Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 4-6-08 WT Study (Missionary)

by blondie 20 Replies latest jw friends

  • blondie
    blondie

    Comments You Will Not Hear at the 04-06-08 WT Study (February 15, 2008, pages 12-16)(JESUS MISSIONARY)Review comments will be in redWT material from today's WT will be in black
    Quotes from other sources will be in quotes boxes
    w = Watchtower
    g = Awake
    jv = Proclaimers book

    Bible translations www.biblegateway.com/cgi-bin/bible
    WT publications www.strictlygenteel.co.uk
    WT child abuse www.silentlambs.org
    Blood issue www.ajwrb.org
    United Nations http://www.randytv.com/secret/unitednations.htm

    JESUS CHRIST---THE GREATEST MISSIONARY

    "I am a representative from him, and that One sent me forth."--John 7:29

    Opening Comments

    The rank and file are slowing down, in effectiveness, door to door. It is easy to fake the hours but not the results. Salesman work on commission and have to sell to make more money. Some only make a profit from what they sell. Whether a jw brings in none or 10 converts they know they will get "everlasting life in a paradise earth (carrot)." There is no motivation. It is the realm of women who do the bulk of the work. There is no profit in door to door unless a man is trying to be appointed a MS or elder. As soon as they are appointed, their hours drop to the bare minimum of 5 hours.

    Jesus knew he had only 3.5 years....but the average jw has no idea how much longer it will be, they hope soon, sooner than soon but many have been trudging along for 40 or more years. They never expected to die in "this system of things."

    START OF ARTICLE
    Q. 1,2 What is a missionary, and who can be called the greatest Missionary?

    1 WHAT comes to mind when you hear the word "missionary"? Some think of Christendom's missionaries, many of whom meddle in the political and economic affairs of the countries where they serve. As one of Jehovah's Witnesses, however, you likely think of the missionaries sent out by the Governing Body to preach the good news in various lands around the earth. (Matt. 24:14) These missionaries unselfishly devote their time and effort to the noble cause of helping people to draw close to Jehovah God and enjoy a precious relationship with him.-Jas. 4:8.

    2 The words "missionary" and "missionaries" do not appear in the main text of the New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures. In its footnote on Ephesians 4:11, however, the Reference Bible suggests that the Greek word translated "evangelizers" can also be rendered "missionaries" Jehovah is the greatest Evangelizer, but he cannot be called the greatest Missionary, for he was never sent by anyone. Concerning his heavenly Father, though, Jesus Christ said: "I am a representative from him, and that One sent me forth." (John 7:29) In an expression of great love for the world of mankind, Jehovah sent his only-begotten Son to the earth. (John 3:16) Jesus can be called the greatest Missionary, the ultimate Missionary, because one reason why he was sent to earth was to "bear witness to the truth." (John 18:37) He was completely successful in proclaiming the good news of the Kingdom, and the benefits of his service are still available to us. For example, we can apply his teaching methods in our ministry, whether we are assigned as missionaries or not.

    What do most of Christendom's missionaries do or have done?
    1) Translated the Bible into many native languages, more than the WTS has
    2) Provided medical support, doctors, nurses, hospitals, clinics, medicine, medical training of local people, etc.
    3) Provided food and clothing
    4) Taught people about the Bible and the Christian culture so that when the WTS missionaries finally showed up, the foundation had already been laid. The WTS routinely witnessed only to people who already had a Christian background.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missionary

    "Missionary" another word that does not appear in the Bible such as "organization," "governing body," "trinity."

    Jesus is the Great Missionary so Christians imitate him but cannot imitate God who the WTS say is not a missionary because no one could send him.

    Do jws even say "good news," "kingdom," "Jesus" in their "presentations"? What do you remember or see now? Do they avoid saying

    "Jehovah" or "Jehovah's witnesses" or are told to do that by the elders?


    Q. 3 What questions are we going to consider?

    3 Jesus' role as a Kingdom proclaimer raises such questions as these: What did Jesus experience on earth? Why was his teaching effective? And what made his ministry successful?

    "proclaimer" rather than publisher: What is the difference? "Publisher" occurs only once in the NWT, "proclaimer" not even once. By far the

    WTS identifies its members as "publishers" rather than "proclaimers"? Hmmmm..........

    Too many jws are neither "effective" or "successful" because they are not required to convert anyone to get the Carrot: everlasting life on earth.


