Issue Number 2.... Incorrect Predictions. (page 3)

MidwichCuckoo

"Would That All Were Prophets! .. You will be interested to learn that God has on earth a people, all of whom are prophets, or witnesses for God. In fact, they are known throughout the world as Jehovah's Witnesses"Awake!, June 8 1986, p. 9

Jenlet

The only time the Watchtower Society disclaims being a prophet is when their predictions fail.

The rest of the time they're a prophet.

jefferywhat

Hi Hotchocolate, your experience seems quite similar to mine in some ways, different issues but same nagging doubts.

The whole prophet thing has never been an issue for me, it has existed long before Russell and transcends cultures and religions, and historically not all prophets claimed to be inspired.

What has me in a spin is the flood, global or not, evolutionary/creative process and most importantly the actual identification of Jesus and Michael.

The last one being the thing that really blows my mind and was really the first thing that got me thinking. There really is no categorical proof that jesus is Michael but it fits if you take Jesus deity away.

I have said before that alot of this stuff is a IKEA furniture and we simply dont know, but to be dogmatic is crazy and to me more serious than looking for an end, one affects your life choices , the other affects who you actually worship. So if your going to redefine a God you had better have your facts are water tight and they just dont seem to be. Emotionally it feels weird to write that because I "feel" like Jesus has been created but that is an emotion, I cannot not be certain mentally as there is no absolute proof.

I still feel that there is no guy behind the curtain, I dont think the GB conspires for power or financial gain, I think they have got it wrong from time to time, but so have I.

For the first time I feel like a have a moral and spiritual obligation to make sure of things and to really search out what I believe, our generation asks why and how alot.

This forum is not the ideal place to do that, sure you find out some amazing facts and some crazy stories but no answers on which to build a belief system.

I pioneered for 11 years and I can safely say it helped get me in the position Im in today and I look back over those years with a smile.

Search but dont get bitter.

cultswatter

hi hotchocolate!

sorry I did not welcome you before so WELCOME There are so many newbies everday. Hey i read your first post and my heart was racing when I posted my first post too

love your input. I'm known for some pretty twilight zone stuff on this board

bob1999

Jehovah’s Witnesses, in their eagerness for Jesus’ second coming, have suggested dates that turned out to be incorrect. Because of this, some have called them false prophets. Never in these instances, however, did they presume to originate predictions ‘in the name of Jehovah.’ Never did they say, ‘These are the words of Jehovah.’ The Watchtower, the official journal of Jehovah’s Witnesses, has said: “We have not the gift of prophecy.” (January 1883, page 425) “Nor would we have our writings reverenced or regarded as infallible.” (December 15, 1896, page 306) The Watchtower has also said that the fact that some have Jehovah’s spirit “does not mean those now serving as Jehovah’s witnesses are inspired. It does not mean that the writings in this magazine The Watchtower are inspired and infallible and without mistakes.” (May 15, 1947, page 157) “The Watchtower does not claim to be inspired in its utterances, nor is it dogmatic.” (August 15, 1950, page 263) “The brothers preparing these publications are not infallible. Their writings are not inspired as are those of Paul and the other Bible writers. (2 Tim. 3:16) And so, at times, it has been necessary, as understanding became clearer, to correct views. (Prov. 4:18)”—February 15, 1981, page 19.

And right there, not two inches away;

Why Awake is published.

Awake is for the enlightenment..............Most important, this magazine builds confidence in the Creator's promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 pass away.

Is this statement (false prophecy in the name of God) really at the bottom of page 4?

Thanks

lrkr

"We're not prophets".... right.

They say, and expect us to do. Any organization that expects its members to make life decisions based on the impending end of the world has a certain level of responsibility to double check their predictions.

It doesn't matter what they want to be called: mother, prophet, organization, channel, faithful and discreet slave, ark, etc. Those are just names. What matters is what they claim to know and what action they expect based on that knowledge.

The fact that they encourage (with a capital E) people to not get married, not have children, not go to college, not get a good job, not take promotions, not save, not relax during retirement, not play sports in school ....not, not, not.... because of certain knowledge about the future makes them responsible for affecting/ruining many millions of lives. OK- so we won't call them prophets.....whatever.....

ESTEE

Deut 18:20-22;

20 “‘However, the prophet who presumes to speak in my name a word that I have not commanded him to speak or who speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet must die. 21 And in case you should say in your heart: “How shall we know the word that Jehovah has not spoken?” 22 when the prophet speaks in the name of Jehovah and the word does not occur or come true, that is the word that Jehovah did not speak. With presumptuousness the prophet spoke it. You must not get frightened at him.’

This says it all. So . . . now you know in your heart . . . what will you choose to do about it?

ESTEE

bob1999

From the Awake March 22 1993 page 4

"Jehovah’s Witnesses, in their eagerness for Jesus’ second coming, have suggested dates that turned out to be incorrect. Because of this, some have called them false prophets. Never in these instances, however, did they presume to originate predictions ‘in the name of Jehovah.’ Never did they say, ‘These are the words of Jehovah.’ The Watchtower, the official journal of Jehovah’s Witnesses, has said: “We have not the gift of prophecy.” (January 1883, page 425) “Nor would we have our writings reverenced or regarded as infallible.” (December 15, 1896, page 306) The Watchtower has also said that the fact that some have Jehovah’s spirit “does not mean those now serving as Jehovah’s witnesses are inspired. It does not mean that the writings in this magazine The Watchtower are inspired and infallible and without mistakes.” (May 15, 1947, page 157) “The Watchtower does not claim to be inspired in its utterances, nor is it dogmatic.” (August 15, 1950, page 263) “The brothers preparing these publications are not infallible. Their writings are not inspired as are those of Paul and the other Bible writers. (2 Tim. 3:16) And so, at times, it has been necessary, as understanding became clearer, to correct views. (Prov. 4:18)”—February 15, 1981, page 19."

So they say they are not false prophets because they do not make their predictions "in the name of Jehovah"

But right there, not two inches away, at the bottom of that same page, in that same Awake magazine, they make a prediction in the name of Jehovah.

"Why Awake! is published.

Awake is for the enlightenment..............Most important, this magazine builds confidence in the Creator's promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 pass away."

Printing the above is prophesying in the name of Jehovah. (obviously false) How could anyone argue that it's not?

I find it funny (weird) that the WTS would make a false prophesy, on the same page, where they deny being false prophets.

Confucious

Hot...

Estee mentioned...

“How shall we know the word that Jehovah has not spoken?” 22 when the prophet speaks in the name of Jehovah and the word does not occur or come true, that is the word that Jehovah did not speak. With presumptuousness the prophet spoke it. You must not get frightened at him.’

I had to highlight that last portion.

Why? Because Jehovah knows how these people could be.

They try to frighten you.

Confucious

besty

For the first time I feel like a have a moral and spiritual obligation to make sure of things and to really search out what I believe, our generation asks why and how alot.

This forum is not the ideal place to do that, sure you find out some amazing facts and some crazy stories but no answers on which to build a belief system.

The strength of JWD is allowing you to be clear about what not to belief - the way the universe works proving something false is much easier than to prove it true.

So yes I agree that JWD is not helpful for creating a replacement belief system - other than putting you in touch with fellow travellers - no small help in itself.

Issue Number 2.... Incorrect Predictions.

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