advice needed--please respond

by lisaBObeesa 54 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  outnfree

  Hi, LisaBObeesa's Mom!

  I think that when many on this board say "Be true to yourself" they're really talking more about themselves and how they felt they needed to react than about you and your situation. Some are strict "integrity keepers," very "black & white," and that's okay.

  I would have echoed them just a little while ago (I'm only DA'd since March) -- "Keep your integrity!" "If you're convinced it's the UNtruth, how could you stay?" etc.

  But I have left a very dear friend behind also. One with whom I had virtually daily contact (not for 40+ years, only for 7, but still...). For the last five months of our relationship I had to walk on eggs, tiptoeing (sp?) around her because SHE DID NOT WANT TO HEAR WHAT I WANTED TO SHARE. Likely your daughter and your friends would feel the same.

  If I had it to do over, I would do something similar to what SixofNine suggested (6of9 -- were YOU the one who originally wrote that stuff about hard-hitting questions and then the "Yes" re: the FDS? I recall reading it somewhere in my early quest for information. -- Beyond JW's? If so, kudos to you!). I would try the s-l-o-w fade, but with "issues", yet never, never any doubt that this was "God's organization."

  As you are already DF'd, then your thought of getting reinstated and later moving out of the area to become less and less active seems to be a good plan to me.

  I would rather still be tiptoeing around my dear, dear friend concerning religious issues, and be able to have her in my life (and me in hers) on all the myriad non-religious ones, than to feel this gaping hole in my heart. I imagine that it is much more difficult for you to be in the position of losing a child and grand-children as well.

  If you are able to harden your resolve enough to, as sevenof9 and a few others mentioned, KEEP YOUR OWN GOAL FIRMLY IN VIEW, don't worry about lying to a few men. (They lie daily, every time out in field service, every time speaking from the platform when they teach as truths extra-Biblical doctrines.) They play their games, you have a right to play yours AND to succeed at playing their game better than them!

  And there IS support here as you go along your way. There are many here that are still in and use this board to express the things they cannot say to their loved ones at this point in time and maybe never. So you have your lovely Lisa, and you have us.

  We WILL be your friends. Count on it!

  outnfree
• 

  Roamingfeline

  If you are able to harden your resolve enough to, as sevenof9 and a few others mentioned, KEEP YOUR OWN GOAL FIRMLY IN VIEW, don't worry about lying to a few men. (They lie daily, every time out in field service, every time speaking from the platform when they teach as truths extra-Biblical doctrines.) They play their games, you have a right to play yours AND to succeed at playing their game better than them!

  Hey, OutnFree,

  Good advice. When I said, "Be true to yourself", I didn't necessarily mean stay out of the Org and don't go back. I, too, see nothing wrong with lying to those idiot elders to get back in and see the grandkids/kids/friends and then making her way to inactive status. I love beating those creeps at their own game. I did the same when I was disfellowshipped. Scraped and crawled enough to get back in, then did the disappearing act. Of course, now I couldn't care less what they think I'm doing, I don't ever play by their rules and never will again! Anyway, I certainly don't blame someone else if they go back to do things their own way.

  RCat
• 

  outnfree

  RCat,

  Re: the "be true to yourself?"

  See my editing above, and...

  Good for you!

  outnfree
  (who would've said goodonya! but understands that you are a transplanted yank! )
• 

  larc

  Lisa,

  When I left, I slowly faded away. When it was apparant to family that I really wasn't a part of it, a cousin asked me why. I told her that I didn't want to get into it, because I didn't want to stumble her. This approach worked for quite awhile and bought me more time with my family.

  Remember, they taught us to use tact. In other words, be so evasive that you are lying without lying. They do it all the time in the literature and in conversation. Use that well developed skill to your advantage. That's how I would do it.
• 

  LovesDubs

  Hi Lisa and MomObobeesa :) I didnt read all of these wonderful replies so I hope Im not repeating everything. But I know a couple of things are absolutes in this whole scenario...there are 6 BILLION people in the world, and even tho it will be hard to be away from the "friends" and I use the term loosely, that you made in the Borg, there are so many WONDERFUL people outside its hallowed walls that would be TRUE friends to you. This board proves that beyond a shadow. Nobody here would leave you because some bunch of old farts in Brooklyn deemed you worm meat, threatening your friends that if they too didnt treat you like worm meat, they would be worm meat too. You dont need them. They are like old shoes, I know that, but old shoes were new shoes once too. You can make new ones. Dont be afraid to venture out of your box. :)