    A Willing Spirit Amidst New Surroundings
    Q. 4-6 What were some changes Jesus faced upon being sent to earth?

    4 Present-day missionaries and some Christians who move to places where the need for Kingdom preachers is greater may have to become accustomed to conditions below the living standard they have been used to. But we cannot even imagine the contrast between Jesus' circumstances on earth and those in heaven, where he lived with his Father among angelic creatures who served Jehovah with pure motives.(Job 38:7) How different it was to be among sinful humans in a corrupt world! (Mark 7:20-23) Jesus even had to deal with rivalry among his closest disciples. (Luke 20:46; 22:24) Of course, he dealt perfectly with everything he encountered on earth.

    5 Jesus did not miraculously start to speak a human language; he began to learn it as a babe. What a change from being in command of the angels in heaven! On earth, Jesus used at least one of "the tongues of men." It was completely different from 'the tongues of angels.' (1 Cor. 13:1) When it came to winsome words, however, no human ever spoke as Jesus did.---Luke 4:22.

    6 Consider other ways in which things changed greatly for God's Son when he came to earth. Although Jesus did not inherit sin from Adam, He did become a human, like those who would later become his "brothers," or anointed followers. (Read Hebrews 2: 1-18.) On the last night of his earthly life, Jesus refrained from asking his heavenly Father to send "more than twelve legions of angels." But just think of the angelic creatures over whom he had authority as Michael the Archangel! (Matt. 26:53; Jude 9) Yes, Jesus did perform miracles; yet, what he did while on earth was relatively limited compared with what he would have been able to accomplish in heaven.

    Christians = only jws

    Need greater = peculiar WTS phrase that even generated a website.

    http://www.needgreaters.com/

    Do you think that Jesus who loved humans, felt deprived by this sojourn on earth? I think not. But I do think that jws who view themselves as superior spiritually, feel it is a chore to associate with the "more imperfect" members of their congregation.

    (Proverbs 8:31) . . .and the things I was fond of were with the sons of men.

    According to the WTS Jesus did not remember his life in heaven until he was baptized at 30. So he was not suffering by having to speak a mere mortal's language.

    ***Greatest Man book gt chap. 12 Jesus’ Baptism ***

    But more than that happens as Jesus is baptized. ‘The heavens are opened up’ to him. What does this mean? Evidently it means that while he is being baptized, the memory of his prehuman life in heaven returns to him. Thus, Jesus now fully recalls his life as a spirit son of Jehovah God, including all the things that God spoke to him in heaven during his prehuman existence.

    Q 7. How did the Jews act as far as the Law was concemed?

    7 During his prehuman existence as "the Word," Jesus may have been God's Spokesman who guided the Israelites through the wilderness. (John 1:1; Ex. 23:20-23) However, they had "received the Law as transmitted by angels but [had] not kept it." (Acts 7:53; Heb. 2:2, 3) In fact, the first century Jewish religious leaders failed to discern the intent of the Law. For example, consider the Sabbath law. (Read Mark 3:4-6.) The scribes and Pharisees "disregarded the weightier matters of the Law, namely, justice and mercy and faithfulness." (Matt. 23:23) Nevertheless, Jesus did not give up and cease to declare the truth.

    "Jesus MAY HAVE been God's Spokesman who guided the Israelites through the wilderness"

    This is similar to the way the WTS concludes that Jesus is Michael the archangel. They teach that this angel was Michael. What is the scriptural proof?

    *** it-2 p. 1203 Word, The ***

    Since the angel that guided the Israelites through the wilderness had ‘Jehovah’s name within him,’ he may have been God’s Son, the Word.—Ex 23:20-23

    Yet if Jesus was an angel prior to his birth on earth, his name would not have been Jesus. And if he was Michael, how would God's name be in him any more than in Gabriel?

    Notice some "likely" ways the WTS "no doubt" makes a scriptural connection where there is none.

    *** w95 8/1 p. 13 par. 21 Jehovah—A God Who Teaches ***

    Jehovah also uses angelic representatives to teach, including his Firstborn, “the Word.” (John 1:1-3) Although Jehovah could have spoken directly to his perfect human son, Adam, in the garden of Eden, likely he used the prehuman Jesus to speak for Him. (Genesis 2:16, 17) This one was probably “the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel” and regarding whom Jehovah commanded: “Obey his voice.” (Exodus 14:19; 23:20, 21) No doubt the prehuman Jesus was also the “prince of the army of Jehovah” who appeared to Joshua to strengthen him. (Joshua 5:14, 15).

