New Zealand headquarters: Witnesses sell, Elim buys

by Fe2O3Girl 43 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  AndDontCallMeShirley

  Besty:

  I guess its difficult to tangibly help the local community with advanced technology...

  People need PDF's and Sparlock videos, not food and shelter.

  The Elim church is so misguided.

  I found this comment revealing:

  "We believe in reaching out to the community. We want this to be a centre of hope. People don't have to be Christians," Mr Ratnaraja says."

  WT doesn't help any Christians, including even its own members. This church is unconcerned with a person's religious sentiment; if they need help, the church gives it.
• 

  dozy

  It certainly is a curious decision by the society , the sale of a dedicated building to Babylon the Great , especially when they say there was a lot of interest in the property ( so presumably they could have sold the property to a non-religious purchaser ). From a bible perspective , would the Israelites been happy to sell the tabernacle or temple to the local Baal worshippers if they put in the highest bid? What would be the view on a JW who rented out a hall that he owned to the local Catholics for meetings?

  One also wonders about the brothers who gave up a lot of time & money to work on the project. How would people feel now who work hard on Bethels to be told that maybe 5 years down the line the WTBTS will sell it to another religion as a church or HQ and pocket the proceeds.

  There was a Question Box on this specific subject ( selling of a KH for use as a church) in 1969 but it isn't on the CD Rom.

  All a bit strange , and maybe shows the desperation that the WTBTS has in its current "fire sale" of international non core assets.
• 

  Witness My Fury

  I wonder what the vibe among the witnesses is in NZ over this? Surely it cant sit right, selling it to Babylon The Great etc?
• 

  Witness My Fury

  LOL, I just showed that news link in the OP to my mother, needless to say she wasnt impressed.
• 

  Listener

  That's a very good point Dozy. The building and other's like it, were dedicated to God. I wonder what the exact wording was of this dedication, was there a proviso like 'until death do us apart/until sold'? Do they undedicate the building when it is sold?

  If only dedication in baptism to the society could so easily be done.
• 

  metatron

  Kingdom Halls sometimes get sold to churches. It's not without precedent.

  metatron
• 

  zound

  Relax guys. The GB got this one covered.

  w0210/15p.27QuestionsFromReaders

  Would it be a form of interfaith to purchase a building from another religious group and convert it into a Kingdom Hall?Generally, Jehovah’s Witnesses avoid such dealings with other religions. Still, such a transaction may not constitute an act of interfaith. It may simply be viewed as a one-time business deal. The local congregation of Jehovah’s Witnesses is not collaborating with another religious group to build a place of worship to be used by both parties.

  What constitutes an act of interfaith in Jehovah’s eyes? Consider the apostle Paul’s direction: "Do not become unevenly yoked with unbelievers. For what fellowship do righteousness and lawlessness have? Or what sharing does light have with darkness? Further, what harmony is there between Christ and Belial? Or what portion does a faithful person have with an unbeliever? And what agreement does God’s temple have with idols? . . . ‘Therefore get out from among them, and separate yourselves,’ says Jehovah, ‘and quit touching the unclean thing’; ‘and I will take you in.’" (2 Corinthians 6:14-17) What did Paul mean by the words "fellowship" and "sharing"?

  The fellowship that Paul mentions clearly involves worship and spiritual dealings with idolaters and unbelievers. He warned the Corinthians against "partaking of . . . the table of demons." (1 Corinthians 10:20, 21) Thus, an act of interfaith is that of sharing in worship or of having spiritual communion with other religious organizations. (Exodus 20:5; 23:13; 34:12) When a building that was used by a religious organization is purchased, this is done simply to acquire the basic structure needed for a Kingdom Hall. Before being used as a Kingdom Hall, it is cleared of any relics of false worship. Being thus adjusted, it is dedicated to Jehovah for the sole purpose of worshiping him. There is no sharing or fellowship between true and false worship.

  In working out the details regarding such a purchase, contact with the other party should be kept to a minimum and should be strictly business. Members of the Christian congregation do well to bear in mind Paul’s warning not to become "unevenly yoked with unbelievers." Although we do not feel superior to those who profess other faiths, we avoid socializing with them or getting drawn into their worship.

  What of a congregation’s renting a building that belongs to a religious organization? Renting usually incurs regular contact, which is to be avoided. Even to rent such a building for just one event, the body of elders should consider the following: Will there be any idols and religious symbols inside or outside the building? How will people in the community view our use of the facility? Will anyone in the congregation be stumbled by our using this building? (Matthew 18:6; 1 Corinthians 8:7-13) The elders evaluate these factors and then decide accordingly. Their own conscience and that of the congregation in general must also be taken into account in determining whether to purchase and convert such a building into a Kingdom Hall.

  [Footnote]

  See TheWatchtower, April 15, 1999, pages 28 and 29, for information on the appropriateness of business dealings with organizations that are disapproved by Jehovah.
• 

  LogCon

  "We had favour with the Jehovah's Witnesses. They wanted to give it to a faith-based organisation."

  Assuming that the Watchtower representatives did not speak directly to the representatives of the false religious organisation we can logically assume that the following may have occurred.

  A number of conversations took place between the Watchtower representatives and their real estate agent[s]. Their real estate agent[s] would then relay the contents of these conversations to the representatives of the false religion [or their agents] interested in purchasing the property.

  The questions that arise are the following:

  1 - If the false religious organisation is correct in their understanding that the Jehovahs' Witnesses did show them special favour, what words did the Watchtower use to convey such information?

  2 - Would these words constitute a breech of adherence to pure worship, such as would be supported by numerous scriptures?

  3 - Could those Jehovahs' Witnesses who uttered these words, at whatever level or position they occupy, be guilty of a disfellowshipping offense?

  4 - Would it be possible to find out the identity of this real estate agent and question them about the Watchtowers' attitude to the Elim Church?

  5 - Could someone approach the Elim Church and asked them what lead them to understand that the Watchtower favoured them?

  We need someone to play the detective, to make innocent inquiries into the matter and then report your findings to this forum.

  Thanks for you help.
• 

  steve2

  Well, it has been observed before that the human desire/desperation to sell goods and services has made harlots out of the best of humankind. When people show an interest in buying your goods and services, treat 'em well - in fact, treat 'em like royalty. This is not the time to tell 'em you cannot stand their guts and consider their beliefs not just false but also satanic. Oh, the things the best of us do to secure a profitable sale.

  The sale of the Watchtower property to a church of Babylon is hardly newsworthy - as Blondie showed, the Watchtower has a conveniently well-articulated policy on the matter. Rather, what is newsworthy is the prostitution of so-called religious values in which the Watchtower, a group notoriously critical of all other religious groups, has buttered up a buyer that,in any other context, it would have avoided like the plague. Cash makes prostitutes of the "best" of us. Everything else is hypocrisy.
• 

  Witchettygrub

  They actually sold a Bethel location, to BABYLON THE GREAT????

  Money talks....and wins always.

  Witchettygrub