Discussion with Elder....a must read story (page 2)

nvrgnbk

I understand the pessimism expressed by many.

But I think this elder will be forever changed by this conversation.

Once we verbally admit to what the mind has been trying to tell us for so long, there's really no turning back, IMHO.

Vernon Williams

Well done!

The main point, and, I have been telling this to folks for a while:

You controlled the conversation by controlling the question.

Three rules for interacting with JWs:

Whomever controls the question controls all.

Do not ask a question that you do not know the answer to, in full.

If you loose control of the question, stop. Another time....

Wishing you well in your Journey and, hopefully, in time, this Elder will be your companion!

In this Struggle with you,

V

A judicial committee instigated by this guy is probably what will get him out in the future. When he sees how the operation is handled and sees that you are exed out because of his lack of confidentiality then if he's half way decent he'll be on the road out too.

minimus

Drew, I certainly hope that this man was being real to you. The problem is if the other elders knew he was speaking to you, they would naturally EXPECT that he would not in any way side in with you but would try to "readjust" you. I hope he wasn't trying to get you to open up only to use your own words against you. It would be very odd that an elder would express to a questionable person who's having doubts that he too can see your valid points. This position puts him in a no win situation. Does he show his support of you toward his fellow elders? If he does, he's forever screwed. Will he wait on Jehovah and have the other elders deal with you because he conscientously can't?? Are there 2 witnesses or more that have heard you say things that are against the Society's teachings??

Will this elder support you or remain loyal to the body?? If this guy does support you, he will be having a JC too.I wish you the best!

GoingGoingGone

My first thought was the same as Minimus'... that there would be a judicial committee formed as soon as this elder got back to the KH and came to his senses.

But this elder is already breaking some of the cardinal rules..... He visited you on a 'theocratic mission' alone! He agreed with what you said (big no-no). He expressed some of his own reservations to you (even bigger no-no!) He's obviously been doubting himself, somewhere deep down. You never know where this conversation might lead for this guy!!

Well done! You sound like you were very well prepared!

You have a pm.

GGG

justhuman

Good try.. Maybe you will help him...when I handled a letter to the elders of 10 points they didn't answer me. They DISFELLOWSHIP ME FOR APOSTASY

moshe

Good job Drew. No we will find out what kind of stuff he is made of. Most JW's crumble when they contemplate having to leave the Org and find their own way out there- not to mention having to eat a humble pie for being wrong. I hope he has the strenght to pull himself out of the WT quicksand.

dawg

Standing firm when you know you're right is the only way! Huff

greendawn

At the end of the day he can't even argue that the JWs are still a better religion than every other religion. They have got some of their doctrines better but many others are total shambles and in the practical field the way they treat their members is far worse than traditional christian religions catholic, orthodox or main stream protestant.

Johanson was expelled and is being shunned by all JWs merely for exposing the lies of the WTS on the 607 date.

flipper

Drew, it's good you spoke your mind and were firm in your convictions. But remember, all or most elders are loyal to the organization first, last and always. They can't be trusted to be telling you the truth or is it the same company line of B.S. I've had elders look sincere at me and nod their heads in agreement on points I've made just to win your trust so you can open up more to them about other interesting things that might kindle their "apparent concern in their brothers spiritual welfare", all the while plotting in their heads how they can catch you on something to form a judicial committee meeting on. Don't be duped by their apparent caring. Remember it's congregation, organization first, individual members second. If you have friends and family you care about and want to stay connected to in that religion, be discreet and fade away SSHH!!!! quietly. You aren't going to change the elders view. They are scared shitless they'll die at armageddon for listening to you. Just chill bro, just chill. Good luck, Mr. Flipper.

Discussion with Elder....a must read story