    "religious leaders failed to discern the intent of the Law" "disregarded the weightier matters of the Law" like how the Bible forbids beards on male Christians and there has to be 2 eyewitnesses of a pedophile molesting a child; like eating grain on the Sabbath, healing on the sabbath, and not ritually washing your hands.

    Q. 8. Why can Jesus come to our aid?

    8 Jesus had a willing spirit. He was moved by love for people and keenly wanted to help them. He never lost the evangelizing spirit. And because of his faithfulness to Jehovah while on earth, Jesus "became responsible for everlasting salvation to all those obeying him." Moreover, "in that he himself has suffered when being put to the test, he is able to come to the aid of those [like us] who are being put to the test." -Heb. 2: 18; 5:8, 9.

    "willing spirit" how many jws really want to go d2d? Do they linger and find times when people are most likely to be home such as in the evening? Are they motivated for love of people or is it their personal salvation that moves them?

    *** w03 5/15 p. 22 Remain Steadfast, and Win the Race for Life ***

    Yes, our Christian ministry is a valuable aid in keeping our hearts and minds focused on the doing of God’s will and firmly fixed on the prize of everlasting life.


    Well-Trained as a Teacher

    Q 9,10: What kind of training did Jesus receive before being sent to earth?

    9 Before present-day Christians are sent out as missionaries, the Governing Body arranges for them to be trained. Did Jesus Christ receive training? Yes, but he did not attend the rabbinic schools before beiing anointed as the Messiah; neither was he taught at the feet of some prominent religious leaders. (John 7:15; compare Acts 22:3.) Why, then, was Jesus so qualified to teach?

    10 Regardless of what Jesus may have learned from his mother, Mary, and his adoptive father, Joseph, he received his principal training for the ministry from the highest Source. Concerning this, Jesus said: "I have not spoken out of my own impulse, but the Father himself who sent me has given me a commandent as to what to tell and what to speak." (John 12:49) Notice that the Son was given specific instruction about what to teach. Before coming to the earth, Jesus un- doubtedly spent much time listening to his Father's instruction. What better training could he have received?

    present-day Christians--only jws

    rabbinic schools--Kingdom Ministry School, Ministerial Training School, CO/DO Schools, how are they different..."taught at the feet of some prominent religious leaders"

    MAY HAVE learned from his mother....adoptive father

    Before coming to the earth, Jesus "undoubtedly"--adding to the Bible

    So are the WTS/FDS/GB listening to the Father's instruction....what do they put first, their publications or the Bible?

    Yearbook of Jehovah's Witnesses 1939 p 85 It should be expected that the Lord would have a means of communicating to his people on the earth, and he has clearly shown that the magazine called The Watch Tower is used for that purpose.
    Thus the Bible is an organizational book and belongs to the Christian congregation as an organization, not to individuals, regardless of how sincerely they may believe that they can interpret the Bible. For this reason the Bible cannot be properly understood without Jehovah’s visible organization in mind.” (The Watchtower, October 1, 1967, page 587)
    “Jehovah God has also provided his visible organization, his “faithful and discreet slave,” made up of spirit anointed ones, to help Christians in all nations to understand and apply properly the Bible in their lives. Unless we are in touch with this channel of communication that God is using, we will not progress along the road to life, no matter how much Bible reading we do.” (The Watchtower, December 1, 1981, page 27)
    “All who want to understand the Bible should appreciate that the “greatly diversified wisdom of God” can become known only through Jehovah’s channel of communication, the faithful and discreet slave.” (The Watchtower, October 1, 1994, page 8)

    Q 11. To what extent did Jesus reflect his Father's attitude toward mankind?

    11 From the time he was created, the Son had an intimate relationship with his Father. During his prehuman existence, Jesus discerned God's attitude toward humans by observing Jehovah's dealings with them. God's love for mankind was reflected in the Son to such an extent that as wisdom personified, he could say: "The things I was fond of were with the sons of men."-Prov. 8:22,31.

    Who really had direct contact with humans? According to the WTS God worked through angels, specifically Jesus in his prehuman existence.

    So did Jesus learn by observation or by action?

    Q. 12, 13. (a) How did Jesus learn by observing his Father's dealings with the Israelites? (b) How did Jesus use the training he received?

