JW Children Lie in Custody Cases

by compound complex 290 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  johnny cip

  i think this can all be summed up with the betheny ,Lawerance HUghes case the jw father wanted his girl to get blood. and the best chance for life. the WTS. stepped in with a van load of lawyers. work that would have costed $100,000'S all to pressure the court and demoralize a poor middle class working guy. the end result a dead girl. ( not saying she wouldn't have died) and broken family.

  eduardo WHAT WAS IT ONE WORKING STIFF AGAINST THE WHOLE WT LEGAL DEPT? some ODDS. everyone here knows the wts is dishonest. it seems except for you. you told me a few posts back i need to PRAY. IF YOU BELEIVE IN GOD. YOU BETTER LOOK IN THE MIRROR and get on your knees and ask for forgivness. i see you as a very dishonest man. but then again many lawyers are. john
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  restrangled

  I read something very revealing about orobus21 on another post.....His father dropped out for about 10 years, (It may be more or less) but that left him much more unencumbered to live the life most of us did not.

  This "little" fact he has left out of all of his posts, which again I would say is "disingenuous"......regarding his upbringing.

  I think most here were coming from being raised a witness by full blown, or as I used on another thread "true blue" witnesses.

  r.
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  Junction-Guy

  I just now noticed this thread, I dont have time to respond now but I will tomorrow.
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  Quandry

  Orobus-

  Thank you for your comment about my family scenario. I am glad you enjoyed it.

  I have been thinking about this situation and here's the way it seems to me:

  Before 1975, the WTS put emphasis after emphasis on the times we were living in--not too much time left, many have quit their jobs to pioneer in the remaining months we have, how wonderful, etc. They whipped up the rank and file into a frenzy. Then when the end did not come, and they were called to task, they put the blame on THE PEOPLE WHO READ THE WATCHTOWERS AND FOLLOWED WHAT IT SAID!!! They were implying that you were the stupid one if you put faith in what they published.

  Now, in this instance, you state that sure, the WTS says that witnesses should not be involved in sports, school stuff, higher ed., worldly friends, but that THEY DON'T REALLY EXPECT YOU TO BE STUPID ENOUGH TO FOLLOW THEIR ADVICE/FDS DIRECTIVES.

  Well, my husband was an elder; my child didn't do ANYTHING unless it was approved by the WTS. I observed in the KHall that any that did ANYTHING outside the directions of the WT were pulled into the back room and a warning talk was given.

  Yes, the fact that a booklet would be provided outling how to get the child to "appear" as other children shows that they are not taught to be that way and must be COACHED BEFOREHAND.

  Are you hoping to get reinstated and make it to the WTS's growing crack legal team? I think it is a possibility!!!!!
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  Oroborus21

  Gwen,

  Oro, I sort of take offense to your indicating that following the "rules" in the JW org is optional for all JWs and that if one would only stand up to the elders and oneself then they can pretty much live their life however they wanted without consequences in the JW org. That just isn't true, especially if you

  Umm i think you are confusing me with Quandry. while agree to an extent with what Quandry says and means, any outward rebellion towards the elders or the society woudl in most circumstances bring down the iron fist of punishment upon the person.

  Restrangled, you crack me up. Who do you think dropped that "little tidbit" that you speak of? Me! And its no secret. A good summary bio is available for all to read at my website.

  As to the fact that my dad went inactive during the decade that corresponded to my teens, the only effect this really had was to undermne the few times when he did try to tell me somethng about going to the meetings, etc. because I would always retort that he was supposed to be my example and that if he didn't go then neither did I have to which would leave him with no response.

  But i don't think it would have affected the general liberality my parents extended to me from when I was a small child. In part, they had 6 other children older than me, and I think by the time they got to me they had learned a lot. My siblings did not have the same freedoms that I had, though even they did to some extent get to do things like orchestra and some limited sports.

  when my dad was an elder he was in bowling leagues, etc, so I think it was just his own views and personality and that wouldn't have changed how he treated me, if he had been an elder during the 1980s.

  The other part of the story is that I always used pretty good judgment, a few run ins with the cops aside, and my parents let me make choices because they recognized that my maturity in those areas and trusted me.

