In the Sally Clarke case the evidence was twisted against her by a flawed "expert witness" - who has since been discredited - I do not think Mrs Clarkes demeanour played a part in her conviction - what did was the assertion as fact of the "belief" of Professor Sir Roy Meadows.
Whatever the Portuguese Police know we can be sure - WE DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY KNOW -
Sniffer dogs were apparently only brought into the picture recently (from the UK Police)
There are too many unaswered questions to rush to convict or acquit.
What is certain is that leaving the children was wilfull neglect, and that if the parents had been from a different background the twins would now be in the care of the Social Services.
I would assume that if solid evidence existed at this point then arrests/charges would have been made - as none have it seems insufficient evidence exists.
This case should warn any parent abroad on holiday - look after your children - no one else will.
As regards the fishy smell - yes 2 from my viewpoint - an apparently hapless Criminal investigation, and a set of parents with a lot of explaining to do.
Madeline's parents formally named suspects...Something smells "fishy" here
by Dragonlady76 29 Replies latest jw friends
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core
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Gill
Core - I agree with a lot of what you have said.
With regard to the case of Sally Clarke, she was painted by the prosecution as a successful professional who resented having had children as it had distracted her from a very lucrative career. Hence, they said she 'probably' suffocated her baby. This was despite absolutely NO evidence and as you pointed out was helped with the now totally discredited 'expert witness'. The fact that she was a calm professional DID go against her.
Sally Clarke gave up on living not long after being freed from jail. She died of a broken heart from losing her first son and from being painted as the killer of a baby she loved. She took it calmly and quietly and it rotted away at her heart and she died. Can we let such an injustice happen again?
As for the negligence on the part of the parents, I can't agree more! They should have had to answer for that and probably will and are suffering for it. But, it should be a reminder for all parents not to do something so ludicrously risky.
The British nation is packed full of lax and hopeless parents. People think it is fine to send there kids out to do what they want, sort out their own tea, come home when they want and sort out their own lives. They also think it is fine to leave their kids, go down the pub or out where they want without any sense of resposibility to stay WITH their children and train them. The British, in general are hopeless parents as can be seen with out burgeoning youth crime and anti social behaviour. The McCanns were just a symptom of hopeless parenting. People used to leaving their kids with minders, and coming home to them when they were ready. No sense of self sacrifice which is a part of being a parent. But that still doesn't make them murderers.
If Madeline is never found, we may well never know what happened to her. But, this does not make the parents guilty of her murder. Surely, murder has to be proven first.
It all smacks of desperation on the part of the police. If they want evidence and not just a closure to the case they should be searching for Madeline McCann. There and only there is where the real answers lie.
A huge catastrophe is happening for the McCanns. They are definitely and without doubt guilty of gross negligence but more than likely nothing else.
If anything the search for their daughter should be prioritorised even more than before, as now even more lives depend on the truth being uncovered.
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core
Gill - you are absolutely correct - in past times holidays were "family" events and grandparents stayed in when parents went out and vise versa - our family holidays included all sorts of relatives/generations so young children were NEVER left alone - in uyears gone by finding family friendly eating places was difficult but now - very easy and in holiday resorts they cater for just that market - people with families. The children - twins as well as Madeleine - should have been with the family for the meal and all home together later in the evening - nothing excuses the criminal negligence involved here - everyone has great sympathy for the distress involved but underneath that I would dispute the claim made by this family "that everyone leaves their children alone at some time"
Think this mystery will never go away - if any charges and acquittal always the whiff of doubt - if a conviction - always a claim on a miscarriage of justice - as no 100% rock solid evidence it looks to me to be going into the mystery books for all time -
deeskis
It reminds me of Lindy Chamberlain "a dingo took my baby", she was convicted of murdering her baby, many people thought she was guilty because she was stony faced and didn't grieve the way they felt she should. In that case there was also traces of blood found in the car, underneath the carpet, which years later proved to be a rust protectant.
The report I read on madelines mother is that it was thought she gave madeline an accidental overdose of a sedative which killed her and she panicked and invented the abduction. That doesn't add up either, why invent that, it would be easier to say that the child got into the tablets herself...........
anyway the whole mess is just tragic.