    12 The training that the Son received also included observing how his Father managed adverse circumstances. For example, consider Jehovah's dealings with the wayward Israelites. Nehemiah 9:28 states: "As soon as they were at rest, they would again do what is bad before you (Jehovah], and you would leave them to the hand of their enemies, who would tread them down. Then they would return and call to you for aid, and you yourself would hear from the very heavens and deliver them in accord with your abundant mercy, time and again." Working with and observing Jehovah, Jesus cultivated similar compassion for the people in his territory. -John 5:19.

    13 Jesus put this training to work as he compassionately dealt with his disciples. On the night before his death, all the apostles he had loved so much "abandoned him and fled." (Matt. 26:56; John 13:1) The apostle Peter even denied Christ three times! Nevertheless, Jesus left a way open for his apostles to return to him. He told Peter: "I have made supplication for you that your faith may not, give out; and you, when once you have returned, strengthen your brothers." (Luke 22:32) Spiritual Israel has successfully been founded on "the apostles and prophets," and the foundation stones of the wall of New Jerusalem bear the names of the 12 faithful apostles of the Lamb, Jesus Christ. To this day, anointed Christians along with their dedicated associates, the "other sheep," flourish as a Kingdom-preaching organization under the mighty hand of God and the leadership of his beloved Son.-Eph. 2:20; John 10:16; Rev. 21:14.

    "Jehovah's dealings with wayward Israelites"

    What about their children?

    *** w62 8/15 pp. 494-495 par. 26 Children, Do You Obey Jehovah? ***

    Shortly Jehovah will terminate its existence in the battle of Armageddon and usher in a new world of righteousness. It is a serious time for children as well as adults, because children that do not obey Jehovah will not be among the survivors of that battle. God will not preserve them into his new world merely because they are children. This is evident from the fact that he did not preserve the young children through the flood of Noah’s day just because they were children. It is also shown in the book of Ezekiel that just because you are young is no reason for God’s keeping you alive. Ezekiel wrote: “Slay utterly the old man, the young man and the virgin, and little children and women; but come not near any man upon whom is the mark.” (Ezek. 9:6, AS) Your being children who worship and serve Jehovah as he has commanded and who have the mark of protection—ah yes, that will mean preservation and life for you.

    Jesus...compassionately..disciples--Did Peter have to wait a year and be on restrictions before Jesus let him witness before a large crowd? It was just days and Peter was speaking at Pentecost. What about the WTS?

    *** w56 10/1 p. 595 par. 32 Marriage Obligations and Divorce ***

    If so, that person must be disfellowshiped and thus stripped of service privileges and positions and Christian fellowship. If after disfellowshipment that one shows the fruitage of repentance and seeks to get back into the congregation, that one may be reinstated and put on a long probation, for at least a year, and then, being found on good behavior, he may be formally relieved of the restrictions imposed upon him and be fully received back.

    "anointed Christians" but "dedicated associates" implies that the WTS has a hard time calling them Christians.

    Is Paul (chosen directly by Jesus) or Matthias (chosen by casting lots--gambling) the 12th and replacement apostle?

    How Jesus Taught
    Q. 14, 15. In what ways did Jesus' teaching contrast with that of the scribes and Pharisees?

    14 How did Jesus put his training into practice in teaching his followers? When we compare Jesus' instruction with that of the Jewish religious leaders, we clearly see the superiority of Jesus' way of teaching. The scribes and Pharisees 'made God's word invalid because of their tradition.' In contrast, what Jesus, spoke was not of his own originality; he stuck to God's word, or message. (Matt. 15:6; John 14: 10) That is also what we need to do.

    15 Another factor made Jesus totally different from the religious leaders. Regarding the scribes and Pharisees, he said: 'AIl the things' they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds, for they say but do not perform." (Matt. 23:3) Jesus practiced, what he taught. Let us consider an example that proves this to be true.

    "scribes and Pharisees' made God's word invalid"--can you think of some ways the WTS invalidates the Bible with their rules?

    Where is the scripture that says that male Christians cannot have beards? Where does it say that Christians are required to attend 5 meetings weekly or turn in a time slip or that "pioneers" are required to turn in 70 hours a month?

    How many times have you heard a talk from the platform and know that the speaker does not apply what he is saying in his own life..."for they say but do not perform."


