What New Light Are You Talking About?

by Robdar 39 Replies latest jw friends

  • Robdar
    Robdar

    Andyman stated in another thread:

    This got me thinking about the change in the 1914 generation. I remember how this was a very important point when I was studying back in the late 80's. It was explained to me over and over that this system would defenitly end before the generation of 1914 passed away. It was the key point used to show me that the END was just around the corner

    What generation change? What did I miss? I have been out of the org since 1982 except for the memorials I attended sporadically 'til 1989. Would somebody please tell me what sort of "new light" was revealed about the 1914 generation? If it has been discussed in this forum, I have somehow missed it.

    Thank you.

    Robyn

  • IronGland
    IronGland

    I'm sure someone else will post the exact text from the article, but in the oct or nov. '95 Watchtower, they stated something to the effect that "some of the brothers have tried to tie the end of this system with the length of certain generations and we would bring a heart of wisdom into the matter by not speculating, blah blah blah" As with all the other changes, they blame the rank and file for actually believing what they were told. Go figure.

  • Robdar
    Robdar

    Oh Wow. Well, I think that I need to lay down now. All the anger I am feeling right now can not be good.

    My God, as long as I have been out, the WTS can still make me want to puke.

    Thank you Irongland for updating me.

    Robyn

  • Francois
    Francois

    Blaming the victim is also a cult characteristic identified by Hoffer in The True Believer. And hating all who oppose in a "group hate" is another characteristic and useful glue in holding together a group of cultists.

    I hope someone will post the actual text. I want to see how they wiggle out of the 1914 generation stuff. That oughta be really good.

  • ballistic
    ballistic

    Basically the generation that saw 1914 does not have to be alive at the time of the end. A complete U turn. I was 'in' when this was announced, but I still didn't get it.

  • shera
    shera

    Here is a looong post here..sorrie

    *** w95 11/1 10-15 Saved From a "Wicked Generation" ***

    Saved From a Wicked Generation

    O faithless and twisted generation, how long must I continue with you and put up with you?LUKE 9:41.

    WE LIVE in calamitous times. Earthquakes, floods, famines, disease, lawlessness, bombings, horrendous warfarethese and more have engulfed mankind during our 20th century. However, the greatest calamity of all threatens in the near future. What is that? It is great tribulation such as has not occurred since the worlds beginning until now, no, nor will occur again. (Matthew 24:21) Yet, many of us may look forward to a joyful future! Why? Because Gods own Word describes a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues . . . These are the ones that come out of the great tribulation . . . They will hunger no more nor thirst anymore . . . And God will wipe out every tear from their eyes.Revelation 7:1, 9, 14-17.

    2 The inspired record at Matthew 24:3-22, Mark 13:3-20, and Luke 21:7-24 introduces Jesus prophetic description of the conclusion of the system of things. This prophecy had an initial fulfillment on the corrupt Jewish system of things of the first century of our Common Era, culminating in an unprecedented great tribulation on the Jews. The entire religious and political structure of the Jewish system, centered at Jerusalems temple, was thrown down, never to be restored.

    3 Let us now consider the circumstances that surrounded the first fulfillment of Jesus prophecy. This will help us better to understand the parallel fulfillment today. It will show us how urgent it is to take positive action now in order to survive the greatest of tribulations that threatens all mankind.Romans 10:9-13; 15:4; 1 Corinthians 10:11; 15:58.

    The EndWhen?

    4 About the year 539 B.C.E., Gods prophet Daniel was given a vision of events that would occur during the final week of a period of seventy weeks of years. (Daniel 9:24-27) These weeks began in 455 B.C.E. when King Artaxerxes of Persia ordered the rebuilding of the city of Jerusalem. The final week started with the appearance of Messiah, Jesus Christ, at his baptism and anointing in 29 C.E. God-fearing Jews of the first century C.E. were well aware of this time feature of Daniels prophecy. For example, concerning the crowds that flocked to hear the preaching of John the Baptizer in 29 C.E., Luke 3:15 states: The people were in expectation and all were reasoning in their hearts about John: May he perhaps be the Christ?

    5 The 70th week was to be seven years of special favor extended to the Jews. Starting in 29 C.E., it included Jesus baptism and ministry, his sacrificial death at the half of the week in 33 C.E., and another half week until 36 C.E. During this week, the opportunity to become Jesus anointed disciples was extended exclusively to God-fearing Jews and Jewish proselytes. Then in 70 C.E., a date not known in advance, the Roman legions under Titus exterminated the apostate Jewish system.Daniel 9:26, 27.

