IS IT FAIR TO PAY THE SAME DEBT TWICE?? Divine Justice...

by Terry 139 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  Terry

  Thinking out loud...

  Justice.

  Topics that need discussing.

  Justice

  is getting what you deserve.

  What you earn you deserve.

  Your actions create reactions. If you cause harm you must restore what was harmed.

  Meaning what?

  If you do something wrong you pay or are punished; held accountable for what you've caused.

  If you don't do something wrong and are accused, then, justice is being exonerated.

  Justice

  requires a standard to which all are held equally.

  Justice requires strict enforcement or else the leniency is seen as license to get away with scofflaw behaviors.

  Historically, Justice has been divided into two categories or objects:

  1.Distributive Justice : who gets what and how

  2.Retaliative Justice: who pays for harms done and how (as well as "why")

  Let us concentrate on #2: Retaliative Justice.

  Lex Talionis

  Punishment=the wrong suffered (i.e. eye for eye, tooth for tooth...)

  The basis for Justice is the source of it and the standard itself.

  In Theology God is perfect. God's standards of behavior are perfect. God's requirements are perfect.

  According to scripture the Wages sin pays is death. Any man who dies pays the price.

  Question:

  Justice is getting what you deserve by "paying the price".

  Adam sinned and died. Adam paid the price of Justice.

  Adam's offspring all die and pay the price of Justice.

  On what basis can we speak of ADAMIC sin? How and why would it be Justice for a debt already paid to be paid twice over?

  Adam sins...Adam dies...debt paid.

  Adam's offspring sin...Adam's offspring die...debt paid.

  Where does INHERITED SIN become JUSTICE?

  How do you INHERIT a paid-for debt?
• 

  freeme

  pssshhhttt... forbidden question...

  it never made sense to me... but i always told me that it is god who created the standards.
• 

  nvrgnbk

  Nope.
• 

  MadTiger

  Jehovah did not take away Adam and his wife's procreative abilities.
  
  Is it logical to allow a perfect child to come from imperfect parents?
  
  It would be nice, but I don't see that as logical.
• 

  MadTiger

  So, in other words, we were set up for failure from the jump:
  
  We were born with the tendency to sin and owe a debt ourselves.
• 

  DJK

  Adam sinned and died. Adam paid the price of Justice.

  Adam's offspring all die and pay the price of Justice.

  We all die. Is that justice for all of us?

  I get on a plane that may crash. Is it time for all of us on that plane to die? Do all have to have justice served at the same time?

  When your brought into this world, they say your born in sin; so what!

  Death is natural, maybe a reward for the toil and pain we live, but not a punishment for being born.

  DJK(On an out of his mind day)
• 

  LongHairGal

  Terry:

  No. I don't think it is justice at all. I remember getting into an argument with somebody years ago over this. I, personally, am tired of "paying" for Eve's sin.

  LHG
• 

  MadTiger

  You aren't paying for Eve's sin.
  
  You are paying for your own sin.
  
  Eve was perfect, and choose to willfully sin and seek to break away. She paid.
  Adam was whipped, and didn't get the situation in check. He paid.
  
  We are their imperfect progeny, prone to sin and its consequences. We had no perfect parents to choose from. It was either out of Eve's womb, or remain unborn! haha.
• 

  Terry

  Jehovah did not take away Adam and his wife's procreative abilities.
  
  Is it logical to allow a perfect child to come from imperfect parents?
  
  It would be nice, but I don't see that as logical.

  Sin is behavior.

  How do you inherit behavior?

  Why would we inherit a condition of behavior?

  What is the mechanism for the passing on of this inherent nature?

  St.Augustine invented this fallacy.
• 

  MadTiger

  Good question.
  
  It brings up some points to ponder.
  
  Why do I fall short? "When I wish to do what is right,...."
  
  Is this an inherited condition? See tabula rasa AKA "Blank Slate" http://home.earthlink.net/~denmartin/bsl.html
  
  
  ---------------
  
  You are not perfect. You are subject to pay the price. It does not make sense to think you would have been born perfect from imperfect parents, unless God wanted to start over. He didn't start over.