My Escape (page 6)

BrendaCloutier

Beep beep,

I have asked my parents about 1975, and they agreed that they believed the end was coming then. My dad had been an elder, and prior, a secretary.

I ran into an elder at a Salvation Army, who would not dispute the 1975 date was considered the date of Armageddon, and all he could say was that they WTBTS was incorrect in their calculations, and that "we've since received 'New Light(tm)'", and we appologized to everyone it affected!

I asked my Bro-In-Law, an active elder, and he said yes, we thought that way, don't you remember?

Beep beep. You are arrogant in your assumptions that we were all wrong and you are right.

Beep,Beep

""Well if I was a co or do and had these tapes, when 1975 came and went I would destroy these tapes and claim to high heaven "they never existed".""

Even those who left because 1975 wasn't the "End" ? Please get real. If I had such a "smoking gun"and I left because of a "failed prophecy" I would reproduce it and distribute it as far as possible. The lack of any such tapes speaks volumes to me.

There is another problem with your theory:

What about recordings in private hands, in the hands of individual Witnesses during that time? Why have no of those who left over 1975 issue been able to produce such tapes out of their private collection ? Now do you see how silly this claim is ?

Childish and ridiculous ? Funny I was thinking the same thing about those who INSIST that such was taught.

Lie about my experiences, why ? Of what possible value would that be?

outoftheorg

Beep

So thousands of people are wrong and you and only you are right.

Just keep on with your nonsense, making a fool of your self.

Outoftheorg

Beep,Beep

"You are arrogant in your assumptions that we were all wrong and you are right"

Arrogant ? Hardly but based on personal experience I know I'm right. If that's arrogant in your eyes, it is of no concern to me.

"I have asked my parents about 1975, and they agreed that they believed the end was coming then"

I've never denied that SOME did believe the "END" was coming in 1975. What I WILL deny is that it was TAUGHT.

"I asked my Bro-In-Law, an active elder, and he said yes, we thought that way, don't you remember?"

Once again SOME did think that. However the majority did NOT. All one had to do was look to the Bible, as it is plain that no man knows when the "End" will come, not even the governing body. All a person had to do was THINK!! How hard was that?

Do I expect to convince anyone here, No! But when I see something wrong I'll reply.

Beep,Beep

Well, correct me if I'm wrong but I believe more STAYED than left. What does that say for your thousands ?

Gopher

Beep, beep -- You sure have livened things up around here today!!

I have a take on some things you said.

How well can you remember 1975 or what was said about it? Having been a teenager then why don't I remember things the way you do?

People tend to remember what they want about the context of the past events. I too was a teenager, attending the congregation with my parents in the 1970's. I remember quite vividly thinking that the end was coming around 1974 or 1975, and that my schoolmates (except JW's) were going to lose their lives in a horrible Armageddon. It might not have said it in EXACT words in the WT Society publications, but all the implications were sure there. Where else could I have gotten the idea? Did I make it up by myself?

If 1975 was being taught as "The END", why were plans for District Conventions in 1976 announced at the 1975 ones ? If "The END" was coming in 1975, some go so far as claiming the fall of 1975, why print MILLIONS of magazines for the months of October, November,and December of 1975 ? Why announce when the Memorial would be held in 1976 ? Why build so many new Kingdom Halls from 1973 or abouts right on through ? With in a 200 mile radius of where I grew up 6 new halls were built during the 1974 - 1975 service year, why bother ?

You can go even farther than that! The WT Society was working on a major expansion at Watchtower Farms in Walkill during 1975, to increase future magazine printing capacity.

There are a couple of possible explanations for this:

(1) The WT Society was hedging its bets, planning for the future "just in case" Armageddon didn't happen in 1975. This would be in contrast to the many people held up as examples in WT literature at the time, who had sold their possessions to pioneer "in the short time remaining". I know of a JW engineer who retired from Honeywell just before 1975, forgoing a really nice pension, in hopes of pioneering until the end of the system. Then after a few years passed, he had to take on cleaning jobs just to keep above poverty level. He's still an elder in a JW congregation, about 80 years old and probably still working his cleaning job. How did he come to believe the end was near.

(2) Another explanation is that the WT Society really never believed 1975 was the real end. The author of the 1975 material in most of the publications and the Society's chief theologian for decades was Fred Franz. It is apparent that the 1975 date was used to rally the troops and instill a sense of urgency and excitement into the JW preaching / recruitment work.

…no man knows when the "End" will come, not even the governing body. All a person had to do was THINK!! How hard was that?

That's an easy one!! Independent thought is not encouraged among JW's, and talking to other JW's about your own thoughts is definitely forbidden. I cannot count on one hand the number of Watchtower study articles I remember that discouraged what they called "Independent Thinking". So logically, the only type of thinking sanctioned by the WT Society is Dependent Thinking -- dependent on THEM and THEM alone as God's Only Representative.

prophecor

Beep,Beep

"There are a couple of possible explanations for this:"

You forgot one, That it was never intended to come across that the "End" was to occur in 1975.

Seriously, consider this. If 1975 was actually taught and believed to be the "End" why make all the arrangements to RENT the various stadiums, Coliseums and other venues for the 1976 district conventions ? If 1975 was to be the "End", who's to say those buildings would EVEN exist in 1976 ? And who would be around to collect the rent if it all was going to "End" in 1975 ?

"People tend to remember what they want about the context of the past events"

I agree. That's why I asked how much a five year old could actually remember. Why doesn't he mention the announcement for the district conventions to be held in 1976 ?

core

And please, I know the difference between the sound of a fan and the sound of the wind.

...and I know the difference between logic and conjecture. Re the Tape of this so called overseer - never heard it - not interested - I do not rely on it to prove to me or others what the WTS said/taught re 1975

As said earlier - I was there - an elder - the PO - and know how the society made much of the date in a variety of means

If you can read the Kingdom Ministry articles urging people to sell homes/leave jobs etc to pioneer before the end and then say they did not promote this date then logic will never work.

Regarding the hypocrisy of buying in advance stadium bookings and equipment etc - nothing odd there - the society has always said it will carry on business until the Tribulation interupts - back around 1914 similar arrangements made for assemblies which should have been impossible as the end was night (as with earlier dates as well)

It is amazing that more did not leave after failed expectations - but society craftily carried on and ignored any attempt at an apology for some years - hoping the furore would go away (see Crisis of Conscience for info on this)

YES the Society did promote the date 1975 as the end - it did encourage people to mortgage away their lives to that date

My Escape

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