    Q. 16. Why would you say that Jesus lived in harmony with his words recorded at Matthew 6:19-21?

    16 Jesus urged his disciples to "store up treasures in heaven." (Read Matthew 6: 19- 21.) Did Jesus himself live in accord with that admonition? Yes, for he could truthfully say concerning himself: "Foxes have dens and birds of heaven have roosts, but the Son of man has nowhere to lay down his head." (Luke 9:58) Jesus lived simply. He was primarily occupied with proclaiming the good news of the Kingdom, and he demonstrated what it meant to be free of the anxieties that come from storing up treasures on earth. Jesus pointed out how much better it is to store up treasures in heaven, "where neither moth nor rust consumes, and where thieves do not break in and steal." Are you following Jesus' admonition to store up treasures in heaven?

    "Jesus lived simply." He did not own a house, a vehicle, more than one set of clothing. How many elders or other jws can say the same? Do you

    know elders that spend more time watching or playing sports than in the d2d? Or sisters spend at the shopping malls?

    Who did wash Jesus clothes, cook his food, etc?

    (Luke 8:1-3) . . .And the twelve were with him, 2 and certain women that had been cured of wicked spirits and sicknesses, Mary the so-called Mag'da·lene, from whom seven demons had come out, 3 and Jo·an'na the wife of Chu'za, Herod’s man in charge, and Su·san'na and many her women, who were ministering to them from their belongings.


    Qualities That Endeared Jesus to People
    Q. 17. What qualities made Jesus an extraordinary evangelizer?

    17 What qualities made Jesus an extraordinary evangelizer? One was his attitude toward the people he helped. Among the fine qualities of Jehovah that Jesus reflected were humility, love, and compassion. Note how these traits drew many to Jesus.

    How do jws view the kind of people Jesus helped?

    *** w65 3/15 p. 176 par. 10 Our Own Twentieth-Century Generation and the Resurrection ***

    The undedicated children of goatish people will not be spared from execution and being sentenced to Gehenna just because they are themselves minor, unresponsible children.

    Had you ever been in the door to door and had your companion pronounce that the last person you talked to was a "goat"? Or select a house in the neighborhood for their own "after" Armageddon, assuming that the current owner will not "make it"?

    Q. 18. Why can it be said that Jesus was humble?

    18 Having accepted the assignment to come to the earth, Jesus "emptied himself and took a slave's form and came to be in the likeness of men." (Phil. 2:7) That was an act of humility. Furthermore, Jesus did not look down on people. He did not have the attitude, 'I came all the way from the heavens, so you should listen to me.' Unlike self-proclaimed false messiahs, Jesus did not go about trumpeting his role as the true Messiah. Sometimes he told people to refrain from telling others who he was or what he had done. (Matt. 12: 15- 21) Jesus wanted people to make their decision to follow him based on what they themselves observed. How blessed his disciples were that their Lord did not expect them to be like the perfect angels with whom he had associated in heaven!

    "He did not have the attitude, 'I came all the way from the heavens, so you should listen to me.'

    I have met visiting speakers who actually conveyed that attitude; that the GB and Bethel speakers were some how higher and holier than the local jws.

    While Jesus did not go about trumpeting his role, when you visit a new congregation, you quickly find out who the elders are and if they are ex-Bethelites, and if their wives are pioneers, or their children are or at Bethel. A sister with an unbelieving husband has no status.


    Q. 19, 20. How did love and compassion move Jesus to help people?

    19 Jesus Christ also expressed love--a dominant quality of his heavenly Father. (I John 4:8) Jesus taught his audiences out of love. For instance, consider his feelings for a certain young ruler. (Read Mark 10:17-22.) Jesus "felt love for him" and wanted to help him, but the young ruler did not give up his many possessions in order to become a follower of Christ.

    20 Among Jesus' endearing qualities was his compassion. Like all imperfect humans, those who responded to his teaching were burdened with problems. Aware of this, Jesus taught them with compassion and pity. To illustrate: On one occasion, Jesus and his apostles were so busy that they did not have time even to eat a meal. However, what was Jesus' reaction when he saw that a crowd had gathered? "He was moved with pity for them, because they were as sheep without a shepherd. And he started to teach them many things." (Mark 6:34) Jesus noticed the pitiful condition of the people in his territory and expended himself in teaching them and performing miracles for their benefit. Some were attracted by his fine qualities, were moved by his words, and became his discipIes.

    "Jesus expressed love" he showed it in his actions, not talking about it all the time. The elders that talk about showing love but never call when you are missing to see if you are sick or down, need help moving, finding a job, help mowing the lawn if you are elderly.

