I must say that I am very curious

by Grins 18 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • neverendingjourney
    neverendingjourney

    I'll try to be as impartial as possible.

    #14 You are discouraged from attending college

    True. Some witnesses go to college regardless. Kids are paraded on the stage during their assemblies (all day religious services), where they applauded for passing up college. Your commitment as a JW is put into question if you go to college and are generally viewed with suspicion by the congregation.

    #16 All pastors are the "AntiChrist"

    This is essentially true. Most Witnesses will object to the wording of this question, however. They believe that Jehovah's Witnesses are the one and only true religion. They also believe that all other religion is false and is being led by Satan. They now try to avoid negative PR by using loaded terms such as "anti christ" to refer to pastors.

    #17 All churches are of Satan

    True.

    #19 You cannor read Christian literature from a Christian book store

    True. Reading religious literature not printed by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society is considered religion-mixing. This is strictly prohibited.

    #31 You cannot celebrate your birthday

    True.

    #32 You cannot run for or hold a political campaign

    True

    #33 You cannot vote in any political campaign

    True. Recent information has been published to make it seem as if this might be a conscience matter, but it's not. It is prohibited and viewed as being part of the "world."

    #34 You cannot serve on a jurt

    False. This is a conscience decision. Most JWs I know prefer to cite a religious objection to jury duty, mostly because jury duty is a pain anyway.

    #35 You are discouraged from giving to charity (except Watchtower causes)

    True. Any gifts to charities with religious purposes are strictly prohibited. Donations to secular charities are discouraged. Leadership says that a better use of your money is to give to the JW worldwide work fund.

    #72 You cannot support your country

    Complicated. Many witnesses would object to the way this is worded. In short, JWs are supposed to be strictly neutral. You cannot salute the flag or serve in the military. This is the same reason why JWs cannot run for political office.

    #95 You cannot participate in a school play

    False, but complicated. This is mostly a conscience matter. If the school play does not deal with holidays or birthdays and is completely secular in nature, the child's participation is not strictly prohibited. However, JWs are strongly "encouraged" to keep their children's extracurricular activities to a minimum. They are told that allowing your child too much association with "worldly" people (non JWs) is prejudicial to the child's spiritual well-being. You won't see many JW children participating in plays. The more active and involved the JW family, the less likely that their child will participate in school plays.

    Let me just add that the degree to which it is tolerated for a JW to go undergo a route other than the "suggested" route on conscience matters depends largely on how active of a JW he/she is. For instance, if a young JW is very active in the congregation, many congregations may tolerate his going to college because he's managing to keep up with what he's supposed to be doing for the religion. It also depends on the local culture. Some congregations may not pressure their members as much on so-called conscience matters, but others pressure their members to conform as much as possible. If a young JW goes to college but is not very active in the congregation, the fact that he is going to college is often cited as the reason for his "spiritual weakness." The internal dynamics of how the JW world operates are very complicated. Its' very difficult to sum up in a one word sentence, but I tried my best.

  • greendawn
    greendawn

    Welcome, all those points are basically correct the bottom line is that the JW religion is a cult that seeks to tightly control the lives of its members while giving them in return nothing of real value.

  • purplesofa
    purplesofa

    I think spending time on this board would help you to understand JW's much better.

    It's a very complex system of beliefs and practices, some written, some unwritten.

    Welcome to the Board.

    purps

  • Jim_TX
    Jim_TX
    #14 You are discouraged from attending college

    True. Jehovah's Witness kiddos are encouraged to 'seek out' a career of door-knocking (aka Pioneering) or servitude at the publishing headquarters (aka Bethel)

    #19 You cannor read Christian literature from a Christian book store

    True. Any literature from a Christian store is considered bad... perhaps even from Satan.

    #31 You cannot celebrate your birthday

    True.

    #32 You cannot run for or hold a political campaign

    True. Jehovah's Witnesses are to consider themselves as 'no part of this world' - or somesuch nonsense.

    #33 You cannot vote in any political campaign

    True. Although... I think that they have allowed this one to be a 'matter of conscience' - translated 'if you do, you'll be privately chastised and reproved - or considered 'weak'

    #34 You cannot serve on a jury

    True. Although... I think that they have allowed this one to be a 'matter of conscience' - translated 'if you do, you'll be privately chastised and reproved - or considered 'weak'

    #35 You are discouraged from giving to charity (except Watchtower causes)

    True.

    #72 You cannot support your country

    True. If what you mean by this is 'serve' in the military.

    #95 You cannot participate in a school play"

    True.

