KISS-OFF letter to me from an old JW friend I recently saw again

by Terry 43 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  myelaine

  dear Quentin...

  Here's my 2 cents again...I think Terry used her "confidence" as a platform for his rant against the WBTS machine...and EVERYONE inclined was included in the analysis...and encouraged to give their two cents.

  He's done it with his "good friend" Johnny in the past...I was even interested in how that was going to unfold until, early on, I saw that it was going nowhere but Terry continued to throw out his conversations as fodder periodically....and for what purpose? to expound on, yet again, how controlled and blind to the real circumstances of the situation Johnny is...and blah, blah, blah...

  Now YOU may defend his actions as much as you want but the fact remains...Terry has held up specific "friends" as examples of the rampant ignorance contained within the walls of the WBTS.

  Terry said this:

  "She spoke for herself. I spoke for myself. The reader can judge."...you tell me if Pamela thought for a moment that the "reader" would be the biggest EXJW community on the internet...just guessing here, but,I'm guessing, NO...and Terry would have been the very last person she would have spoken to about anything.

  love michelle
• 

  Quentin

  you tell me if Pamela thought for a moment that the "reader" would be the biggest EXJW community on the internet...just guessing here, but,I'm guessing, NO...and Terry would have been the very last person she would have spoken to about anything.

  Your guess is wrong...Pam would not give one flip what Terry said to who...and no, he would not be the last person she would have spoken to about anything...in fact she would wear it as a badge of honor knowing, in her mind at least, she duked it out with apostates...

  There has been no "betrayal of friends" here, as you insist...that is of course your 2% which you have made clear as a bell...

  As to Terry, he doesn't need me to defend him...reason I commented to your post is because I know these folks myself...that's all...I'm done here...
• 

  Terry

  Jehovah's Witnesses are not a "live and let live" people.

  No.

  They intrude into the lives of others both in knocking doors and in meddling in each other's private business.

  Pamela and I had a long history going back to High School times circa 1965.

  You can't be expected to know that, certainly. But, Quentin knows her well also. We all went to the same Kingdom Hall.

  I don't hesitate to use either Pamela or Johnny to illustrate the lunacy of remaining a JW in good standing.

  Why?

  For one thing, any active JW crosses the line when they engage in conversation, discussion rebuttal or casual banter with an avowed Apostate. They are just asking for it. So, I say, "Fair Game."

  I don't abuse any kindess they pretend to send my way. But, I do make very clear where I stand when THEY bring up the subject of religion.

  Pamela started the ball rolling by making a declarative statement about me to the effect that I had "..given up on hope."

  Where does she get off making that judgement about me without having seen me in 30+ years?

  I rebutted.

  She asked me what I believe now. I answered.

  She invited my participation and engaged me in elicting my comment through her seeming curiousity.

  I did not give her a shotgun blast to the forehead in my reply. I was RESTRAINED and cordial, I believe.

  What irked me was this.

  Neither Pamela nor my former best friend, Johnny, apparently care enough about me or love me to the extent they would even TRY TO HELP ME (by "help" I mean minister to me to rescue me from my fate as Armageddon fodder.) They dismiss me with an airy wave of the hand.

  sJehovah's Witnesses don't actually form REAL relationships with anybody; family or otherwise. Theirs is no bond of love.

  Love NEVER fails.

  So, I reprint my conversations with these people to clearly demonstrate their UTTER LACK OF CHRISTIAN LOVE. Why?

  It is the IDENTIFYING MARK OF TRUE CHRISTIANITY.

  I have no hesitation to reveal this aspect of their personality.

  I could only "betray" these persons if they were actual friends. These people won't even pray for me. They disdain me, my life, my choices and turn a blind eye to any human emotion connected with our past.

  I raised the red flag up front by mentioning my connection with FreeMinds and I labelled myself correctly. There was no duplicity.

  Remember, she made it absolutely crystal clear she does not even want to be friends.

  I stand by my use of her correspondence.
• 

  journey-on

  Terry,

  I have read all these posts, and I have to agree with you. You did nothing wrong. People need to know that JWs don't (and quite possibly cannot) feel real authentic love.

  They gloss over REAL LOVE with words of self-righteous piety for some religious description and never see the depths love should go to.

  Jehovah's Witnesses don't actually form REAL relationships with anybody; family or otherwise. Their is no bond of love.