    Materialism is slipped in here with the mention of the young ruler. How many elders sacrifice all they own to go preaching?

    Jesus had compassion, tried to help people with their problems, didn't blame them for their woes. He did suggest that they weren't praying enough, going to enough meetings, putting enough time in the field service; that if they did those things their problems would go away.
    Q. 21. What will we consider in the next article?

    21 There is much more that we can learn about Jesus' earthly ministry, as the next article will show. In what further ways can we imitate Jesus Christ, the greatest Missionary?

    From this and the next article, the door to door (d2d) work is not effective. If you still attend or have contacts, how many pioneers are there, the same as in the pre-1975 days? I checked and found that there are less than 1/3 and few of them are men.

    How Would You Respond?

    What training did Jesus receive before coming to earth?
    How was Jesus' way of teaching superior to that of the scribes and Pharisees?
    What qualities endeared Jesus to people?

    Concluding Comments

    Jesus followers were known as Christians. Why did Rutherford then choose an OT name such as Jehovah's Witnesses? Not even "Jehovah's Christian Witnesses." Then an outside group in the 1980's copyrighted that name and that phrase disappeared from the WTS publications. The reincarnation is "Christian Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses" appearing on the signs outside the convention locations, not Watchtower any more.

    Ask the jw at the door what religion he/she is and 95% will say "Jehovah's Witness" not Christian.

    Love, Blondie

  • chickpea
    chickpea

    YAY!

    what excellent timing!! i am in a hotel downstate for a weekend seminar and i was going to miss my "sunday with coffee and comments" because i travel even further afield sun thru wed!!!

    thank you for the "food at the proper time"

  • Hope4Others
    Hope4Others

    Be back tomorrow, For some reason you've got me preparing ahead teacher.

    lol

    hope

    edited to add: ps. I guess it is tomorrow, well a little later anyway haven't been to sleep yet.

  • greendawn
    greendawn

    The JWs mainly preach to people with a Christian background. Good point, most of their converts come from such people whereas their success with Moslems, Hindus, Taoists etc is extremely limited. They have made little headway in non Christian countries. Of course it's the much demonised traditional Christian religions that kept up Christianity which gave the dubs most of their converts.

  • jgnat
    jgnat
    While Jesus did not go about trumpeting his role, when you visit a new congregation, you quickly find out who the elders are and if they are ex-Bethelites, and if their wives are pioneers, or their children are or at Bethel. A sister with an unbelieving husband has no status.

    Ain't that the truth. Even newbies like me are quickly advised of a congregation member's status.

    On my first visit to hubby's new congregation, the alpha elder came and shook my hand. He and his wife quickly advised us that he is on the HLC and also on the local building committee.

    The one time I sat in on an elder's counselling session, I was advised (out of the blue) that they treat converts no differently than generational witnesses. The elder then pointed to the other, by example, explaining while he was a generational witness, his brother was not. Riiiight. I'd noticed that "convert" elder got all the crap jobs, like endless book studies with hard cases like my hubby.

    The pioneer sisters are always the most aggressive. They are pretty forward in their questions, too, as if they are somehow entitled to the information.

  • WTWizard
    WTWizard

    I wonder if the Filthful and Disgraceful Slavebugger even knows what Jesus' true message is. Jesus was trying to set a people free of bicameralism, and the leaders were trying to put them right back into that mode. Jesus was trying to teach a people to think independently (when is the last time you saw something from the Filthful and Disgraceful Slavebugger telling people how to think independently), and the leaders were holding them back.

    No wonder Jesus had such low tolerance for the religious leaders. He was very patient with people that lived debauched lives, even those that were harlots and drunkards. He had more tolerance for people that were common thieves and robbers than for those leaders that held civilization back. I wonder how he would have reacted to those that started the First Dark Ages, in the name of Christianity (or to the Watchtower Society, which is trying behind the scenes to start the Second Dark Ages).

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut
    1 WHAT comes to mind when you hear the word "missionary"? Some think of Christendom's missionaries, many of whom meddle in the political and economic affairs of the countries where they serve.

    Even if I were a believing Dub, I find this offensive. Believing in helping
    people by providing educational materials, first aid, food, clothing, assistance
    with obtaining government aid. WTS lumps that all together as "meddling."

    Their out is that "some think of" that. Still, they throw it out there to make
    a negative image compared to those that just focus on recruiting starving people
    while ignoring humanitarian aid.