    6 Thus the Jewish priesthood, which had defiled Jerusalems temple and conspired in the murder of Gods own Son, was wiped out. Gone, too, were the national and tribal records. Thereafter, no Jew could legally claim a priestly or a kingly inheritance. Happily, though, anointed spiritual Jews had been separated as a royal priesthood to declare abroad the excellencies of Jehovah God. (1 Peter 2:9) When Romes army first besieged Jerusalem and even undermined the temple area in 66 C.E., Christians recognized that military force as the disgusting thing that causes desolation, as spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in a holy place. In obedience to Jesus prophetic command, the Christians in Jerusalem and Judea fled to the mountainous regions for protection.Matthew 24:15, 16; Luke 21:20, 21.

    7 Those faithful Jewish Christians observed the fulfillment of Daniels prophecy and were eyewitnesses of the tragic wars, famines, pestilences, earthquakes, and lawlessness that Jesus had foretold as part of the sign . . . of the conclusion of the system of things. (Matthew 24:3) But had Jesus told them when Jehovah would actually execute judgment on that corrupt system? No. What he prophesied about the climax of his future royal presence surely applied also to the first-century great tribulation: Concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father.Matthew 24:36.

    8 From Daniels prophecy, the Jews could have calculated the timing of Jesus appearing as the Messiah. (Daniel 9:25) Yet they were given no date for the great tribulation that finally desolated the apostate Jewish system of things. It was only after the destruction of Jerusalem and its temple that they realized that the date was 70 C.E. However, they had been aware of Jesus prophetic words: This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur. (Matthew 24:34) Apparently, the application of generation here is different from that at Ecclesiastes 1:4, which speaks of successive generations coming and going over a period of time.

    This GenerationWhat Is It?

    9 When four apostles seated with Jesus on the Mount of Olives heard his prophecy about the conclusion of the system of things, how would they understand the expression this generation? In the Gospels the word generation is translated from the Greek word genea', which current lexicons define in these terms: Lit[erally] those descended fr[om] a common ancestor. (Walter Bauers Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament) That which has been begotten, a family; . . . successive members of a genealogy . . . or of a race of people . . . or of the whole multitude of men living at the same time, Matt. 24:34; Mark 13:30; Luke 1:48; 21:32; Phil. 2:15, and especially of those of the Jewish race living at the same period. (W. E. Vines Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words) That which has been begotten, men of the same stock, a family; . . . the whole multitude of men living at the same time: Mt. xxiv. 34; Mk. xiii. 30; Lk. i. 48 . . . used esp[ecially] of the Jewish race living at one and the same period.J. H. Thayers Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament.

    10 Thus Vine and Thayer both cite Matthew 24:34 in defining this generation (he genea' hau'te) as the whole multitude of men living at the same time. The Theological Dictionary of the New Testament (1964) gives support to this definition, stating: The use of generation by Jesus expresses his comprehensive purpose: he aims at the whole people and is conscious of their solidarity in sin. Truly a solidarity in sin was apparent in the Jewish nation when Jesus was on earth, just as it marks the world system today.

    11 Of course, Christians studying this matter guide their thinking primarily by how Jesus used the Greek expression he genea' hau'te, or this generation. He used it consistently in a negative way. Thus, he called the Jewish religious leaders serpents, offspring of vipers and went on to say that the judgment of Gehenna would be executed on this generation. (Matthew 23:33, 36) However, was this judgment limited to the hypocritical clergy? Not at all. On a number of occasions, Jesus disciples heard him speak of this generation, applying the term uniformly in a far wider sense. What was that?

    This Wicked Generation

    12 In 31 C.E., during Jesus great Galilean ministry and shortly after the Passover, his disciples heard him say to the crowds: With whom shall I compare this generation? It is like young children sitting in the marketplaces who cry out to their playmates, saying, We played the flute for you, but you did not dance; we wailed, but you did not beat yourselves in grief. Correspondingly, John [the Baptizer] came neither eating nor drinking, yet people say, He has a demon; the Son of man [Jesus] did come eating and drinking, still people say, Look! A man gluttonous and given to drinking wine, a friend of tax collectors and sinners. There was no pleasing those unprincipled crowds!Matthew 11:7, 16-19.

