Dear Zuko,
Let me first tell you well done! You are getting your friend to think. I began to question the organization because of this very topic. I desperately searched for proof outside the Societys literature for months and months before finally concluding there is no proof other then their own publications. I gaurentee there is NO historical proof for this date of 607. In fact what your friend WILL find is that for 607 to be correct, the scriptures are wrong. The scriptures actually support 586/587, when you read Daniels account etc. I would highly recommend challenging him. Encourage him to look at encyclopedias, British Museum online etc. I am going to post my story for you to read, as well as a couple other post I made after that may help you guide your friend. It will show you how I went about my desperate search, where I looked and what I found. Perhaps it may help you. Keep us posted.
Sincerely,
Lady Liberty
Hello everyone,
It's high time I introduce myself. I feel like I know many of you already, just by daily reading your posts over the last year. You all have been a support to my husband and I, even though you were not even aware we were even here. (I tried to keep my introduction brief, as I know long post are harder to read.) I was raised a JW as was my husband. We had ALWAYS been VERY regular and VERY active in the organization. My husband had been a ministerial servant for many years. About 3 years ago my parents left the Watchtower. We were devastated to put it mildly. My father had been a elder when I was young, and my mother had pioneered many times over the years as I grew up. They also were VERY strong and active in the organization. Because of the blood issue, which directly effected my family, and the child molestation issue, they began to have very serious questions. And as you all know, one question can lead to hundreds of others. Gradually they began to miss meetings. I now know they were trying to fade out. It was hard because I felt them slipping away, but they always made excuses. I loved them non-the less. However, our paths began to get wider apart.
One day, before the summer assembly, my parents informed me that they had serious doubts. They tried to explain to me why they had not been at the meetings in so long and also why they would for the very first time in all my life not be attending to assembly. I felt like I had been run over by a bus! As they talked to me, I zoned out with disbelief, their voices became only a hum and blur in my mind. They had been the pillars to our whole family, and those pillars had just crumbled. From then on, my world as I have always known it was never the same.
From time to time I would talk with my parents, begging them to reconsider, trying to reason with them from the literature. But since they had trained me so well with the whole "apostate" thing, I followed what they had trained me to do. I rejected any "Apostate" talk. I told them I never wanted to talk about it again, to never bring it up unless I had questions for them. It was just far too painful; to try so hard to bring them back around and get them to accept "Watchtower reasoning!" They promised they would never ever bring any of this up to our daughter. She being only 10, but VERY knowledgeable in the Watchtower ways. I was very afraid they could convince her this was not the "truth" and with teen years quickly approaching, I felt we might lose our daughter to "the world." But the one thing, out of everything we discussed before I cut off spiritual conversation with them, was the whole 607 issue. I remember my mother other telling me about all the different lines of evidences that do not support 607. She told me to check out the British Museum online. So I did. Sure enough the date given there was different than the 607 that I was always taught, and had taught others. But a quick look at the Appendix’s explanation put my mind at ease. I pushed the subject out of my mind, but it came back another day.
Most of you are familiar with the movie National Treasure. Well, I loved it. After we saw it the first time I was telling my manicurist how great it was and a little about it. She informed me that there really are Freemasons. I was suprised. It made sense then, as to what all those Masonic Temples were I had seen in various places over the years. Like I do with any movie I love, I generally see it twice. While watching the movie, two things stuck me. First, the cross and the crown symbol that was once on our literature was in the movie. And second, the whole pyramid with the all seeing eye that is on the dollar bill, that too was on something years ago, wasn't it? I wondered. With those two questions, "Panders Box" was opened for my husband and me!
That night I called my mother. I said, I have a question for you. Was there ever a pyramid on any of the literature? She said, "Yes, in the Divine Plan of the Ages." Realizing that these were symbols of the Freemasons, I asked if Russell was a Freemason. She said, "There is much speculation about it. But if he wasn't, he sure used ALOT of their symbols." I said,"ok. Thank you." And that was the end of that conversation. So.. Using the "devils tool", the Internet, I began searching for Russell and Freemasons.
I know all of you know what I found. But for those who have not yet researched this, I found MANY disturbing things. Photos of Russell’s gravesite, the Masonic temple in view, as well as the Pyramid itself that Russell had the Bible students erect. What was all of this fascination of the Pyramid anyway? Well, I soon discovered, its called Pyramidology, and is HEAVILY steeped in demonism/spiritism. I still get goose bumps when I think of what I read that night! What was Russell doing involved with Freemason symbols, as well as Pyramidology??? Through our wonderful Google search engine, "the devils tool", I discovered that Russell based 1914 off the measurements of the inside of the Great Pyramid of Gehza. WHAT???!!!?? I asked myself! You have got to be kidding me?? I thought 1914 was based on 607. It had to be a coincidence! There is no way we teach 607 because of Pyramid roots! // Do we? So, getting out both sets of Encyclopedias we had, I found only 586/587 not 607! I looked in the Insight book, the Daniel book.... They all read 607! Then it all came back to me. I remembered my conversation with my mother many months prior, and I had gone to the British Museum. So I visited online once again. 586/587! The ONLY place I found 607 was in the society literature! Once again, the feeling of shock came over me. By now it was 2 or 3 in the morning. I just could not believe it! Could what my parents were trying to tell us all along be true?
So. Around 4:00am I tried to slip into bed without my husband knowing I had never made it to bed to begin with. But. He knew I had been up all night. He said, "What have you been doing?" I said," Oh.
just some research". When we finally got up I decided to share with him what I had discovered. He said, "Did you go to the Watchtower Library CD? I said, "No, I forgot about that." So he quickly pulled out the only reference to the discrepancy the society gives ...up, the Appendix to the Kingdom Come book. After reading it to me, and doing the simple math of 539 minus 70 years, equals 607, I thought, ok. I was relieved. For I knew that if 607 weren’t factual, my world as I knew it would come crashing down! As the months went by, it haunted me that the only place I found support for 607 was in the literature, and no where else was there any other support for 607. So without my husband’s knowledge, I continued to try to find support for 607. But the more I searched, the evidence continued to mount for the 586/587 date.