  The other thing is, this is not GODS organization...in fact its rules bylaws and nonsense have nothing whatsoever to do with God. Hence if you played along with its assinine rules in order to be able to talk to your loved ones, God in his WISDOM, a quality the Org lacks, would not even blink at the seeming hypocrisy of doing so. They use Rahab as their example of how its OK TO LIE in order to protect yourself or someone you love dont they? You can certainly say you are "back" without actually becoming one again. I know a man who did so for the purpose of getting his children back. The JWs had hid them...and by "going back" he got their guard down and the children once he had them again, were put into his sole custody.

  They believe they do what they need to do to "please Jehovah" and you know that the Creator of the Family would NOT approve of them tearing yours apart. She can, in my humble opinion, do whatever she deems necessary to get her loved ones back into her life with an absolutely clear conscience. AS for the friends...if they choose to continue to shun her because she isnt "spiritual" enough...dump em. You will have accomplished what you wanted anyway.

  The Society's Public Relations web page says specifically that they do NOT shun those who cease to be in the religion. Would they make themselves liars?

  Personally I couldnt pull this off...they'd get me sooner or later :)

  I know too much...theyd have to shoot me :)
  Good luck sweetie!
• 

  bwoga

  Lisa....I feel for your mom....the most important thing is that her mind is now FREE.....and she needs to be true to her own heart....I almost hate to give advice on this one....but because I understand that "torn" feeling..I have to...I would say no to getting reinstated...why put yourself through all the hoops? It becomes a circus...and if she has to go in there and lie...what kind of life is that to live???? Not the greatest advice....just my thoughts. And tell your mom......we'll be her friends!!!!!
• 

  esther

  Hello LisaBObeesa's Mom. Lisa asked if it would be morally right to go back to the JWs even though you don't feel it is God's organisation. It is if you can put up with it. After all, you are going back to renew your relationship with your daughter and her children, and your friends.

  As far as having to lie is concerned, there are many examples in the bible of people who had God's blessing but who had to lie.

  What is morally wrong is for the organisation to put barriers up in your relationship with your daughter and grandchildren. They need you, and maybe, in time, they will also discover the truth about this organisation.

  I wish you well in your efforts, and hope everything turns out right for you

  esther
• 

  WhyNow2000

  I am in a similar situation. All members of my family fleshly and by marriage are JW. I don’t believe in it anymore, but no one knows. To me this is a war. As such I take whatever steps I need to save my family - Survival. I think I can help them more by being inside rather than outside. Some people call this not being true to oneself. My mind it already free. It is the physical body that is in hostage. I had many occasion to be physically free. But I chose to stay a little bit longer to help free the others. At the end of the day, your mom has to make a decision based on her situation. There is no solution that fits all. Whichever road she plans to take, wish you well.
• 

  spinner

  Dannybear,thankyou for your comment!!

  It's truly comforting to know there are actually people who do
  care about us. You made me cry. I have had no one for years. If
  I told my story, no one would believe me, and the few who did would run as far and as fast as they could from the WT org. Believe me, they would never consider going back for ANY REASON-- They are sadistic, and are as someone put it only a money making organization.
  Because of my research, I am a great threat to their continuity. I left the org, and after 1 1/2 years, they called me and df'ed me. It does no good to just walk away. I have made great strides this year at ending this so-called religion. Babylon the Great will fall soon. Spin
• 

  unclebruce

  Spinner - You have more friends here than you realise. People here will believe your story. My life seemed pretty bizzare looking back at me from the computer screen. Even if people have trouble believing you don't let that stop you telling it how it is. (I was called a liing yarn spinner the first time I revealed a little of my background .. truth is often stranger than fiction in the land of cult mind control and, if you're honest and forthright, most here will understand and empathise with you. (even if we're a bit slack at saying so and offering a shoulder)

  best wishes and happy posting, unclebruce.

  PS: Danny is a great bloke. (he sometimes makes me cry too - usually with laughter