    13 Later in 31 C.E., as Jesus and his disciples set out on their second preaching tour of Galilee, some of the scribes and Pharisees asked Jesus for a sign. He told them and the crowds who were present: A wicked and adulterous generation keeps on seeking for a sign, but no sign will be given it except the sign of Jonah the prophet. For just as Jonah was in the belly of the huge fish three days and three nights, so the Son of man will be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights. . . . That is how it will be also with this wicked generation. (Matthew 12:38-46) Obviously, this wicked generation included both the religious leaders and the crowds who never came to appreciate the sign that was fulfilled in Jesus death and resurrection.

    14 After the Passover of 32 C.E., as Jesus and his disciples came into the Galilean region of Magadan, the Sadducees and the Pharisees again asked Jesus for a sign. He repeated to them: A wicked and adulterous generation keeps on seeking for a sign, but no sign will be given it except the sign of Jonah. (Matthew 16:1-4) Those religious hypocrites were indeed most reprehensible as leaders among the unfaithful crowds whom Jesus condemned as this wicked generation.

    15 Toward the end of his Galilean ministry, Jesus called the crowd and his disciples to him and said: Whoever becomes ashamed of me and my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, the Son of man will also be ashamed of him. (Mark 8:34, 38) So the masses of unrepentant Jews of that time obviously made up this adulterous and sinful generation. Some days later, after Jesus transfiguration, Jesus and his disciples came toward the crowd, and a man asked him to heal his son. Jesus commented: O faithless and twisted generation, how long must I continue with you? How long must I put up with you?Matthew 17:14-17; Luke 9:37-41.

    16 It was likely in Judea, after the Festival of Booths in 32 C.E., when the crowds were massing together around Jesus, that he repeated his condemnation of them, saying: This generation is a wicked generation; it looks for a sign. But no sign will be given it except the sign of Jonah. (Luke 11:29) Finally, when the religious leaders brought Jesus to trial, Pilate offered to release him. The record says: The chief priests and the older men persuaded the crowds to ask for Barabbas, but to have Jesus destroyed. . . . Pilate said to them: What, then, shall I do with Jesus the so-called Christ? They all said: Let him be impaled! He said: Why, what bad thing did he do? Still they kept crying out all the more: Let him be impaled! That wicked generation was demanding Jesus blood!Matthew 27:20-25.

    17 A faithless and twisted generation, egged on by its religious leaders, thus played a key part in bringing about the death of the Lord Jesus Christ. Fifty days later, at Pentecost in 33 C.E., the disciples received holy spirit and started to speak in different tongues. Upon hearing the sound, the multitude came together, and the apostle Peter addressed them as men of Judea and all you inhabitants of Jerusalem, saying: This man [Jesus] . . . you fastened to a stake by the hand of lawless men and did away with. How did some of those listeners react? They were stabbed to the heart. Peter then called on them to repent. He bore thorough witness and kept exhorting them, saying: Get saved from this crooked generation. In response, about three thousand embraced his word heartily [and] were baptized.Acts 2:6, 14, 23, 37, 40, 41.

    This Generation Identified

    18 What, then, is the generation so frequently referred to by Jesus in the presence of his disciples? What did they understand by his words: This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur? Surely, Jesus was not departing from his established use of the term this generation, which he consistently applied to the contemporary masses with their blind guides who together made up the Jewish nation. (Matthew 15:14) This generation experienced all the distress foretold by Jesus and then passed away in an unequaled great tribulation on Jerusalem.Matthew 24:21, 34.

    19 In the first century, Jehovah was judging the Jewish people. Repentant ones, who came to exercise faith in Jehovahs merciful provision through Christ, were saved out of that great tribulation. True to Jesus words, all things prophesied occurred, and then the heaven and earth of the Jewish system of thingsthe entire nation, with its religious leaders and wicked society of peoplepassed away. Jehovah had executed judgment!Matthew 24:35; compare 2 Peter 3:7.

    20 Those Jews who had paid attention to Jesus prophetic words realized that their salvation depended, not on trying to calculate the length of a generation or of some dated times or seasons, but on keeping separate from the evil contemporary generation and zealously doing Gods will. Though the final words of Jesus prophecy apply to the major fulfillment in our day, first-century Jewish Christians also had to heed the admonition: Keep awake, then, all the time making supplication that you may succeed in escaping all these things that are destined to occur, and in standing before the Son of man.Luke 21:32-36; Acts 1:6-8.

