The only way the BIG NEWS can make any difference

by Gill 11 Replies latest watchtower scandals

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  Gill

  The only way the 'Big News' can work, in that it causes the R and F to stop and think and the WTBTS to begin to crumble, is that it is tested in court....but not only with the JWs medical mis representation but through their 'Biblical Doctrine' misrepresentation and then, only by using their own bible, the NWT. JWs do not refuse blood because of the blood booklet but because of the apparant prohibition of blood in the Bible. There are many esteemed Biblical scholars who would be able to beat the crap out of the WTBTS doctrinal view on blood. They too, would only really matter if the two, the Biblical Doctrine and the Medical misrepresentation were put together to prove the WTBTS to be the charlatans that they are.

  Now THAT would be BIG NEWS! You can't have the one with out the other if you want to put the puzzle together and really get the world, including the JWS rank and file to see the 'big picture.'

  Even then, you would still have to respect the views of any JW who still wanted to refuse blood or blood products. They have the right to say NO, but only once they are honestly, truthfully and fully informed on the facts.
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  Nathan Natas

  
  I think the US court will NEVER get itself involved in evaluating a religious doctrine, and I think that they are right to avoid such entaglements.

  But the government (thus the court) has an interest in protecting the people in its care from harmful practices, and so the court has stepped in in some cases to protect minors who were being sacrificed because of the religious conviction of one or both parents. This isn't new. What is new is the idea that the religious institution can be held liable when it has distorted facts to support thier doctrines.

  Once again, the publications of Jehovah's mouthpiece turn around and bite them in the ass, spiritually speaking.
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  Gill

  Hi Nathan

  But surely, the religious facts or biblical facts and translation have been distorted also.

  In the end, it's the part in the bible that's saying 'abstain from blood' that the WTBTS depends on to leave the medical profession unable to argue with their stand. Until the real meaning of the biblical translation is revealed and explained or discussed, then the JWs will only believe what they are told to believe. They are never exposed to the reality of different argument on translation. That's why they remain enslaved.
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  Dansk

  Gill:

  Actually, this isn't correct:

  JWs do not refuse blood because of the blood booklet but because of the apparant prohibition of blood in the Bible.

  The JWs refuse blood because they are instructed to refuse by Watchtower, who use the NWT as their authority. Even without the NWT JWs would still refuse because it is Watchtower who put themselves forward as God's mouthpiece. JWs will ALWAYS put Watchtower BEFORE the Bible, so it really has nothing to do with what is published in their own Bibles. Without a doubt the R&F are INSTRUCTED to refuse blood on the basis of Watchtower dogma. If Watchtowewr came out tomorrow and said it had received new light regarding Bibiles and that from here on in all Bibles are to be ignored and that counsel would be delivered via the Watchtower and talks at the KH the followers would believe it!! It has NOTHING to do with the Bible.

  Ian
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  belbab

  Gill, I agree with you.

  Ted Jarasz decending from a platform after a talk tells the reporter We do not go beyond what is written. That is a the Big Lie and it needs to be exposed. He holds to the premise that at the mouth of two or three witnesses guilt or innocence is to be established.

  I have posted elsewhere that his premise is a lie. The Bible does give incidences where one human witness, corroborated with a second witness, that is God, establish the guilt of a wrong doer.

  The Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses, needs to be reproved before all onlookers. That includes Joe Blow Public, the Courts of all lands, the courts of reality itself, and the onlookers within their own organization.

  belbab, on looking with a vengeance.
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  Gill

  Dansk - I don't completely agree with you though I do understand what you mean. I think that the NWT is the tool that the WTBTS are able to use to control the R & F. If the tool is faulty and this is exposed then they lose any leg to stand on. With the NWT the WTBTS are able to use selected scriptures out of context to put forward their view points.

  Do you remember when the scripture on '.... abstain from blood and from things strangled.....If you carefully keep yourselves from these things you will prosper. Good health to you.'