    Do jws even say "good news," "kingdom," "Jesus" in their "presentations"?

    Side note for Blondie- I used all those terms and knew many JW's that did so.
    Presentations such as:

    "People read the bad news and watch the bad news on television.
    We are here to ask if they would like to hear good news?"

    "(After reading the Lord's Prayer) We pray for God's kingdom to come. What
    do you suppose that 'kingdom' is?"

    But yes, we generally avoided "Jehovah" or "Jehovah's Witnesses" in what we said.

    8 Jesus had a willing spirit. He was moved by love for people and keenly wanted to help them. He never lost the evangelizing spirit. .......

    "willing spirit" how many jws really want to go d2d? Do they linger and find times when people are most likely to be home such as in the evening? Are they motivated for love of people or is it their personal salvation that moves them?

    Para. 8- that's the whole thrust of the article. WTS is saying: "You all ain't got what Jesus had,
    but you can have the same spirit by selling our literature better." WTS recognized that JW's don't
    "want" to do the recruiting and selling work, so the study lesson motivates them.

  • stillajwexelder
    stillajwexelder

    Good to have you back doing this Blondie

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut
    10 Regardless of what Jesus may have learned from his mother, Mary, and his adoptive father, Joseph, he received his principal training for the ministry from the highest Source. .......Notice that the Son was given specific instruction about what to teach.

    Here's another main thrust of the article. "Jesus received specific instructions. Where can
    you all receive specific instructions (from Jehovah)? At the meetings and in the literature
    from His FDS."

    Good job pointing out the older articles that point out how the FDS (really the GB) steps in
    for God.

    Did Peter have to wait a year and be on restrictions before Jesus let him witness before a large crowd? It was just days and Peter was speaking at Pentecost. What about the WTS?

    I am going to steal that line and use it somewhere.

  • blondie
    blondie

    chickpea, how bad of you putting a worldly seminar ahead of the meeting. You should quit that job (hahaha). I knew elders that were working on Sunday out of town and told us they went to the local congregation. I happened to know jws in that area and did some checking and found that they never attended meetings there although there was only one congregation and this elder worked in that area ten times a year....was he lying, elders don't lie do they?

    H4O, I prepare more now than I ever did as a jw though I did study quite a bit. It is good to remind ourselves why we left.

    Hey greendawn,

    Of course it's the much demonised traditional Christian religions that kept up Christianity which gave the dubs most of their converts.

    In fact other Christian religions complained that instead of "planting" in new fields, the WTS poached their members. Most jws have no knowledge of the basics of non-Christian religion except the material the WTS provides. Did you know that the WTS never has studied the "Mankind's Search for God book" in the book study setting. Hmmm...........

    Good experience, jgnat.

    While Jesus did not go about trumpeting his role, when you visit a new congregation, you quickly find out who the elders are and if they are ex-Bethelites, and if their wives are pioneers, or their children are or at Bethel. A sister with an unbelieving husband has no status.

    Ain't that the truth. Even newbies like me are quickly advised of a congregation member's status.
    On my first visit to hubby's new congregation, the alpha elder came and shook my hand. He and his wife quickly advised us that he is on the HLC and also on the local building committee.
    The one time I sat in on an elder's counselling session, I was advised (out of the blue) that they treat converts no differently than generational witnesses. The elder then pointed to the other, by example, explaining while he was a generational witness, his brother was not. Riiiight. I'd noticed that "convert" elder got all the crap jobs, like endless book studies with hard cases like my hubby.
    The pioneer sisters are always the most aggressive. They are pretty forward in their questions, too, as if they are somehow entitled to the information.

    Hey there, WTWizard,

    Jesus was trying to teach a people to think independently

    At least not to be following men but to be following the words of God which he summed up in 2 sentences.

    Hi OTWO,

    I can only speak to what happens in the area I live as to presentations. More "mature" jws tend to bring in those words, but it is amazing how the WTS and individual jws leave out "Jehovah" and "Jehovah's Witnesses." I have even had COs counsel us to avoid those words because then people won't listen. Hey, but, aren't jws supposed to be giving a witness for God even without saying his name, like the people don't know they are jws? The point about Peter I have used many times. The excuse given is the elders can't read hearts like Jesus did but then how did the apostles and the audience know that Jesus had said anything since he had gone to heaven already.

    Thanks, stilla. Any chance of seeing you this summer?

    Love, Blondie

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