Lurkers and Jehovah's Witnesses- The WT Lied to you about " Generation "

by flipper 101 Replies latest jw friends

  • Billy the Ex-Bethelite
    Billy the Ex-Bethelite

    Watchtower would try to convince everyone they don't lie... it's not a "lie", it's just "untruth"... that they later "correct" with another "truth". It's a cold, hard fact, Watchtower lies and tries to cover their butts with cunning "word games" this way:

    *** w07 2/1 p. 6 Why Be Truthful? ***

    Every lie is an untruth, but not every untruth is a lie. Why not? A dictionary defines a lie as “an assertion of something known or believed by the speaker to be untrue with intent to deceive.” Yes, lying includes the intention to deceive someone. Hence, to speak an untruth unwittingly—such as giving someone incorrect facts or figures by mistake—is not the same as to tell a lie.

    Really? Wait a minute. That doesn't sound right. Let's take a look at more definitions of "lie". Researching facts wouldn't hurt, right? Never would we want to take some imperfect men's word for things like this and be "untruthed" to. The "official" Watchtower dictionary of a few years ago is quite clear...

    Webster's Ninth, [4]lie n 1 b: an untrue or inaccurate statement that may or may not be believed true by the speaker 2: something that misleads or deceives

    Wow, according to the most authoritative English dictionary, Watchtower would lie about the definition of "lie". If someone misleads others with an inaccurate statement, even if the speaker believes it is true... it is a lie!

    Even with everyone in Watchtower Corporation Writing and Teaching Departments believing and using all the weight of their authority to press everyone into believing, "Before the last members of the generation that was alive in 1914 will have passed off the scene, all the things foretold will occur, including the “great tribulation” in which the present wicked world will end." (Reasoning Book p. 97 par. 2) That was untrue and inaccurate statements that mislead and deceived. They printed this lie over and over in countless books, brochures, and magazines in earlier years. Since the Reasoning Book is still in print and unchanged, technically it is still publishing this LIE.

    reniaa said: "with generation we all thought it was true"

    Technically, I was raised a JW and was allowed no information or opinion to the contrary. I wasn't given a "choice" to believe. An older sibling didn't believe, so she was "marked". Anyone that didn't go along with their lies du jour would be labeled an apostate and expelled, shunned, disfellowshipped, disassociated... even if what they believed was later proven TRUE.

    reniaa said: "sometimes it's time that refines the wrong idea"

    You're finally starting to realize that time will prove that Watchtower is based on many, many wrong ideas.

    the slave of truth, B the X

  • Son of Man
    Son of Man

    *** w07 2/1 p. 6 Why Be Truthful? ***

    Every lie is an untruth, but not every untruth is a lie. Why not? A dictionary defines a lie as “an assertion of something known or believed by the speaker to be untrue with intent to deceive.” Yes, lying includes the intention to deceive someone. Hence, to speak an untruth unwittingly—such as giving someone incorrect facts or figures by mistake—is not the same as to tell a lie.


    I agree with this line wholeheartedly as GOD is my witness, it is an accurate statement.

    A LIE is put forth with the "INTENT" to decieve or mislead. If you relay something you believe to be true to another, you are NOT telling a lie. It becomes a lie (in the second degree) if you do not admit to it being untrue after you learn that it was false. There are many different interpretations of understandings of written words. If you relayed to me something you felt was true Billy would GOD judge you as a liar? Your heart would reveal that you felt it to be true, therefore you are not even in need of forgiveness.

    LIE
    1. a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an intentional untruth; a falsehood.
    2. something intended or serving to convey a false impression; imposture: His flashy car was a lie that deceived no one.
    3. an inaccurate or false statement.
    4. the charge or accusation of lying: He flung the lie back at his accusers.
    5. to speak falsely or utter untruth knowingly, as with intent to deceive.
    6. to express what is false; convey a false impression.
    7. to bring about or affect by lying (often used reflexively): to lie oneself out of a difficulty; accustomed to lying his way out of difficulties.
    8. give the lie to,
    a. to accuse of lying; contradict.
    b. to prove or imply the falsity of; belie: His poor work gives the lie to his claims of experience.
    9. lie in one's throat or teeth, to lie grossly or maliciously: If she told you exactly the opposite of what she told me, she must be lying in her teeth. Also, lie through one's teeth.

    the slave

  • Billy the Ex-Bethelite
    Billy the Ex-Bethelite

    LIE
    1. a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an intentional untruth; a falsehood.
    2. something intended or serving to convey a false impression; imposture: His flashy car was a lie that deceived no one.
    3. an inaccurate or false statement.4. the charge or accusation of lying: He flung the lie back at his accusers.
    5. to speak falsely or utter untruth knowingly, as with intent to deceive.
    6. to express what is false; convey a false impression.
    7. to bring about or affect by lying (often used reflexively): to lie oneself out of a difficulty; accustomed to lying his way out of difficulties.
    8. give the lie to,
    a. to accuse of lying; contradict.
    b. to prove or imply the falsity of; belie: His poor work gives the lie to his claims of experience.
    9. lie in one's throat or teeth, to lie grossly or maliciously: If she told you exactly the opposite of what she told me, she must be lying in her teeth. Also, lie through one's teeth.