    Now. There are 'exceptions' to every rule. In this case, if you're a very prominent person (or people) like the Williams sisters or Prince, and contribute to the WTBTS, they have a tendency to overlook many of the above listed infractions.

    Regards,

    Jim TX

  • Quandry
    Quandry

    Grins-

    Welcome and thank you for your questions. I feel that the others have explained very adequately. This one:

    #34 You cannot serve on a jury

    I believe a long time ago I was also told that if it was a capitol case and you judged the person wrongly, you could be held as blood guilty.

    Please take some time and view some of the personal stories on here. Ostensibly the WT organization looks like it is comprised of clean, wholesome looking Christian people. Many of us know now that it is because the WT Society goes out of its way to protect its image.

    You may want to ask current witnesses some of your questions, but I certainly think you will find out some of the "behind the scenes" things that go on within the organization by becoming familiar with some of the sites on the internet such as this one.

    I wondered why in the world there would be so many anti Jehovah's Witness sites on the internet when I first looked. By the way, looking at internet sites such as this one would DEFINITELY get a person disfellowshipped and shunned, hence the need to use names other than our own on this forum!!

    Please feel free to ask any questions you have. Many of us, like myself, were in the organization for many years (me-over thirty) and some held postitions in the congregations.

  • ninja
    ninja

    somebody should provide watchtower magazine quotes....I would ...but I'm a lazy swineja....

  • rebel8
    rebel8

    I used to be a social worker and am an ex-jw. I treated other ex-jws. PM or email me if I can be of assistance.

  • VanillaMocha73
    VanillaMocha73

    Here is a cross-section of what the actual Watchtower publications say. You may judge for yourself.
    #14 You are discouraged from attending college

    Watchtower 2005 - October 1, page 26 - You would need to read the whole article to get the attitude, but the upshot is pretty much given in these concluding paragraphs: (A lot of these you have to read between the lines in the publications, but we got much more direct information from the platform)
    *** w05 10/1 p. 31 pars. 18-19 Parents—What Future Do You Want for Your Children? ***

    Studies show that in many countries, there is an acute need, not for university graduates, but for people to work in the trades and services. USA Today reports that “70% of the workers in the coming decades will not need a four-year college degree, but, rather, an associate degree from a community college or some type of technical certificate.” Many such institutions offer short courses in office skills, auto repair, computer repair, plumbing, hairdressing, and a host of other trades. Are these desirable jobs? Certainly! Perhaps they are not as glamorous as some might envision, but they do offer the means and the flexibility needed by those whose true vocation is service to Jehovah.—2 Thessalonians 3:8.

    “You young men and also you virgins,” entreats the Bible, “let them praise the name of Jehovah, for his name alone is unreachably high. His dignity is above earth and heaven.” (Psalm 148:12, 13) Compared with the positions and rewards that the world offers, a career in full-time service to Jehovah is without doubt the surest way to a life of joy and contentment. Take to heart the Bible’s assurance: “The blessing of Jehovah—that is what makes rich, and he adds no pain with it.”—Proverbs 10:22.

    #16 All pastors are the "AntiChrist" Awake 2001, August 8th, page 21
    *** g01 8/8 p. 21 Who Is the Antichrist? ***

    The apostle John stated: “Who is the liar if it is not the one that denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one that denies the Father and the Son.” (1 John 2:22) Apostates and leaders of false worship twist the clear teachings of Jesus into knots of religious deceit. Such ones reject Bible truth and spread lies in the name of God and Christ. They deny the true relationship of the Father and the Son by their Trinity doctrine. Therefore, they too are a part of the antichrist

    Therefore pastors who proclaim the Trinity doctrine (99%) are indeed considered Antichrists, among many other elements (governments, etc)
    #17 All churches are of Satan

    Any religion that is not Jehovah's Witness is called Christendom or Babylon the Great. From their principal study book What Does the Bible Teach Chapter 15:
    *** bh chap. 15 p. 152 pars. 17-18 Worship That God Approves ***

    The Bible shows that all the many forms of false religion are part of “Babylon the Great.” (Revelation 17:5) That name calls to mind the ancient city of Babylon, where false religion started up after the Flood of Noah’s day. Many teachings and practices now common in false religion originated long ago in Babylon. For example, the Babylonians worshiped trinities, or triads, of gods. Today, the central doctrine of many religions is the Trinity. But the Bible clearly teaches that there is only one true God, Jehovah, and that Jesus Christ is his Son. (John 17:3) The Babylonians also believed that humans have an immortal soul that survives the body after death and can suffer in a place of torment. Today, belief in the immortal soul or spirit that can suffer in hellfire is taught by most religions.