I started talking to my husband about it again, but slowly. As he was convinced my parents were borderline "Apostate". And truthfully, so did I. We were afraid to question the organization. My husband it seemed was irritated that I wouldn't let it go and forget the whole date thing. But I could not sweep it under the carpet. I knew what it meant if it wasn't true. The whole foundation of this organization, including the authority it demands, crumbles! So. One Saturday he once again agreed to help me. And once again he went for the old "Appendix" routine. He said kind of sarcastically, " I don't see hats so difficult to understand". He wanted to simply go back the 70 years from 539 like the Appendix says to do. So I said, "No, prove it to me WITHOUT using any of the Societies literature." He said, "Ok." After about 5 hours, and after much study of the scriptures themselves, comparing it with the Kings lists, 586/587 was the match, NOT 607! He could not believe it! He finally realized the mental problem of "Cognicent Dissidence". After that realization, every meeting became more and more difficult. We found it harder and harder to sit through the meetings. Never had we realized how much that 607 date is drilled into the Jaws heads. But when you discover you are being lied to, it’s very hard to fake it. I would get extremely mad, and my face and chest would get all flushed because of being so upset as to what was being taught.
We never meant to quit "cold turkey". But we did. And so here we are, we haven't been to a meeting in a year. It is amazing how easily we were thrown by the wayside. It really hurt, because we were so active and visible. But the only elder to call us, to see if we were ok, was an elderly brother who wasn't even a "acting elder." Where were our loving Shepherds? Certainly too busy to even pick up the phone to see if we were even alive. I know most of you who are out know those feelings all too well. Now we are on the JW "death row." It is another long story, but we are awaiting the reply from our elders regarding the discrepancy of 607. So far it has been over 5 weeks and still nothing! We kept it quiet for almost a year, but it got out, and now suddenly, we are persons of interest. However, Jehovah helped us, and I would like to share our meeting with all of you, possibly in another post. It may possibly help any that are faced with the elders.
Just a couple of others things before I close. Friends, if you are trying to help get your loved ones out, the whole 607 issue should not be taken lightly! This is the reason MANY begin to question the organization! There have been so...many of you who posted information, as well as scanned old literature that I would have never found without your help! Just knowing we are not alone, and that so many of you have gone through this whole process already, has truly helped. You never know who is reading your posts, who through your encouraging words may one day break their silence and revile they have been there all along, also being helped. So to all of you. THANK YOU from the bottom of my heart! I look forward to posting here, and maybe helping someone else as well!
Sincerely,
You’re new friend,
Lady Liberty
Hello all..
Was watching a awesome program last night called Solar Max on cable. It is a IMAX film about the solar system. They made a comment that I quickly wrote down, "The Babylonians records are so accurate that they use them today to correct computer programs." I thought that was profound, let alone absolutely AMAZING! With such accuracy, could they be 20 years off?? I DON"T THINK SO!!!
If you get a chance watch to see it, do. It is awe inspiring!!
L.L.
Hi everyone,
I just made this chart for my brother-in-law using the Bible as well as the book entitled Assyrian & Babylonian Chronicles by A.K. Grayson printed in 1975. Grayson is a world renound expert used to decipher the Assyrian and Babylonian Chronicles for the British Museum. I checked out this book from the local library. Although they had to send away to a College University for it. A interesting note: the Society uses this very book in the Insight Vol.2 under Nebuchadnezzar to support their dates. When I got this book, it was for the purpose of checking their dates and quotes of this author. As you will see by this chart, they have misquoted him to serve their own deceitful purpose! I included scriptures that support the chronicles. Like I said, I made this for my brother-in-law, but thought someone out there might be able to use it.
Have a great night!
Lady Liberty
The Seventy Years: 609 to 539 BCE
609- Nabopolassars 17 th reignal year. Babylon was dominating all surrounding nations. See Jer. 25:11, 25:17- 26. 27:6-8, 12-13(All the nations will have to SERVE the king of Babylon seventy years.) The 70 years begin. ( Babylonian Chronicle 3- BM 21901)
607- Nabopolassars 19 th reignal year. Nebuchadnessar was not even in power yet! He was only a crowned prince at this time. (Babylonian Chronicle 4 –BM 22047)
605- Nabopolassars 21 st reignal year. Battle of Carchemish , between Egypt and Babylon. Nabopolassar dies and Nebuchadnezar accends the thrown. This is year 0 for Nebuchadnezzars reign. Daniel finds himself exiled to Babylon, as well as the Royal offspring of Jerusalem, the utensils of the house of Jehovah were carried to Babylon. See Daniel 1- 2:1. Jer. 29:1,20 (Babylonian Chronicle 5- BM 21946)
603- Nebuchadnezzars second reignal year. See. Dan. 2:1
586/587- Jerusalem burned. Nebuchadnessars ninteenth reignal year. See Jer. 52:12-16 (There were still lowly ones left remaining in the city.)
562-End of Nebuchadnezzars reign.
557-Neriglissars third reignal year. ( Chronicle 6 –BM 25124)
556- Nabonidus becomes King. (Nabonidus Chronicle 7- BM35382)
539- 70 are fullfilled. Nabonidus is King of Babylon at this time. Cyrus overtakes Babylon in one night. Handwriting on the wall. Jews released from servitude. See- Dan. 5:25-26 Jer. 25: 12 ( Nabonidus Chronicle: Chronicle 7-BM 36304)