    21 Today, the great day of Jehovah . . . is near, and there is a hurrying of it very much. (Zephaniah 1:14-18; Isaiah 13:9, 13) Suddenly, at Jehovahs own predetermined day and hour, his fury will be unleashed upon the worlds religious, political, and commercial elements, together with the wayward people who make up this contemporary wicked and adulterous generation. (Matthew 12:39; 24:36; Revelation 7:1-3, 9, 14) How may you get saved out of the great tribulation? Our next article will answer and tell of the grand hope for the future.

    [Footnotes]

    For a detailed outline of this prophecy, please see the chart on pages 14, 15 of The Watchtower of February 15, 1994.

    For further information on the weeks of years, see pages 130-2 of the book The BibleGods Word or Mans?, published by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, Inc.

    Certain Bibles render he genea' hau'te at Matthew 24:34 as follows: these people (The Holy Bible in the Language of Today [1976], by W. F. Beck); this nation (The New TestamentAn Expanded Translation [1961], by K. S. Wuest); this people (Jewish New Testament [1979], by D. H. Stern).

    These unfaithful crowds are not to be equated with the `am-haa'rets, or people of the land, with whom the proud religious leaders refused to associate, but for whom Jesus felt pity.Matthew 9:36; John 7:49.

    How Would You Answer?

    What do we learn from the fulfillment of Daniel 9:24-27?

    How do current lexicons define this generation as used Biblically?

    How did Jesus consistently use the term generation?

    How was Matthew 24:34, 35 fulfilled in the first century?

    [Study Questions]

    1. (a) What do our calamitous times portend? (b) What do the Scriptures say about survivors?

    2. The opening verses of Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 had what initial prophetic fulfillment?

    3. Why is it urgent that we heed Jesus prophecy today?

    4, 5. (a) Why were God-fearing Jews of the first century C.E. interested in the prophecy of Daniel 9:24-27? (b) How was this prophecy fulfilled?

    6. How did the disgusting thing move into action in 66 C.E., and how did the Christians respond?

    7, 8. What sign did the Christians observe, but what did they not know?

    9. How do lexicons define the Greek word genea'?

    10. (a) What identical definition do two authorities give in citing Matthew 24:34? (b) How do a theological dictionary and some Bible translations support this definition?

    11. (a) What authority should primarily guide us in determining how to apply he genea' hau'te? (b) How did this authority use the term?

    12. As his disciples listened, how did Jesus link the crowds with this generation?

    13. In the presence of his disciples, whom did Jesus identify and condemn as this wicked generation?

    14. Jesus disciples heard him make what condemnation of the Sadducees and the Pharisees?

    15. Just before and again right after the transfiguration, Jesus and his disciples had what encounter with this generation?

    16. (a) What condemnation of the crowds did Jesus repeat in Judea? (b) How did this generation come to commit the most wicked of all crimes?

    17. How did some of this crooked generation respond to Peters preaching at Pentecost?

    18. Jesus use of the term this generation consistently refers to what?

    19. When and how did the heaven and earth of the Jewish system pass away?

    20. What timely admonition applies with urgency to all Christians?

    21. What sudden development may we expect in the near future?

    [Picture on page 12]

    Jesus compared this generation to crowds of unruly children

    [Picture on page 15]

    Only Jehovah knew in advance the hour for executing judgment on the wicked Jewish system

  • czarofmischief
    czarofmischief

    I was in the car group in service when this new light was explained to me.

    I said out loud, "I'm going to become an apostate and never go out in service anymore."

    Everybody heard me. It was a big station wagon full of people.

    This produced a very uncomfortable two and a half hours.

    I was out within two years.

    CZAR

  • shera
    shera

    Hahaha,good for you.I bet a lot of people wanted to say that,but were not brave enough

  • JeffT
    JeffT

    When I first heard about this (my wife and I stopped going to the hall in 1988) I wondered what kept everybody from just getting up and walking out. I believe that one of the questions asked of everybody during the witch hunt a bethel was whether or not they believed in the 1914 date. I know that in the late seventies almost all of a congregation in the tri-cities area of Washington state got disfellowshipped for speculating that the "generation" had some sort of spiritual meaning, not refering to a specific time frame. I wonder if they got reinstated now that they are right.

  • JT
    JT

    this is what started me on my way out

    PLEASE BE SURE TO POST THE QFR for it goes into detail explaining what a generation is

    it is the combination of the study article and the QFR

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