    Since ancient Babylonian worship spread throughout the earth, modern Babylon the Great can properly be identified as the world empire of false religion. And God has foretold that this empire of false religion will come to a sudden end. (Revelation 18:8) Do you see why it is vital that you separate yourself from every part of Babylon the Great? Jehovah God wants you to “get out of her” quickly while there is still time.—Revelation 18:4.
    #19 You cannor read Christian literature from a Christian book store Read the above... The Jehovah's Witnesses do not consider any religion besides themselves to be Christian. Touching a book from another religion would be considered unclean.
    *** w87 11/1 pp. 19-20 pars. 14-16 Are You Remaining Clean in Every Respect? ***

    Some have exposed themselves to possible spiritual contamination by tuning in to religious radio and television broadcasts. In one African land, some have watched TV dramas that portray the superstitions of traditional animist religions in a favorable light. The apostle Paul, though, warned of a more lethal danger—apostate men who were “subverting the faith of some.” (2 Timothy 2:16-18) Individuals like that still exist! (2 Peter 2:1-3) And at times they have succeeded in sullying the thinking of others. As Proverbs 11:9 says: “By his mouth the one who is an apostate brings his fellowman to ruin.”

    Apostates often appeal to the ego, claiming that we have been deprived of our freedoms, including the freedom to interpret the Bible for ourselves. (Compare Genesis 3:1-5.) In reality, these would-be defilers offer nothing more than a return to the nauseating teachings of “Babylon the Great.” (Revelation 17:5; 2 Peter 2:19-22) Others appeal to the flesh, urging former associates to “take it easy” because the humble work of witnessing from house to house is “unnecessary” or “unscriptural.” (Compare Matthew 16:22, 23.) True, such smooth talkers may look outwardly clean in a physical and moral way. But inside they are spiritually unclean, having given in to prideful, independent thinking. They have forgotten all that they learned about Jehovah, his holy name and attributes. They no longer acknowledge that all they learned about Bible truth—the glorious hope of the Kingdom and a paradise earth and the overturning of false doctrines, such as the Trinity, the immortal human soul, eternal torment, and purgatory—yes, all of this came to them through “the faithful and discreet slave.”—Matthew 24:45-47.

    Interestingly, a circuit overseer in France observes: “Some brothers are deceived because they lack accurate knowledge.” That is why Proverbs 11:9 states: “By knowledge are the righteous rescued.” This does not mean giving apostates a hearing ear or delving into their writings. Rather, it means coming to “an accurate knowledge of the sacred secret of God” through diligent personal study of the Bible and the Society’s Bible-based publications. Having this accurate knowledge, who would become so curious as to pay any attention to apostate mouthings? May no man “delude you with persuasive arguments”! (Colossians 2:2-4) False religious propaganda from any source should be avoided like poison! Really, since our Lord has used “the faithful and discreet slave” to convey to us “sayings of everlasting life,” why should we ever want to look anywhere else?—John 6:68.

    #31 You cannot celebrate your birthday Awake 1981, 12/22 page 12 - The whole article is on Birthdays, but here are the most pointed paragraph:
    *** g81 12/22 p. 14 Birthday Celebrations—How Did They Get Started? ***

    Does that mean that Christians cannot have anything to do with any custom that might have originated in false religious rites? No. A great many common practices may have had such origins. But when features of the custom, as carried over into modern-day practice, go contrary to Bible principles, then true Christians must conscientiously refuse to participate.

    #32 You cannot run for or hold a political campaign Watchtowr 1956, 11/1 page 645
    *** w56 11/1 pp. 645-646 How True Christians View Politics ***

    But why should true Christians shun politics when they could do much, seemingly, to better the world? The answer is, as the Bible shows, that true Christians do not advocate or preach democracy, socialism, communism or any other form of human government as a remedy for the world’s woes. What Christians preach is a heavenly government, the kingdom of God. And that kingdom is not part of this world. Said Jesus: “My kingdom is no part of this world. If my kingdom were part of this world, my attendants would have fought that I should not be delivered up to the Jews. But, as it is, my kingdom is not from this source.”—John 18:36, NW.

