Dating an Ex-JW

by dyone 16 Replies latest social relationships

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  dyone

  I am dating someone who recently left the JW religion. I am not a JW, nor do I align myself with any specific religious organization.

  Intellectually, it was very difficult for me to accept that he could be absorbed into what I believe is one of the strongest cults of our society, but in time I realized just how easy it was to be absolved in something that you are forced into out of fear.

  He's at a point right now where he is reading/researching various literature and discussing his experiences openly *such as boards as these* and I encourage such discussions. He does not see himself ever returning to the religion and is even willing to face that he may be shunned from his own family as a result.

  Here is where I am "stuck". I am very close to my family and I know that my parents and family will love him once they meet him and know him. However, he cannot even begin to guarantee (and I realize this is the case in most relationships) that his parent's will feel the same toward me because 1) He is divorced and 2) I am not JW. I do not know if I can be with someone whose family would merely "tolerate" my presence. Do I expect them to love and adore me? of course, but I know that's not always the case with any relationship. I just don't know what kind of future we can have where half of a family support system exists?

  Another "sticking" point. He has a 5 year old daughter who is being raised JW. How do I not get excited about Halloween, Christmas, celebrate her b-day, etc. Introducing a child to another person is difficult enough let alone the fine line I will have to walk between her mother's beliefs and her father's (and mine) desire to open her mind.

  A lot to absorb, I realized as I type this out...but this is what I'm facing. I love this man so much and with all my heart.....but is love truly enough to conquer these issues?

  Thanks for any advice/input in advance
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  thepackage

  You are going to be with him not his family. Trust me, I've been married many years, focus on him and not his parents. Also, be friendly and positive to his duaghter, you can win her over by your attitude. Don't pressure her with the holiday stuff, let her ask you about first.
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  Cordelia

  if he is willing to give up HIS OWN faimily to be with you then i think it is wrong of you to consider not supporting him just because HIS FAMILY may not accept you,

  I know its properbly hard for you to understand it all, but from my experience being on the other side of a situation like urs the thing that matters is your love fo each other it is him that is losing everything not you, surely you would support him!
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  sass_my_frass

  Here is where I am "stuck". I am very close to my family and I know that my parents and family will love him once they meet him and know him. However, he cannot even begin to guarantee (and I realize this is the case in most relationships) that his parent's will feel the same toward me because 1) He is divorced and 2) I am not JW. I do not know if I can be with someone whose family would merely "tolerate" my presence. Do I expect them to love and adore me? of course, but I know that's not always the case with any relationship. I just don't know what kind of future we can have where half of a family support system exists?

  My personal opinion is that a normal family relationship with a JW is a pointless delusion. They'll only be friends with you for as long as they think they can convert you and bring him back. When they work out that they can't, they won't be interested in you any more - you will be invisible, and they will use his daughter as a pawn to guilt him for the rest of his life. They will reject him, and still tell her that Daddy doesn't let them see her any more.

  I'm the ex-JW so I should probably get my husband to reply to this, but the short answer is, you're just going to have to deal with it. My family have disowned me and most of them don't even want to meet Mr Frass. It probably helped when I decided I don't want to see them either. I'd say the most important thing isn't whether they like you, it's whether he needs them to like him. They're not going to, and he needs to let them go, and he's not going to be able to do that if you're pretending that you can all have a normal family relationship. If that really is important to you, either find somebody else or make it unimportant, because otherwise this is the problem that your marriage will always face.

  Sorry.

  Another "sticking" point. He has a 5 year old daughter who is being raised JW. How do I not get excited about Halloween, Christmas, celebrate her b-day, etc. Introducing a child to another person is difficult enough let alone the fine line I will have to walk between her mother's beliefs and her father's (and mine) desire to open her mind.

  I don't have kids but I'm sure somebody else will pick this one up.
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  penny2

  Hi dyone and welcome!

  Leaving jw's is a difficult and emotional journey. If you really love this man and have common interests (other than just physical attraction for each other), I guess your relationship has as much chance of succeeding as any other.

  Worst case scenario is that his family will shun him as soon as they find out he is having a relationship. Sex outside of marriage is strictly prohibited and would result in disfellowshipping (and subsequent shunning by everyone including family). For this reason, your friend might currently be unwilling to disclose to his family that he's even having a relationship. Your presence wouldn't be "tolerated" - your presence would be non-existent.

  Where the daughter is concerned, you will never be able to get excited about any celebrations. However, you could set up your own traditions and make her life a whole lot happier than the average jw kid.

  There is a lot of variation between jw families - some are less strict and are willing to bend the "rules". Are there others in the family who have left? Maybe extended family who are not jw's??

  penny2
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  KennyC

  
  So far as you causing him problems;quite to the contrary, the JW's are appalled and surprised to see that anyone of any substance could love one of their ex-communiques, as they are taughyt to hate them so much, especially those that they consider "apostates". The biggest enemies of a religion are their victims.
  