  When I read your above statement, I had to totally agree that JWs do not form REAL relationships with family from a deep bond of pure LOVE.

  I'm speaking from personal experience with my JW sister. We talk of mundane things (when we talk). Conversation is similar to speaking to a friend.

  She NEVER tries to understand me as a person or delve into why I feel the way I do. She simply is not interested in ME as any sort of person worth

  knowing on a deep level based in pure love. She simply stays "in touch" but never wonders about what is in my heart, mind, or soul and why I have

  the feelings I have. She really doesn't even KNOW me. I have to endure her talk of the latest Circuit Overseer's visit, or the upcoming assembly, or other

  stuff about the borg, but she never asks me about ME or what I think and feel about anything. They lack natural affection.
• 

  Open mind

  If Pamela had enough moments of clarity to:

  1. prompt her to visit this site and

  2. stumble across her letter to Terry,

  hopefully she would:

  1. Try to come to terms with the crushing reality of having wasted decades on a high-control, unloving religion

  2. Humbly apologize to Terry for treating him like bird food all these years and hope he forgives her.

  3. Agree with Terry's use of her "private" e-mail to help others wake up and smell the Brooklyn Brew.
  

  Terry hasn't done anything hurtful to Pamela. In the unlikely event her elders found out about her correspondence with Terry, they'd say "Don't do that", she'd say "OK, I'm sorry" and that would be the end of it.

  My $.02.

  And thank you to Terry for your continued efforts at helping newcomers to use their gray matter.

  OM
• 

  isaacaustin

  Open
• 

  isaacaustin

  Open Mind,

  I couldn't have said it better myself.

  Pamela in know way confided anything in Terry. And further, she tried to make it look like it is completely her decsion to shun him and that the org has nothing to do with it. We all know that is false. Terry did not use her info to turn her in. And if an elder or other JW comes here to find this correspondence to turn her in, the question would also come up as to what they were doing here.
• 

  Terry

  After another hour's reflection I have to add this.

  What really HURTS, bigtime, is the realization that these "christians" don't CARE enough to risk a Q&A that would help them determine

  exactly what "my problem" is and try to help me with it.

  They are turned inward. They are covering their asses and damn the rest.

  That's hurtful and it pisses me off. I'D NEVER TREAT THEM THAT WAY.

  My attitude has always been to engage.

  When you engage you open a channel of communication that makes things possible.

  And that is the rub for them.

  They have a deep and abiding fear that THEY WILL RISK discovering too much information for them to remain deluded!

  It is too risky to stand face to face with something you can't wish away!

  All I ever ask of anybody is that they give me enough thoughtful discourse that my mind will open to them. I WANT TO BE PERSUADED that I am wrong.

  Why wouldn't I?

  I'd rather there be a God in heaven and that I already know his name and what he is about. It would be far simpler to just jump back in to the stream and swim like I was trained to swim with that familiar current.

  But, I can't and won't. Why?

  I've seen too much intellectual dishonesty to trust them with the remaining years of my life!

  Fool me once; shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

  I'm WILLING to be WRONG.

  Jehovah's Witnesses aren't.
• 

  Open mind

  Terry:

  these "christians" don't CARE enough to risk a Q&A that would help them determine exactly what "my problem" is and try to help me with it.

  Some care a lot, others a little and many not a whit.

  But no matter how much they "care" about you, "fear" wins out. Also, the greater "love" for their Creator, trumps any love for a human.

  Can't touch this. It's perfect.

  OM
• 

  journey-on

  What really HURTS, bigtime, is the realization that these "christians" don't CARE enough to risk a Q&A that would help them determine

  exactly what "my problem" is and try to help me with it.

  Any pain they think they may cause us, is shoved under the rug. It helps them not worry or think about

  the hurt they inflict on us by their actions and inactions, because they live day to day "knowing" that in the

  New System, any little twinge of pain and suffering they may have inflicted will be removed and the memory of it will be taken away.

  Therefore, why reach out to you. Why risk discomfort and emotional stress trying to help and bring comfort and understanding to an

  old friend....or any friend, for that matter.

  They push it under where it can't be seen or felt, and happily go about their lives never giving it a second thought what this does to real people

  with real hearts and real concerns, finding some comfort in thinking Jehovah will take care of everything in due time.