    #33 You cannot vote in any political campaign Watchtower 1999, 11/1 page 28:
    *** w99 11/1 p. 28 Questions From Readers ***

    What, though, of voting in political elections? Of course, in some democratic lands, as many as 50 percent of the population do not turn out to vote on election day. As for Jehovah’s Witnesses, they do not interfere with the right of others to vote; neither do they in any way campaign against political elections. They respect and cooperate with the authorities who are duly elected in such elections. (Romans 13:1-7) As to whether they will personally vote for someone running in an election, each one of Jehovah’s Witnesses makes a decision based on his Bible-trained conscience and an understanding of his responsibility to God and to the State. (Matthew 22:21; 1 Peter 3:16) In making this personal decision, the Witnesses consider a number of factors..... In view of the Scriptural principles outlined above, in many lands Jehovah’s Witnesses make a personal decision not to vote in political elections... You would have to read the whole article to get the flavor, but the upshot is no voting unless you might get killed or something

    #34 You cannot serve on a jurt Watchtower 1997, 4/1 page 27: - This one was up to personal conscience.
    *** w97 4/1 p. 29 Questions From Readers ***

    In the final analysis, each Christian faced with jury duty must determine what course to follow, based on his understanding of the Bible and his own conscience. Some Christians have reported for jury duty and have served on certain juries. Others have felt compelled to decline even in the face of punishment. Each Christian has to decide for himself what he will do, and others should not criticize his decision.—Galatians 6:5.

    #35 You are discouraged from giving to charity (except Watchtower causes) Watchtower 2003, 6/1 page 3 - this is a unspoken rule, but of course (given the above), they would not want to donate to anything associated with religion:
    *** w03 6/1 p. 7 Giving That Pleases God ***

    There is a kind of giving that is even more important than charity. Jesus alluded to this when a rich young ruler asked what he had to do to get everlasting life. Jesus told him: “Go sell your belongings and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my follower.” (Matthew 19:16-22) Notice that Jesus did not just say, ‘Give to the poor and you will get life.’ Instead, he added, “Come be my follower.” In other words, as commendable and beneficial as charitable acts are, Christian discipleship involves more.

    Jesus’ chief interest was in helping others spiritually. Shortly before his death, he told Pilate: “For this I have been born, and for this I have come into the world, that I should bear witness to the truth.” (John 18:37) While he took the lead in helping the poor, healing the sick, and feeding the hungry, Jesus primarily trained his disciples to preach. (Matthew 10:7, 8) In fact, among his final instructions to them was the command: “Go therefore and make disciples of people of all the nations.”—Matthew 28:19, 20.

    #72 You cannot support your country This kind of goes with the political campaigns and voting, but the JWs "country" is not the one they live in. They consider themselves foreigners and part of God's kingdom only.
    *** rs p. 269 - p. 270 Neutrality *** Reasoning Book page 269

    The position of those who do not take sides with or give support to either of two or more contending parties. It is a fact of ancient and modern-day history that in every nation and under all circumstances true Christians have endeavored to maintain complete neutrality as to conflicts between factions of the world. They do not interfere with what others do about sharing in patriotic ceremonies, serving in the armed forces, joining a political party, running for a political office, or voting. But they themselves worship only Jehovah, the God of the Bible; they have dedicated their lives unreservedly to him and give their full support to his Kingdom.

    95 You cannot participate in a school play *** sj p. 25 Extracurricular Activities *** School and Jehovah's Witnesses Brochure

    School Plays: Jehovah’s Witnesses do not have any objection to acting in itself. Bible dramas are a featured part of our district convention programs. Yet Witness parents will consider a number of factors before deciding whether to permit their children to participate in a school play. For example, Is what is portrayed in the play in harmony with Bible principles? Witness youths would not participate in a play that condoned moral standards that the Bible condemns. Further, there is the time involved in practicing, and possible unwholesome associations. So in deciding whether Witness youths will participate in a play, their parents will consider these factors carefully. Between the lines here, Witness children are encouraged to not spend any more time than necessary with people who are not Jehovah's Witnesses. They also are encouraged not to do anything that will cut into the five meetings a week they must attend at the Kingdom Hall, the time they must prepare for those meetings before attending and the time they must spend in door to door service. So.. another paragraph on this:
    *** g86 12/8 p. 18 What About After-School Activities? ***

    Like Samuel, you can make good use of your time. How about using your time to help others spiritually? Interestingly, some young ones among Jehovah’s Witnesses in Japan start to make the ministry their career while they are still in school. They buy out their time before and after school to help others to know the Creator. (Colossians 4:5) Surely you would not want to miss the joy and blessings that come from such out-of-school activities. Feel the guilt tactics used here? The rest of the article talked about the dangers of things like sports and school plays and bad association.. now they are saying how much better the child's time would be spent in door to door activity?

  • VanillaMocha73
    VanillaMocha73

    Ninja: Did I do good enough for ya?

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