why do JW's believe ........

grewupJWnoselfesteem78-95

talking with my father (exJW) me (exJW) family 60% still JW he mentioned that fallen angels can no longer materialise into human form................. he says they they were forbidden after the flood..........

i do watch, read and speak to many ex-freemasons (illuminati) and they are very confident that even today fallen angels have the power or means to take on forms if they wish to (even human) ..............................

what do JW's use as a scriptual basis for this argument......................????

bigmouth

They use 2 Peter 2:4 to show that the materialized angels were sent to Tartarus, pits of dense darkness, as punishment for coming to earth and bonking women who gave birth to the giant Nephilim.

This occured at the time of the flood when all wicked mortals were drowned.

Page 95, para. 12 of the Live Forever book asserts that God has not permitted these angels to take on fleshly bodies.

Does that help or confuse?

onacruse

*** w55 10/1 pp. 594-595 par. 8 Part 3—What Do the Scriptures Say About "Survival After Death"? ***

8
Their being "reserved with eternal bonds" evidently means also that they are no more permitted to materialize in the flesh as before the Flood. This power of materialization was exercised by God’s faithful angels, including Jesus Christ, for thousands of years after the Flood, down into the day of Christ’s faithful apostles, according to God’s will and to serve his holy purposes. But the sinner angels were not allowed to use this power longer, for they would misuse it.

This was repeated (with greater certainty) just last year:

*** w06 1/15 p. 7 Angels—How They Affect Us ***
Demons are dangerous, but we need not dread them. Their power is limited. When the disobedient angels returned to heaven, they were not allowed back into God’s family of faithful angels. Instead, they were cut off from any spiritual enlightenment from God, with only a dark outlook for the future. Indeed, they were confined in a condition of spiritual darkness known as Tartarus. (2 Peter 2:4) Jehovah restrained them with "eternal bonds," so that they are in spiritual darkness. Furthermore, they are now unable to materialize human bodies.—Jude 6.

penny2

Hi grewup, welcome to JWD. Nice to see another Aussie on board. There are a few of us!!

penny2

grewupJWnoselfesteem78-95

2 Peter 2:4 When angels sinned, God did not spare the: hesent them down into the unerworld and consigned them to the dark abyss to be held there until judgement

i thought this verse was just speaking of the angels who at the time before the flood who materialised and had relations with women.

if is is speaking about all fallen angels (angels who have sinned) are they all in the dark abyss awaiting judgment.

or is it that as soon as an fallen angel materialises into human form he is thrown into the abyss????

grewupJWnoselfesteem78-95

again......... if all fallen angels are in spiritual darkness.....how do they opperate on behalf of Satan????

is this scripture talking about the fallen angels of the day "or" all fallen angels ????

bigmouth

"... the angels who at the time before the flood "

Yes, I read this the same as you and Jude 6 doesn't seem to imply anything different.

The WT writers know they can get away with making arbitrary statements like this and no one will question them. Witnesses are generally lazy students scripturally. They are told that all the hard work has been done for them so why waste time studying!?

The 'spiritual darkness' refers to divine knowledge from Jehovah. So I guess the demons can do pretty much what they like in their own realm.

penny2

This is a quote from the book, "You Can Live Forever in Paradise on Earth"

These wicked angels were not thrown into a literal place called Tartarus. Rather, Tartarus, which is mistranslated "hell" in some Bibles, refers to the abased or fallen condition of these angels. They were cut off from the spiritual light of God’s organization, and they have only everlasting destruction awaiting them. (James 2:19; Jude 6) Since the time of the Flood, God has not permitted these demon angels to take on fleshly bodies, so they cannot directly satisfy their unnatural sexual desires. Yet they can still exercise dangerous power over men and women. In fact, with the help of these demons Satan is "misleading the entire inhabited earth." (Revelation 12:9).

The WTS makes many assumptions and don't always base them on scripture. They change their mind on key doctrines when it suits them (just look at what they've done with the "generation").

I think you've raised some valid questions. I wonder what your JW relatives would say? Don't expect to get any satisfactory answers from them though.

jaguarbass

On your subject of fallen angles materializing in human form.

That is the basis of David Ickes work. He calls them shape shifting lizzards of which the dingbat W, boy George and his daddy are.

Check out "Children of the Matrix" if you believe in fallen angles materializing.

grewupJWnoselfesteem78-95

yes shapeshifting reptilians ............ok ............. i have no doubt that these entities including U.F.O's & E.B.E's are in fact demons........... in regards to a fallen angel taking on human form or materialising....i have heard many ex freemasons & illuminati 90degree speak openly on the subject............................................. the above scriptures & notations from JW litrature as far as i can tell is only talking about the angels who materialised to have sex with women before the flood...............

does it not say in the bible "so as it was in the days of Noah so it shall be in the day of the coming of the son of man"

i ask you ............ what was happening in the days of Noah apart from the violence.......???

i was told in order for a fallen angel to take on human form or materialise he must drink the blood of a human..............

a bit far fetched yes...... but this guy had alot of credibility and was dead serious.................................................

why do JW's believe ........

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