulan to pose with Santa too. It's time.

Princess

Seeker

What a fascinating thread! I'm glad to read all the other responses on here, but to be perfectly honest, I think I'll stick with my original thought: I would not teach a child of mine about Santa. To me, it's lying to your child. To others in this thread, it's "fantasy" not lies. OK, I can kinda see where you are going with it. But I had a rich fantasy life, none of which was based on my parents telling me something that turned out not to be true.

I didn't envy the other kids believing in Santa. Made no difference to me where my presents came from. My fantasy life was richly developed anyway. I learned that life is full of lies anyway. Didn't seem to hurt me, other than perhaps making me think I would do as my parents did, which some of you may view as a hurtful thing. I dunno.

But in any case, it was very interesting to read different perspectives.

confession

Share this