Doctorinal Question: JWs teach Jesus is Micheal the Arc Angel.....

by Lady Liberty 72 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Narkissos
    Narkissos

    Two brief remarks.

    --> Philippus:

    From a rhetorical angle, there is no point in formally quoting from a work (especially as "prophecy") unless the work as a whole is acknowledged as authoritative by the readers.

    Or (ab absurdo): if the writers whose texts happened to be later retained by the "canon" and henceforth included in the "Bible" did have, in their own eyes and in their first readers' eyes, that kind of authority which automatically guarantees the truth of whatever they wrote, why would they bother arguing and quoting (i.e. referring to written authorities beside themselves) in the first place?

    --> ms:

    I think it is worth stepping back and pondering over the concept of mediation, and its relationship with ontological thinking (e.g. the notions of "essence" and "nature," as in "divine" vs. "human" or "created" vs. "uncreated"). In a sense, mediation dissolves in ontological thinking which in turn results in an endless inflation of mediations.

    Let's say at some stage the priest-king is the "mediator" between a people and its relatively close deity (close in the sense that it is this people's god and not necessarily the highest god -- in a sense this god is itself part of the mediation to the divine realm as a whole). Now ontological thinking drives both sides apart. The priests, and kings, are thought of as "only men," and the gods (or "God") are too remote to act directly in the human sphere any longer. Then a new type of mediation appears -- in the Bible, "angels". But as soon as ontological thinking strikes again, angelic mediation is impossible too: "angels" are regarded as a third nature, neither divine nor human. Orthodox Christology avoids the problem theoretically by postulating the hypostatic union: Christ is both divine and human (hence different from the angels which are neither). But practically (at least once the Gnostic solutions you referred to are ruled out) he becomes yet another category of being, unique of his "kind". People cannot immediately identify with him and new mediations to the mediator (!) are required (hierarchy, sacraments, saints, etc.).

    The dumbest question you can ask about a bridge is which bank it belongs to... This imo sums much of the Trinitarian/Christological debate.

  • lovelylil
    lovelylil

    LL,

    One of the first teachings of the WT I questioned was the Jesus is Michael teaching. RR is correct that Bible Students also believe this. The reason is because this strange teaching started with Charles Russell and is one of the very few teachings of Russell that the WT still holds to.

    My husband and I spent a year researching this topic and looking objectively at the only 5 scriptures that mention Michael. We sat down together and wrote a small paper on our findings and presented it to a WT elder. We asked him to show us where our logic was wrong and he never responded to us.

    We also gave a copy of this paper to a Bible Student elder a year later and asked him to show us where we were wrong. He also never responded.

    If you would like a copy of our findings, which you can guess by now, refute this teaching as being completely false and a figment of Chuck Russell's imagination only, feel free to pm me your email address and I will send you a copy.

    If anyone else would like a copy, you can also pm me your email address. Peace, Lilly

  • lovelylil
    lovelylil

    RR,

    This is for you. Here are some quotes from Russell during his earlier days regarding Michael the Archangel;

    “Michael is NOT the Son of God”, WT November 1879 Page 4

    “Jesus before he became a man, was a spiritual being of a nature superior to Angels” WT March 1883 Page 4

  • the dreamer dreaming
    the dreamer dreaming

    Jesus was really Kal-el, son of Jor-el (^_^)

  • Lady Liberty
    Lady Liberty

    Dear Loveylil,

    Thank you for offering that information. Also for postng that old Watchtower.

    Sincerely,

    Lady Liberty

  • bite me
    bite me

    The JW's are taught that Jesus cannot be God because it is impossible to be both, if that is so, then how can they be taught the very same thing they are denying Jesus= God and say that Jesus is Michael the Archangel?

    That sounds a bit like a contradiction to me.

  • bite me
    bite me

    I found something that might be interesting. What a way to confuse every generation...

    "...Michael is not the Son of God..." WT November, 1879, p.4

    "Jesus, before he became a man, was a spiritual being of a nature superior to angels....he took not on him the nature of angels..." WT, March, 1883, p.4

    "Michael, - "Who as God," - the Pope." The Finished Mystery, 1917, p.188

    "...the Son of God was known as Michael before he came to earth and is known also by that name after his return to heaven..." Reasoning From the Scriptures, 1985, p.218

  • myelaine
    myelaine

    So...speaking of reasoning from the Scriptures...Revelation 22:16...I, JESUS, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star...

    love michelle

  • bite me
    bite me

    i forgot what i was going to say here. lol

  • bite me
    bite me

    I know now...

    isn't it missing a word there...

    "and"

    Jesus was the Root and offspring of David, as well as the Bright and Morning Star.

    For those who are unfamilar or have little knowledge with grammer and punctuation might see this as David being the Bright and Morning Star.

    I know the NWT isn't the only one who leaves this out, but if the NWT was the true and correct bible, then you'd think they would make this adjustment so there isn't any confusion.

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit