Hello everybody!
The brief version
My (jw) girlfriend want me to talk with an elder about jw-questions so i see things from multiple viewpoints and this may calm some of her concerns. I agree. What is the best way to approach this? How can i turn this into a good conversation that will benefit my girlfriend? any experiences? (im not into converting him, not even her - i just want some good conversations that she may benefit from)
The long version
Brief information -My girlfriend is a babtized jw, i am an atheist. (can be skipped) We love each other and her belief does not interfer in our daily life, however, its something she is definately not cleared up about (and which she is taking a lot of heat for by her family). I was stupid when i met her - didnt know shit about religion in general and jw in particular, so i overwhelmed her with questions and 'did you know that wts disfellowed women who was raped and did not cry for help up in the 80s' kind of facts.
This has filled her with doubts - she does not know what to believe, the thought of no salvation make her sad, she is not out and often take up lines of argumentation i have heard and read many times before in the litterature, and use rationalizations that give me the creeps (like: but they make mistakes, the light get brighter, do you think you know more than all of them, etc.). On the other hand, she has not gone to a meeting in months and has no problems with worldly people, even homosexuals.
I truly love her and want her to be happy, either a jw or not - much of my opposition against jw is that i am afraid it will strangle our relationship because her conscience will not allow her to see us. However, she is on her way out of a turbolent periode of her life, and i feel that being of two minds on such an important subject, and one which she is constantly resieving indirect blame for by her parents, is dangerous. I therefore want to help her any way i can, even if i wont like the outcome of the descision.
A pattern that often recurs in our discussion about jw is the following which i think many of you know: We have talked about a point, questions and problems have been raised, but she does not feel sattisfied with her own line of arguments. She feel that i get my arguments from places critical of jw - a onesidedness - and that, when she is not able to answer me, it may be her fault and not really a problem with the belief or argument we are discussing. now this is the thing - i abselutely have to agree with her.
I do get much of my information from critical places, i have never sat down and done a study in the way the society suggests, or with someone who are more knowledgeable about jw than i am with the (narrow!) topics i discuess, like noahs ark, which she readily admit never ment a great deal to her anyway.
She is right that it smell of interlectual dishonesty to say: "well, i am so certain of evolution/the faithfull slave was selected by God that i dont need to talk with an actual creationist who is extremely knowledgeable about the topic (though with a different perspective than me!) because he is wrong" - and at the same time talk about jehovahs witness doing the same mistake with critical litterature. And while i dont think the two situations are exactly alike, they are somewhat compareable (especially if one consider that there may be other methods than the scientific to arrive at facts, and i only accept proof from a scientific viewpoint) and certainly leave a stain, and since i want to do everything i can to calm her doubts about this i must take it seriously.
So this is where the elder come into this picture. I have met him once and he seems like really nice guy - he seem very intelligent and from our brief conversation he seemed to listen and agree with much of what i said. The other thing about him - there was some threads about jw not knowing their own doctrines - everything i know indicates he is not one of them. This is actually really good - as i said, my objective is not to look smart, or convert him, it is to help my girlfriend who want me to talk with him.
So this is it. How does i manage such a conversation? I dont believe in god. Properly never will, but i try to keep an open mind. I am somewhat knowledgeable about technical stuff and a complete moron on biblical matters (i have never read the bible). There are subjects where i feel i can hold my own and basically roll on with the arguments i presented to my girlfriend. I am certain he has rationalizations for all of them, even if they are miracles, and my girlfriend will gain very little. besides, if i was in his shoes in such a conversation, i would go completely in the defensive and it would be held in a bad mood.
What i think he wants is to begin a bible study. I think i want to avoid that for the simple reason that when i dont believe in god i think it will make the conversation very monotome. (assume god, answer question x) and my girlfriend will know about everything that comes forth in such a conversation.
I got my own idea about how i might handle it, but it was my own ideas that got me into this mess, so i think i will rather ask you guys for help and suggestions. one final thing: i want to be honest with him and not lie. i owe it to him and my girlfriend (and myself). i want this to be constructive, dammit!
oh yes, most importantly! is there anything i should avoid saying that might get her into troubles in the judicial kind of way? (i mean, besides the obvious).
ps
i have read releasing the bonds and captives of a concept... i think a study like the one in captives of a concept will be optimal, but it would be very hard to do since it would be outside his comfort zone and i think he will know what im getting at.