Question for JW believers...or whoever wants to answer

by kittyeatzjdubs 25 Replies latest jw friends

  • jaguarbass

    The concept of Free Will makes no sense if one is punished for making "the wrong choice" or is rewarded for making "the right choice

    I totally agree

  • parakeet

    ***Because without that hope, what really is the point of being a jw?***

    I think that mentality accounts for the scarcity of genuine love among JWs. They don't see the intrinsic value of helping others; they see helping others as accruing more points on their everlasting-life credit ledger. All their efforts to bring in new "sheep" have fundamentally selfish motives. That's why they have no real compassion for people they don't believe will survive Armageddon. As long as they themselves survive, that's all that matters to them.

  • kittyeatzjdubs
    If all the JWs were told tomorrow that god had changed his mind, or the WTS had got it wrong..."No reward...sorry", then everybody would be boozin' and throwing their knickers off...if ya get my drift

    That reminds me of this one time when my mother and I were studying the watchtower for sunday or something. I think the article had to do w/ Jehoober's universal sovreignty (sp?) or mother turned to me point blank and asked me, ''JoBeth, if you were to find out today that there was no paradise, and that we were to serve jehovah just b/c it's the right thing to do, would you still do it?'' Of course I had to bite my tongue to keep from blurting out Hell No!....but before I could answer, she said, ''...because I know I would. This is the only true organization. We're the only people who truly love each other and who have Jehovah's blessing.''

    It was like talking to a zombie.

    ~luv, jojo

  • greendawn

    I am surprised that the JWs did not leave in droves after 1995 when the FDS had to finally admit that the generation could be indefinitely long, it could be 200 or 300 years long for example. Paradise on earth, an unbiblical concept, is indeed the major enticement of the org.

  • kid-A

    Because isn't that the golden ticket that jw's wave in front of their studies or interested ones?

    Excellent thread Jojo. IMHO, this is the basically the same "golden ticket" that ALL religious believers acquire when they adopt their own particular beliefs in the supernatural. Ultimately, religion comes down to this: an attempt to avoid the inevitable: death and an eternity of nothingness.

    As an atheist, I have come to accept the ephemeral nature of human, biological existence and even celebrate this by living my life to its fullest, realizing that it will all end and all that will remain is the legacy I create NOW, in the real world. JWs, christians, jews, muslims, etc. its all the same imaginary "golden ticket" to their own brand of some imaginary eternal life, beyond the finality of the grave.

  • south african beef
    south african beef

    I remember my mum and dad telling me that we should serve Jehovah not for the reward of everlasting life, but because we love Him and everything he has done for us.

    That was quite hard to fathom out.

    When I was growing up I always was thinking if I left now how many years of freedom would I have before the big A struck.

    Soon I started thinking that I wouldn't want to live in paradise with all the Witton losers anyway - just take a look around you at the conventions, would you really want these people as the only ones on earth?

    When I left I soon realised that it all was a load of crap and my big mistake in life was not leaving earlier.

    Woofer - I liked your answer and I thought your bio was very thought provoking and interesting. I'm so glad that like me, you are happy now.


  • kittyeatzjdubs
    IMHO, this is the basically the same "golden ticket" that ALL religious believers acquire when they adopt their own particular beliefs in the supernatural. Ultimately, religion comes down to this: an attempt to avoid the inevitable: death and an eternity of nothingness.

    Hmmm....I never thought of that KidA. That's a good point.

    So basically, if you break it down...all religion is just an attempt to avoid the inevitable. That you ARE going to die someday whether you like it or not.

    And really...what's so scary about dying anyway (unless you believe in hellfire and all that)? All that happens is that you just cease to be....maybe there's something more to it, what with energy and everything. I personally wouldn't mind being a ghost or roaming spirit or whatever. But even if you just die...who cares? Maybe I'll finally get to catch up on my sleep.

    ~luv, jojo

  • NestleBoy

    You make some good points kittyeatzdub

    I'm kinda in this situation in my life now. This possibility of no paradise hope or not seeing our love ones resurrected has been on my mind for awhile... maybe more then a year. At lease not the way the Faithful Slave describes the earthly paradise hope.

    Yes, I would still serve God and try to be a Christian. That would please the Creator and Jesus. But in NO way would I follow the organization -- that's a no brainer. I would walk away. There are so many other more socially friendly Christian faiths out there than the Witnesses.

    But I still hold out some faith and hope. If there's an intelligent Creator out there must be something better.. or least something after death. I think God will reward all those following Him and Jesus' teachings honestly. Everyone of all faiths will be rewarded and not just the Witnesses. Perhaps there is a heavenly hope. (Yeah, I know that's a different point of view from someone raised in the "truth.")


  • iamfreenow

    When you are brought up in the Watchtower Society, as I was from birth, you have the hope of eternal life in paradise dangled in front of you from a very early age. You are told to expect ridicule at school, possibly bullying, but are continously told that it will be all worthwhile in the end, because one day all the ridiculers and bullies will be gone, and you will be with your brothers and sisters in paradise.

    And you tend to believe it, because it's what your parents are telling you, what your friends in the congregation are telling you, what you are being told at conventions, and what the Watchtower's leaders are telling you, so it must be right.

    So you endure all the ridicule, all the bullying, all the disappointments, like 1975 and the 1995 generation change, because you absolutely know it's going to be worth it in the end. This terrible system is going to end soon, Armageddon is just around the corner, and after that corner is turned, all the wickedness will have ended, and you wil be living in perfect conditions with perfect health, and will be able to enjoy both through all eternity.

    Without that hope, why would anyone become a JW? There would simply be no point enduring all those things without the promise of a reward at the end of it all. I have heard people say they would serve Jehovah without that hope, because it's the right thing to do, and I have probably said the same thing myself, but those saying it haven't had that hope taken away. No one knows how they would react if suddenly the Governing Body announced that maybe the new system might not happen after all, or it wasn't going to be as wonderful as the picture they have always painted of it. I rather suspect that the worldwide figure of 6.5 million active JWs would diminish overnight if they did not have that hope. It's all that sustains most of the ones I know, and it's all that sustained me for many, many years.


  • Gill

    There is an answer to this question that I have heard from the lips of JWs at least half a dozen times:

    'Even if it's not the 'Truth', it's the best way of life possible and I will never leave it!'

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