Next New Light??? Heaven's Doors Closed in 1935

by Elsewhere 37 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Elsewhere

  The persistent passage of time has forced the bOrg to literally redefine the word "generation" to suit their needs (it now means any group of people within a span of time that can go on indefinitely). I'm starting to get the impression that they are going to have to do something with the 8000 or so people who insist on partaking of the emblems every year, thereby identifying themselves as "Anointed" and heaven bound.

  In recent years they have tried to discourage people from partaking by emphasizing that they could be crazy or diluted or puffed up with pride if they partook (Don't ya just love my JW speak!?!? This has obviously failed because the numbers are holding steady at about 8000 partakers every year.

  The only alternative is to change the rules again so that reality will not make the DFS and GB look bad. The simplest solution will be to simply drop the 1935 requirement. Wham! Don't deal. Problem solved. They will simply count on the fact that very few JWs will take the time or effort to do the math of adding up people who currently partake and all of those who have in the past, along with all of the tens of thousands of "spirit anointed" people mention in the bible. The few who do manage to figure this out can easily be dealt with by branding them as apostate and DFing them.

  So there you have it... a simple, elegant, and brutal way to solve the nagging problem of yet another failed prophecy.
• 

  RunningMan

  This persistently embarrasing doctrine is one of their last remaining time-sensitive teachings. In addition to the fact that the number is not behaving normally, from an actuarial point of view, they have gone on record as saying that some of them will still be alive when the end comes. So, they are kind of in trouble on both ends - if the number doesn't drop, then most of them must be fakes. If the number drops to zero, then none of Christ's brothers will be on earth when he returns.

  I would suggest that the best move for them would be to simply stop reporting the numbers. It won't make the doctrine any sounder, but at least then no one will be able to prove how stupid they are.
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  cruzanheart

  Here's an even simpler solution: redefine 144,000 as a SYMBOLIC number instead of a literal number, representing perhaps the percentage of anointed versus great crowd. Number of annual partakers would zoom, attendance would probably pick up, and all would rejoice at the light getting brighter.

  Nina
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  RunningMan

  Actually, I've never understood how there could be so many kings in the first place. A country can only have one king. If 144,000 people think they are all kings, then 143,999 must be seriously deluding themselves.
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  Elsewhere

  Is anyone aware of any quotes where they said that the anointed are all from before 1935? So far all I can find are references to the distinction being identified in 1935.

  Maybe they will pull another 1975 and say that they never actually said that 1935 is the seal date.
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  Matty

  Good point elsewhere, I've always accepted this as a fact. I always considered anyone who is a young (pre-1935) annointed person as a phoney. I would appreciate any quotes from Watchtower Publications about this doctrine.
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  Euphemism

  It's funny, you know... I've known various younger anointed individuals, and of course they--and individuals of the other sheep who respected their anointing, such as I--all hoped that the Society would soften the 1935 date. If the softening finally does come, it will be hailed by these ones as new light, and proof that the organization's errors are indeed corrected in time.

  The sad thing, of course, is that they don't correct them until external circumstances force them. Loyal dubs claim that these changes are evidence of the organization's humility; but if it were indeed humility, they would be willing to re-examine their doctrines whenever further evidence came to light. Instead, their changes are simply sheer pragmatism.

  Oh, and for those Watchtower quotes:

  w00 1/15 16

  It seems that by the year 1935, the general ingathering of the anointed was complete

  w98 2/15 20

  8

  Particularly since 1931 have those with the earthly hope been associating with the Christian congregation. In that year, Jehovah enlightened the remnant of spirit-begotten Christians to see that Ezekiel chapter 9 refers to this earthly class, who are being marked for survival into God’s new world. In 1932 it was concluded that such present-day sheeplike ones were prefigured by Jehu’s associate Jonadab (Jehonadab). (2 Kings 10:15-17) In 1934 it was made clear that "Jonadabs" should "consecrate," or dedicate, themselves to God. In 1935 the "great multitude," or "great crowd"—formerly thought to be a secondary spiritual class that would be "companions" of the bride of Christ in heaven—was identified as other sheep having an earthly hope. (Revelation 7:4-15; 21:2, 9; Psalm 45:14, 15) And especially since 1935 have anointed ones been spearheading a search for upright people yearning to live forever on a paradise earth.

  9

  After 1935 some Christians who had been partaking of the bread and wine at the Lord’s Evening Meal ceased to partake. Why? Because they realized that their hope was earthly, not heavenly. Said one woman who was baptized in 1930: "Though [partaking] was considered the right thing to do, especially for zealous full-time ministers, I never was convinced that I had a heavenly hope. Then, in 1935, it was made clear to us that there was being gathered a great crowd with the hope of living forever on earth. Many of us rejoiced to understand that we were part of that great crowd, and we ceased partaking of the emblems." Even Christian publications changed in nature. While those of former years had been designed primarily for Jesus’ spirit-begotten followers, from 1935 onward The Watchtower and other literature of the ‘faithful slave’ provided spiritual food suited to the needs of both the anointed and their associates having the earthly hope.—Matthew 24:45-47.

