Had a major blow out

by freemindfade 29 Replies latest jw friends

  • cappytan

    Dear freemindfade's mom:

    So, those children were punished because of who their parents were?

    OK, then explain this:

    Premise 1: Jehovah punished those children for their parents' sins.

    Premise 2: Jehovah doesn't change.

    If those two things are true, then how do you explain Ezekiel 18:20? When we read it in the ministry and on the stage, we usually stop at the point where it says that the soul dies. But what about the rest of it?

    Eze. 18:20 - The soul who sins is the one who will die. A son will bear no guilt because of the error of his father, and a father will bear no guilt because of the error of his son. The righteousness of the righteous one will be accounted to him alone, and the wickedness of the wicked one will be accounted to him alone.

    So, which is it, freemindfade's mom? Did those children deserve to die for their parents' sins or not? Does Jehovah change? Is Jehovah a God of Justice or not?

  • freemindfade

    Pretty sure I have been voted off the family island... well wont be getting those dumbass emails anymore.

    Cappytan, I thought about also using the criss reference where Elisha called down fire and killed 51 men, later then the apostles asked jesus if he was gonna do the same, he basically rebuked them and told them they didn't know what they were talking about. In other words, which religious stance do you choose? the blood thirsty one, or jesus? So much harmony in the bible no?

  • GrreatTeacher

    Unfortunately you can't out-argue crazy.

    I have definitely drawn a line in the sand with my mother. I don't want to hear anything at all about "the truth." If she ventures there at all, she just gets silence from me.

    She can't argue with herself.

  • Oubliette

    Cappytan: Breaking faith in the organization has to come before breaking faith in the Bible.

    This is a very important point to keep in mind.

    It seems that once people see the organization for the hypocritical scam that it is, many realize the Bible is also not true.

    Cofty: Sometimes its just too much to bear any longer. Maybe it wasn't wise but at least it was authentic.

    Another important point. They--meaning still-in, Kool-aid drinking JWs--expect us to sit and listen to their endless, inane drivel and never, ever express an independent thought or a disagreement. When it finally becomes to much we often blow a gasket and say too much.

    Been there, done that.

  • Perry
    I put a whole bunch of scriptures where the wonderful Yahweh committed infanticide.

    Which ones were those?

  • rebel8

    Someone talk me off the DA ledge.

    Ok. DAing is playing by their rules and will give them the satisfaction. You can do your own things to have closure. Make up your own ceremony if that's what you need.


  • freemindfade


    Isaiah 14:21

    21 Prepare a slaughtering block for his sons

    Because of the guilt of their forefathers,

    So that they will not rise up and take over the earth

    And fill the land with their cities.”

    Hosea 9:11-16

    11 E′phra・im’s glory flies away like a bird;

    There is no giving birth, no pregnancy, and no conception.+

    12 Even if they raise children,

    I will bereave them until no man is left;+

    Yes, woe to them when I turn away from them!+

    13 E′phra・im, planted in a pasture, was to me like Tyre;+

    Now E′phra・im must bring his sons out to the slaughter.”

    14 Give them, O Jehovah, what you should give them;

    A womb that miscarries and dry* breasts.

    15 “All their wickedness was in Gil′gal,+ for there I came to hate them.

    I will drive them away from my house because of their evil deeds.+

    I will no longer love them;+

    All their princes are stubborn.

    16 E′phra・im will be struck down.+

    Their root will dry up, and they will produce no fruit.

    Even if they give birth, I will put to death their cherished offspring.”

    Ezekiel 9:5-7

    5 And to the others he said in my hearing: “Go through the city after him and strike. Do not let your eye feel sorry, and do not feel any compassion.+ 6 Old man, young man, virgin, little child, and women you should kill off completely.+ But do not go near to any man on whom there is the mark.+ You should start from my sanctuary.”+ So they started with the elders who were in front of the house.+7 Then he said to them: “Defile the house and fill the courtyards with the slain.+Go!” So they went out and struck down people in the city.

    Exodus 12:29, 30

    29 Then at midnight, Jehovah struck down every firstborn in the land of Egypt,+from the firstborn of Phar′aoh who was sitting on his throne to the firstborn of the captive who was in the prison,* and every firstborn of the animals.+ 30 Phar′aoh got up that night along with all his servants and all the other Egyptians, and there was a great outcry among the Egyptians, because there was not a house where someone was not dead.+Date: Tuesday, February 17, 2015 at 8:36 PM

    Jeremiah 51:20-26

    20 “You are a war club for me, a weapon for battle,

    For with you I will smash nations.

    With you I will bring kingdoms to ruin.

    21 With you I will smash the horse and its rider.

    With you I will smash the war chariot and its rider.

    22 With you I will smash man and woman.

    With you I will smash old man and boy.

    With you I will smash young man and woman.

    23 With you I will smash shepherd and his flock.

    With you I will smash farmer and his team of animals.

    With you I will smash governors and deputy rulers.

    24 And I will repay Babylon and all the inhabitants of Chal・de′a

    For all the evil that they have committed in Zion before your eyes,”+ declares Jehovah.

    25 “Here I am against you,+ O destructive mountain,” declares Jehovah,

    “You destroyer of the whole earth.+

    I will stretch out my hand against you and roll you down from the crags

    And make you a burned-out mountain.”

    26 “People will not take from you a cornerstone or a foundation stone,

    Because you will become desolate forever,”+ declares Jehovah.

    Leviticus 26:21, 22

    21 “‘But if you keep walking in opposition to me and refuse to listen to me, I will then have to strike you seven times as much, according to your sins. 22 I will send the wild animals of the field among you,+ and they will bereave you of children+ and annihilate your domestic animals and reduce your numbers, and your roads will be deserted.+

    Isaiah 13:15-18

    15 Whoever is found will be pierced through,

    And whoever is caught will fall by the sword.+

    16 Their children will be dashed to pieces before their eyes,+

    Their houses will be looted,

    And their wives will be raped.

    17 Here I am raising up against them the Medes,+

    Who regard silver as nothing

    And who take no delight in gold.

    18 Their bows will shatter young men;+

    They will show no pity on the fruit of the womb

    Nor mercy to children.

    2 Kings 2:23, 24

    23 He went up from there to Beth′el. As he was going along the way, some young boys came out from the city and began to jeer at him,+ and they kept saying to him: “Go up, you baldhead! Go up, you baldhead!” 24 Finally he turned around and looked at them and cursed them in the name of Jehovah. Then two she-bears+ came out of the forest and tore 42 of the children to pieces.+

    Rebel8 you are 100% right

  • Perry

    Were not these enemies of God?

  • freemindfade
    Does that make it right? What did the first born in Egypt do to God? THEY WERE CHILDREN. Go show your god how loyal you are, go find an unbeliever and kill their kids, let me know how easy that is for you. Or what about non-kids that were "his enemy" his own people, they get out of egpyt, they have a party and give credit t to a statue. If the story were true, I guess it doesn't sound too bright, is it worthy of being hacked to pieces by your family?

    If you believe in this god, just so you know I share Mr. Dawkins thought:

    “The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.”

    Any of that wrong?
  • GrreatTeacher

    I believe that Perry is of the belief that whatever God does is moral. Because he is God and is the source of all morality.

    I know, sick and twisted, right?

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