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Mary
I certainly hope the Portugese police have some hard-fact evidence to back up their serious contention that the mother killed her child, then somehow hid it (in a foreign country I might add) for nearly a month without leaving a trace.
While the parents certainly acted irresponsible in leaving their kids unattended while they dined, I haven't seen anything yet to indicate that the parents murdered their daughter------is this the epitome of desperation on the part of the police department? If so, I hope they've got plenty of insurance. If they don't provide any evidence after going public with this statement, they'll most likely have their asses sued for millions.
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Gill
Deeskis - You could not say that a child got 'into the tablets on her own' because there is a liquid sedative available for children called Vallergan. It is a valium based sedative given to people whose children have severe excema to stop the child scratching at night.
We have five children. We have never ever ever been able to get our kids off to sleep when we want to because kids don't work like that. I find it amazing that they could confidently go out and leave their kids on their own expecting them not to wake up.
Having said that I still do not think they killed their child, but they may not have wanted the police to know their kids were sedated at night.
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core
Mary : If they don't provide any evidence after going public with this statement, they'll most likely have their asses sued for millions.
Portuguese Law would not support any action as the news of what is apparently the cause of the Police assigning these two people as "suspects" has not been released by the Police - the suspect status assigned to people means that the Police make no comment or give any information to anyone unless and until charge are laid before a court. "Suspect" status protects the person in some ways and I am surprised that the parents were never assigned that status from day one - in fact they could have requested it - giving "suspect" status opens no doors to big money claims as Portugal operates its laws as it does and has done for centuries, with little in the way of compensation culture -
On the issue of the car/blood etc - I do not think that this couple had 5 minutes out of the camera to allow them to dispose of a body 25 days after the disappearance - also the UK Police are working with the Portuguese Police which makes me think they have some sort of evidence of which we know nothing
For Mr & Mrs McCann now to scream that the Police are framing them is hysterical and ridiculous - what else did they expect at this stage given the background here. Some reports have said that the McCanns refused to answer 40 specific questions from the Police - hardly full cooperation if true.To suggest the Portuguese Police are inept fools may have some credence but to suggest they are framing someone in the light of the worlds spotlight is highly unlikely - only a court - not the Police can weigh any evidence as to guilt/innocence. Suspect status in Portuguese Law gives rights to the "suspect" - such as the right to silence - which witnesses do not have. The Police should have done this months ago -
choosing life
Until we find out what all the evidence is that the police have against the parents, there is no way to know if the suspicion of the parents in their daughter's death is warrented. It is horrible to treat an innocent person with mistrust, however. They must question the parents because too many times close relatives are involved in deaths, but they need to do it in a fair manner.
The fact that they left 3 very young children alone in a strange country while they went out to eat is extremely negligent. No fit parent would consider such a thing. I am surprised that the other children were not removed from their care. I think in the US, they would have been.
I am very sorry their daughter is missing and I hope she is found alive. If they had nothing to do with it, they must be beating themselves up for their poor judgment.
Did they say that every parent leaves their children alone at some time? If they said that, I wonder more about them.
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Gill
I would be surprised if they did not suffer some legal repurcussions for leaving their children alone.
Around 1986, a couple in the UK went out to the pub and left their six children alone in bed, supposedly sleeping. They were all under 12 years of age. They came back from the pub, about an hour or so later to see their house burning down and firemen desperately trying to save their six children who sadly all died.
They were tried and found guilty but had suspended sentences as the judge deemed they had had their 'punishment'.
Most people understand that you CANNOT leave children under a certain age, usually 12 at the very least, alone for very long at all. It just MUST NOT be done.
I would still like to understand how they could have left their babies alone.
That is the biggest mystery.
I still feel very sorry for them. After all we ALL make mistakes and not always with such horrific consequences.
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greendawn
One wonders what sort of evidence did they accumulate to make such serious accusations and publically expose someone in that way. They say they found Madeleine's blood in a rented car boot used by the mother and British police dogs trained to detect the smell of corpses picked up a scent on that car.