  10

  Suppose an anointed one became unfaithful. Would there be a replacement? Paul indicated as much in his discussion of the symbolic olive tree. (Romans 11:11-32) If a spirit-begotten one needs to be replaced, likely God would give the heavenly calling to someone whose faith had been exemplary in rendering sacred service to him for many years.—Compare Luke 22:28, 29; 1 Peter 1:6, 7.

  These statements of the 1935 position are rather soft. Other, harder statements were being made at the same time, however. E.g.:

  w99 2/1 19
  
  

  "No

  More Additions!"

  At a Gilead graduation in 1970, Frederick Franz, then vice-president of the Watch Tower Society, told the students of the possibility that they, who were all of the other sheep with earthly hopes, might baptize someone who might claim to be of the anointed remnant. Could this happen? Well, he explained that John the Baptist was of the other sheep, and he baptized Jesus and some of the apostles. Then he went on to ask whether there still was a call for gathering in more of the remnant. "No, no more additions!" he said. "That call ended way back there in 1931-35! There are no more additions. Who, then, are the few newly associated ones who are partaking of the Memorial emblems? If they are of the remnant, they are replacements! They are, not additions to the ranks of the anointed, but replacements for those who may have fallen away."
• 

  Elsewhere

  It seems that by the year 1935

  SEEMS is their loop hole... they did not say it with any certainty. You will notice that nearly everything they say in their literature now is wrapped with words like "seems", or "perhaps", or "evidently"... they have started writing everything with deniability.

  Then he went on to ask whether there still was a call for gathering in more of the remnant. "No, no more additions!" he said. "That call ended way back there in 1931-35! There are no more additions.

  Well this is just the personal opinion of a man. You notice that the WT itself did not say that. Another thing to notice is that when they want the rank and file to believe something with no evidence, they will have a "personal experience" article where some old pioneer is rambling on about their life and will say something that is taken as doctrine. The WTS can say that they did not make the statement; it was the personal opinion of the overzealous person that was interviewed. Of course that pesky overzealous person will not be DFed for apostasy even though they managed to slip their evil apostate views past the editors of the magazine.

  The WTS is becoming a religion of nothing. All of their doctrines are being wrapped with "seems", "perhaps", and "evidently".
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  Ravyn

  hey Cruzan!

  this is taken from my deconversion story:

  *** If there was one single thing that took me out, it was a careful study(with no ulterior motive--as it was something I just came upon accidentally) of Revelation 7: 9 and 11 in the WTBS' own Kingdom Interlinear. Briefly, in verse 9 it is talking about the Great Crowd, and in verse 11 it is talking about the angels. Now unless the angels are going to be on the Earth, the Great Crowd is in Heaven. The Greek word that identifies where these two groups are is exactly the same. There is not degrees of 'before the throne' indicated here, nor does the Greek word used support that stretch of a theory(for this I spoke with a professor of ancient languages at Harvard). There are other Greek words that could have been used to differentiate a different place, but that is not how the inspired writer wrote it. It says that the angels, in the circle of throne-Heaven, will worship in the same place as the Great Crowd-who came OUT of the Earth--and that place is before the throne. This is not talking about the 144,000. Verse 14 reiterates the place where the Great Crowd are, using the phrase again-and adds the phrase 'in the divine habitation of him'---so now WTBS would have us believe that not only do the angels come down to the Earth to worship but that God himself lives here? I know they explain it that his tent will spread over the Earth---but that is not what the SCRIPTURE says. The scripture says that the Great Crowd will join him in his tent. No where does it indicate that this tent will be on Earth. No where. And the logic that they use to say that his tent will be extended to the Earth is flawed logic, making scripture fit WTBS' own dogma. THAT is criminal. To manipulate the Word of God in order to cover your own butts! It sickens me. ***

  Ravyn
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  heathen

  I did hear the president of the WTBTS say in a convention @ the ft. worth convention center that the official stance was the 1935 cutoff date . This was back around 1990 at which point I had to leave the room out of disgust .They were always harping on the generation of 1914 for a long time . To accept that there can be replacements but still claim to have some sort of cut off date is completely absurd . I just can't believe they think that women can be included in that . Needless to say that there was a alot of trying to manipulate what I believed on the matter by the congregation . I was just a study anyway so leaving was not as hard for me .I just can't stand the way they treat people with objections to their obvious incompetence.