    If someone speaks a false statement, regardless of what they believe, or their intent, it is still a LIE. Reality check, Son of Sam, untrue=false=lie. It's called "English", quit tampering with the language to cover lies. If you like advocating something as truth but it very quickly is proven to be a lie, but you don't want to call it a "lie", you really should become a Jehovah's Witness, you could go far, Son of Sam.

    Webster's Ninth,
    untrue adj. 3: not according with the facts: FALSE
    untruth n. 2: lack of truthfulness: FALSITY 3: something that is unture: FALSEHOOD

    "If you relayed to me something you felt was true Billy would GOD judge you as a liar? Your heart would reveal that you felt it to be true, therefore you are not even in need of forgiveness."

    Great! I truly believe that there is no GOD. In my heart I feel that is the truth. So, there is no GOD and I don't need forgiveness from a GOD that doesn't exist. I also believe that you are really a short Asian woman who works for low wages in a restaurant kitchen.

    If I were to say that GOD had inspired me with a message of truth that everyone must believe, yet in time it was proven to be untrue, false, a lie, it would prove that the message was not from any GOD. It was false prophecy, punishable before GOD.

    Do I need to show you Scripture on the punishment due false prophets?

  • Son of Man
    Son of Man

    Great! I truly believe that there is no GOD. In my heart I feel that is the truth. So, there is no GOD and I don't need forgiveness from a GOD that doesn't exist. I also believe that you are really a short Asian woman who works for low wages in a restaurant kitchen.

    If I were to say that GOD had inspired me with a message of truth that everyone must believe, yet in time it was proven to be untrue, false, a lie, it would prove that the message was not from any GOD. It was false prophecy, punishable before GOD.

    Do I need to show you Scripture on the punishment due false prophets?


    And I feel your statment is racist and disparaging to asian females. You BIGOT ! ! ! I am someone that can put you in your place with a clenched fist. And I am not working in a secular job. I have enough resources in my bank account to allow this. You will meet me face to face, I swear it, and you will acknowledge me in my day.......

    Your account should be deleted for your disparaging remarks ! ! !

    the slave

  • palmtree67
    palmtree67

    Son of Man said: "A LIE is put forth with the "INTENT" to decieve or mislead. If you relay something you believe to be true to another, you are NOT telling a lie."

    INTENT is irrelevant.

    A lie is still a lie, even if we believe it is truth when we are saying it. Just because we believe something is the truth when we say it, doesn't make it truth. Especially if it is a lie.

  • Hopscotch
    Hopscotch

    Flipper

    I remember as a child and teen in the 60's and 70's doing our Sunday door to door presentation and reading the householder the required 3 scriptures. We often used Mt 24 or the critical days one from Timothy, then Revelation 21 about making all things new or Peter about new heavens and new earth and the final one to prove that this was going to happen in the very near future was Luke 21 "This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur. That scripture was the clincher so to speak.

    Just another thing I remembered about the generation thing.

    Hopscotch

  • Son of Man
    Son of Man

    Son of Man said: "A LIE is put forth with the "INTENT" to decieve or mislead. If you relay something you believe to be true to another, you are NOT telling a lie."

    INTENT is irrelevant.

    A lie is still a lie, even if we believe it is truth when we are saying it. Just because we believe something is the truth when we say it, doesn't make it truth. Especially if it is a lie.


    Intent is a necessary element of a lie. If the person putting it forth does not know it is a lie they are innocent. As I stated, it becomes a lie (in the second degree) if a person does not correct the error if it was put forth in error. One is judged by what is in their heart. A person commits adultery in their heart if they look at another person with lust. Lust is the intent, therefore this person has the intent to commit adultery. If one commits adultery out of weakness in the flesh they are forgiven by GOD. Argue this point even with any "worldy" judge and they would agree that intent is a necessary element. Why do you hear so people that are giving testimony state "it is my belief the cigarettes do not cause cancer". In this case they are telling a lie because it has been proven that they do cause cancer. It is just their way to avoid prosecution.

  • palmtree67
    palmtree67

    So, if Billy REALLY believes that you are a short Asian woman woking for low wages in a restaurant kitchen, then THAT is not a lie?? It is the truth?? You really are a short Asian woman??

  • palmtree67
    palmtree67

    woking

    Hahaha! I meant "working", but "woking" fits, too!!!

  • Son of Man
    Son of Man

    So, if Billy REALLY believes that you are a short Asian woman woking for low wages in a restaurant kitchen, then THAT is not a lie?? It is the truth?? You really are a short Asian woman??


    No one told him that I was such, and I have already condemned this statement so please do not repeat it or you are just as guilty.

    There is no reason he should have even stated it other then him being a Bigot, and lacking respect for Asian females. What a person does for a living does not create their worth. What emanates out of their heart as a person is what creates their worth before GOD. In righteous judgement Billy will feel what they feel after hearing what he stated. This is how a person will be punished in The Kingdom of GOD. If you killed a member of my family you will know how I felt at the time I was grieving for my loved one. That is righteous judgment.

    the slave

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