  They will actually learn from you and your love of him that he is not the bad guy they paint him up to be, unless of course he is and you are just blinding yourself. Somehow, I doubt that. My wife is a gal from "the world" who I met 7 years after my being disfellowshipped for apostasy, and my family is on pins and needles because of her interest in the religion and her love of me. I also remained a virgin until I met my wife at age 32.
  
  Oh, and yes, love is more than enough to suffice in keeping a relationship with him and his his family. In fact, it is the thing that will keep them on pins and needles to keep in touch with him for important family issues. The hypocrites really don't know what to do in the face of real love, and your intrusive love from the outside may become the only thing making them treat him like a human being..
  
  
  (Not an opinion. Just the voice of experience)
  HOWEVER, if you ever get baptised as a JW they will hold YOU under their jurisdictional thumbs to make sure you do not show ANY approval of him, otherwise YOU will also be disfellowshipped.
  They will turn handstands and perform for you in order to win you over, only to put you up on a pedestal high enough for the whole crowd to take shots at you. So be careful of that.
  They love to implicate and disfellowship people.
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  LittleToe

  You're in a predicament. The chances are that they will never accept you, and the child being raised as a JW is jsut another confounding factor. If your sense of family is that strong, you may have difficulty coming to terms with this, but that's an individual issue prevailing over a couple's life.

  On the other side of the coin, if you really love him it may be that you'll come to be able to see past it. You may be able to support him in ways that you haven't even thought of, sharing the frustrations and amusement of a life continually indirectly affected by a cult.

  To a great degree it will depend on how adaptable you both are, and to what extent he's extracted himself from cult-like thinking.
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  greendawn

  At least he made the right decision to come out of the cult. His parents will probably not talk to him but will talk to you and it will be strange having parents in law behaving in that way.
  
  As for the child, so many JW kids leave the org after growing up because they can sense it has nothing worthwhile to offer them.
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  jgnat

  Here's where I am "stuck". I just don't know what kind of future we can have where half of a family support system exists?

  I have an easy question to put this in to perspective for you. Could you live the rest of your life with this man if his parents were dead? If the answer is "yes", then your investment in him is worth it. Nasty in-laws mess up a marriage only if their child lets them. So to protect yourself, have a long talk with your sweetheart about what he will do to back you up. If his parents are rude, will he cut the visit short? Will he defend you if they are unfair? If so, you can learn to live with an abbreviated extended family.

  Being a stempom is tougher. You must respect the natural parent's wishes in all things. Don't subvert their authority behind their back. On the other hand, penny's suggestion is wonderful. You can probably institute "special days", absent any overt symbolism like santas and ghosties without too much trouble. Make a list of questions to ask the parents.

  • Are pumpkins OK? Carved? Dress up, say as a princess or disney character, as long as it is not scary/creepy? How about candy? Some evangelical churches run "harvest parties" for the children around Halloween. Would it be OK for you to organize a "harvest party" with the child and some of her friends?
  • Big family gathering for dinner OK? (probably, again as long as there is no overt symbolism, and you pick another date on the calendar.)
  • Santa, Rudolf, Nativity Scenes?...at worst, you can decorate with snowflakes and icicles.
  • Valentines day. Oddly, most JW's don't seem to have much trouble with this holiday, though I think it is the most pagan of the lot. Ask if making hand-made decorations that would remain in your home would be OK.
  • Easter. This is the toughest, as there are bunnies and eggs all over the place. What about a Jesus video, or a stuffed animal (non-bunny)?

  Nice to see you around, Cordelia. Are you taking your own advice?
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  dyone

  Thanks to you all for the advice.

  This is very early in the relationship, so naturally (as with any relationship) it takes time to know what the future holds for us both.

  Do I love him? Yes, greatly. I think if his parents were deceased I would not struggle as much, but knowing his family is alive and well and would thoughtfully and purposely ignore a son because of religious beliefs is astounding to me.

  The JW religion is a cult, and the symptoms of the cult are reflected in the obscene things already being turned up from his daughter. She actually said the other day, "Daddy, mommy said you worship Satan". How sad.

  I will not intervene, supercede or persuade his daugher that her upbringing is "wrong" nor will I make snide comments in her prescense. I will have to follow the lead of my mate since he is her father and he would like to slowly introduce her to the "worldly" ideals outside of the JW world.

  We both (my mate and I) have a great sense of humor...we laugh a lot. He is ready to let go of his parents after his disfellowship but of course is saddened by it. It is, however, their loss. His sister and brother-in-law are not "practicing" JW...which seems like a living oxymoron to me...it seems they don't want to admit they are not practicing out of fear of being isolated and abandoned by community and family.

  All I can say is that what lucky gal I am to have two loving, open-minded and strong charactered parents who taught me to look at the world with an open heart and not a closed mind. I have seen where religion has affected so many people in positive ways...but the negative are far-outweighed.

  It's a sad commentary on the state of religion itself, but as John Lennon said, "whatever gets you through the night...that's all right."

  Thanks again for the advice and suggestions