  I remember this being used many times from the platform as a sort of prophetic scripture that proved that God knew that taking blood would give diseases to people and so they were to abstain from it. During the beginning of Aids emerging, I remember it being used a lot on the angle that god was giving his protection to his people.

  However, as blood became screened, avoiding diseases was pushed aside as one of the reasons to avoid blood and 'The Bible Says So' became the reason for refusing blood. I believe that the WTBTS were realising at that early point that a JWs reasons for not taking blood could more easily be over turned by doctors and lawyers if they gave one of their reasons as 'avoiding illness and complications of blood transfusions.. I remember well a talk that pointed out that '...if you keep yourself from these things you will prosper. Good health to you.' was NOT to be taken literally any more but just as a side blessing.

  That's why I think, though the Big News DOES show how the risks of blood transfusions are overly exaggerated...bearing in mind that IT IS STILL dangerous medicine with its risks, like all medicines, but the Big News cannot really hit the R & F of the WTBTS unless they see for themselves that the prohibitions of blood is NOT a correct translation of the Bible.

  If it is true that any court will not even look at what the bible really says, then ordinary JWs will remain hoodwinked. In the end the R & F consider themselves martyrs when they 'suffer' over the blood issue. Only if they find out that they were fooled can there be a proper turn around and stop to the NO BlOOD, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES policy.
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  Beep,Beep

  Don't think doing away with the NWT will do it as the following demonstrates. The American Standard Version, the King James Version and Young's Literal Translation also read "abstain"

  Act 15:20

  (ASV) but that we write unto them, that they abstain from the pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from what is strangled, and from blood.

  (BBE) But that we give them orders to keep themselves from things offered to false gods, and from the evil desires of the body, and from the flesh of animals put to death in ways against the law, and from blood.

  (ISV) Instead, we should write to them to keep away from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from anything strangled, and from blood.

  (KJV+) But 235 that we write 1989 unto them, 846 that they abstain 567 from 575 pollutions 234 of idols, 1497 and 2532 from fornication, 4202 and 2532 from things strangled, 4156 and 2532 from blood. 129

  (KJVA) But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

  (LITV) but to write to them to hold back from the pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and that strangled, and blood.

  (YLT) but to write to them to abstain from the pollutions of the idols, and the whoredom, and the strangled thing; and the blood;
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  outoftheorg

  Beep, in the time frame from which your quote from the bible to deal with the blood issue, a Blood Transfusion, was unheard of.

  It took about 2000 years before blood tranfusions were experimented with and found to be life saving.

  Are transfusion somewhat risky ? Yes but so is driving your automobile.

  In the time frame in which you quote from the bible it was common for people to EAT meat that had been aquired by strangeling an animal. Some people actually would EAT blood itself. These are what are condemned in the bible.

  Eating blood is like eating other foods. It is digested and the components are separated and used to nourish the body while the unusable components are excreted through the intestines as excrement.

  A blood transfusion is not a dinner or breakfast delivered to the body through the digestic tract..

  A blood transfusion can be refered to as an organ replacement. It replaces the lost amount of blood and delivers the needed oxygen to the body cells and carries other componants to the other organs

  The blood itself is not consumed by the body as nourishment. If the body was to consume the blood as food, we could not exist as our blood would be eaten up about as fast as we could produce it.

  You will have to find another argument to support your claims that God forbids blood transfusions.

  Outoftheorg
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  AuldSoul

  Beep,Beep then Paul instituted a "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy on meat sacrificed to idols... hmm...

  AuldSoul
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  Madame Quixote

  They're such big sillies. If JWs were really going to totally and completely abstain from blood, they would also avoid eating, preparing or killing for meat. They would be absolute vegetarians, as meat products all contain blood, even when drained. You can see it in your Christmas turkey while it's cooking, and in your chicken, and in your beef. In fact, part of what gives meats their flavor is blood, as well as a bit of urine and a lot of fat.