  The fundamental problem with the typical JW upbringing, the one that the Society teaches, is that it doesn't allow the child to gradually accept and act upon trust. Instead Children are tightly controlled until when, as is often the case, they do have an opportunity that they haven't had before and without a history of good decision making, they often make poor choices. (Very much like the "beautiful girl" story related in this thread.) Anyway, this getting away from the topic of the thread.
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  Uzzah

  While Eduardo speaks in theoritical terms I actually worked in the Watchtower legal department and personally used this publication in preparing JW's for court cases. I helped re-write the School brochure to make it more "court-friendly" as well as some of the 'refuting' booklets (refuting claims against "My Book of Bible Stories, Your Youth etc). Little side point Carolyn Wah and Sarah Mott-Trille Hamilton were the actual individuals responsible for re-writing the School Brochure circa 1991.

  The INTENT of the booklet was to ensure the JW parent cast the best possible light before the Court and the extreme nature of the the religious expectations upon JW's was minimized.

  It was the experience of WT Legal that the majority of the JW's that actually got involved in religious issues during custody battles were not balanced nor respectful of the non-JW parent, expecting religious tolerance and freedom to be uni-directional. In fact, in some cases were not the better parent but the JW Legal team defended them just the same. So much for the "best interests of the children."

  I had some elders and one CO claim I was actually espousing apostate teachings while using these materials to prep them for Court. They disagreed with the approach and called some of the statements outright falsehoods. Amazing how they saw it (followed Society direction regardless) but a learned person like Eduardo is willfully blind to this fact.

  So let Eduardo blow all the smoke he wants, this booklet was prepared and printed with the sole purpose of deception and deceit of the courts and to coach in witness preparation.

  Uzzah
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  restrangled

  Uzzah PRICELESS!
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  Junction-Guy

  WOW!!! I could write a book on this topic, but Im gonna try to keep it brief. A big high five to Bryan, JohnnyCip, and the others who have cut through this charade like a knife. Any XJW with half a brain recognizes this booklet as outright fraud. Sure all kids have goals and dreams, but JW children are taught to repress them. I hope the children will forget their "coaching" and let it be known that they have plenty of hobbies and apirations, however they are against the parents religion. This booklet is deceitful and that is why they refuse to copyright it, because it would open their organization up to alot of liabilities It is telling the children to present to the court a different lifestyle than what they live. If a JW child truthfully told the court that they are refusing college because the end is near, or that they dont play shool sports, then only a moron judge would grant custody to the JW parent.
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  Junction-Guy

  Not through yet--------Oh and yes there are JW's who played school sports, and there are JW's who went to college, and there are even JW's who were allowed to date, but all of these were against what the WT Society teaches. JW children are coached by the Elders, by the Overseers, the talks, the Society itself, to not pursue "worldy" dreams, and only get barely enough education to get by. That booklet is lying, plain and simple. It's only natural for children to have dreams and goals, but the JW's go well out of their way to crush these. So like what Bryan said--I will call a spade, a spade. The language is very deceptive in it, and shows the true lying nature of the JW religion.
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  sf

  most of the respondents are angry because of personal experiences, ... exactly opposite of what he has posted.

  It's like denying 1975 was ever mentioned or pushed. Those who lived it and made life altering decisions based on that date are furious if they hear it denied, including my die hard JW mother. It evokes outrage from those who lived otherwise, and based on the replies only Oroborus and one other person seems to be in agreement about all the supposed freedom. I would not call it "mindless bash-the-Witnesses-at-all costs numbskulls." It is anger of those who lived otherwise and the price paid and the outrage of seeing in print what is is to be said to our justice system....by children no less! If everything is so on the up and up, children should be able to reply with out the coaching.....period!

  I.E., The Watchtower Holocaust {tm}. There will always be those that deny ANYTHING LETHAL took place. And in WTBTS case, CONTINUES to kill its members.

  {T}ED says:

  It sounds like you have a lot of hatred in your heart and I pity you. Maybe you should pray so that the Lord can bring you peace and help you to let go of the animousity you hold toward others.

  Par. Spoken like a truely devoted BELIEVER of ALL THINGS WATCHTOWER.

  (Oh and by the way in California both parties must consent to the taping of a phone conversation. I wouldn't want you to run afoul of the law.)

  I'm in California. I'll google your number. Do you consent to my taping the call? I'll be relaying any questions johnny has. Plus a few of my own.

  Hey MARY! Got a question for the counselor?

  sKally