by Billy the Ex-Bethelite 41 Replies latest jw friends
Billy the X, What a smart and hard working son you are.
I just wanted to share a little something with you.
The 30 years I knew my in-laws, going to summer district conventions, this was their routine.
Get up extra early. Go to convention site early for best seats. Visit. Program starts. Fall fast asleep. Wake up to clapping and singing, then back asleep.
Rinse. Repeat.
They never knew what the program was about.
Just Lois
I'm pretty sure I flunked all your exJW Psych courses, B the X. Still not good at keeping my cool over these issues. It's like a furnace with a neverending flame, that sometimes gets subdued, but can never really be put out...
In fact, I don't get the sense that even some of the elders on my JC entirely kept their cool... I guess if I think back on what I said to them, I probably did throw a zinger or two out there that might've gotten under the chairman's skin a bit, you know, like throwing his own words back at him and all...
Ah, well. Too late to be cool about it now. But it would be healthier to find peace with this sort of stuff.
Also, I haven't been much of a son to my parents since leaving home. I haven't even really felt able to give them a call on the phone, even though my dad's never been a JW. Part of me never even wants to talk to my mom again in life. Hell, all of me never even wants to talk to my mom again in life. Or any of my other JW relatives, probably my wife included, terrible as that is to say.
I was used to getting bullied, either emotionally or physically, most of my life. Honestly, it's past time for me to get mad and be vocal about something for once. I've wanted to handle things more like you've done. I just f***ed it all up and never had the chance.
Whatever the case, thank you for writing this stuff down. I hope it helps other folks who have more self-control than I did.
--sd-7
I've told this story before, but I think it's worth recounting here. This happened back when I was young and it was a sibling that recounted it to me only about a year ago. To me it was a rather matter-of-fact event that I'd long forgotten.
I rarely got into trouble... like my siblings did. When Dad was mad, he'd give the silent treatment. It tore my siblings to pieces. Sometime when I'd done something that he didn't like, he gave me the silent treatment. This sibling remembers saying to me while we were all at the dinner table, "Dad's giving you the silent treatment, aren't you upset?"
My indifferent response, as she recalls, "I really don't want to talk to him anyway."
That was the last time that he used the silent treatment. I don't remember it after that from him. One of my sisters tried giving me the silent treatment when she was mad at me, but she "gave up" on it long before I would have. And I'm sure our parents were more upset by what was happening than either of us kids were. How could my parents condemn me/us for being "passive aggressive" when they had taught us how to use it? So, as I've said before, I'd disfellowship the congregation before they could disfellowship me.
Billy=99%"nice guy"+1%"heartless SOB"... it's that 1% that makes all the difference.
Although I was smart, funny, and kind, I think my parents were afraid I'd become an a$shole if they kept setting a "traditional JW" example. Sure, they might be happy if I was still attending meetings, but at what cost? There are so many JWs in their congregation that they would never want as children. And so many of the kids we've grown up have faded, nobody in the congregation makes that much of a deal about it, I think.
sd7: "I haven't even really felt able to give them a call on the phone, even though my dad's never been a JW."
There have been several times when I called as a matter of principle, rather than out of desire. Sometimes the calls were brief, just checking in on their health. In my case, my parents have become so lonely that they are starved for human contact and will sometimes talk for hours without WT issues coming up. I always feel better after talking to them, even if the conversation didn't go great. In the end, I know I did the right thing.
"I just f***ed it all up and never had the chance. "
And there have been several times when I thought, "I've really f***ed things up now!" But I've taken the chance by reaching out, and in my case, by parents have reached back. It makes Sparlock sad when people don't believe in the magic of unf***ing things up. [I need a Sparlock emoticon here. LOL]
And I certainly don't mean to sound preachy that my psychology will always work, or that it's the only way to fade, or the only way to leave. Frankly, there's lots of right ways to get out of the cult. And I've heard of enough nutso JW families where I'd just tie the relationship up in a bag with several rocks and dump it in the lake.
Lois: "Get up extra early. Go to convention site early for best seats. Visit. Program starts. Fall fast asleep. Wake up to clapping and singing, then back asleep."
My folks would usually stay awake and take notes, but I don't think they do anymore. There used to be a convention review during the Service Meeting, but I think that's pretty well eliminated, so there wasn't much point of taking notes.
And I'm wondering if the "no education" topic was hit hard at their DC. That's something they don't agree with. How can they go to doctors and take medicine, yet condemn the higher education that makes that possible? And all this new emphasis on technology and electronics rather than the printed word. It's not the JWs on public aid that are coming up with these advances.
Hello Billiy:
Great thread you wrote for us. We can all learn a thing or two from this. It's always good to remain calm cool and collective at all times anyway. What a better way to help those on the inside that who desperately need our help. We have to show them were the ones with the Christian personality. Thanks again.
Adventurousone
Awesome post Billy! Really liked this part: "Even though I am tempted to rant and rave in anger over WT policies, teaching, and practices, I avoid the impression of anger toward WT, it's much more about frustration, I suppose."
You're completely right, being angry and yelling will only serve to close the other persons mind to whatever it was you wanted to say.
After reading and thinking about Laika's situation, I thought I'd add another thought.
A common expression in our family, which I think I've used here before is:
"A man convinced against his will,
is of the same opinion still."
I've not made it a priority to get my parents completely out of the organization and joining another church or becoming atheist. They're elderly and that would be a huge, traumatic event for them. From the start, I needed first to be understood. Second, I needed to be respected. Neither would be particularly easy, given the programmed JW mentality, but with time and patience, things have developed.
I knew it would be pointless to come to them with a huge list of doctrinal errors of the organization. Instead, as I've blathered on about in Psych 102, I pointed out that there are questions the organization hasn't answered, but need to. All I wanted to do was get them to understand, and realize that it wasn't their place to try to justify or speculate on answers beyond what WT has printed. Some other things were discussed, but I could tell that they weren't allowing themselves to understand certain things. It was turning into an "argument" with nobody being convinced of anything, so I gave up trying to convince them of many doctrinal points. I found two things they understood clearly. These were that WT policies on education and handling cases of child molestation are wrong. They came to understand and respect the fact that these things were something I couldn't tolerate. In return, I understood and respected the fact that they would never follow or enforce such policies.
Perhaps two other things also worth mentioning are that at some moment in our conversation, they stated, "well, the brothers are imperfect, there will be some mistakes." I was waiting for those words and it was my green light to repeat them, "yes, I know very well that they are imperfect, and I cannot pretend that they are perfect." And later repeated them again, "well, the brothers are imperfect, there will be some mistakes. So there's no point in arguing about what is printed in the Watchtower, because it could easily be another mistake and be completely changed in an upcoming article." Ironically, I used that line when the subject of the FDS came up a year ago. Serendipitously, that very subject was revised at the Annual Meeting a few months later.
Of course, it's not an ideal situation where they have learned TTATT and come out of the bOrg. But at least I feel that I'm understood and respected, and we still have a relationship, and I am happy for that.
Thank you Billy, for taking the time to write that, I'm not desperate to pull my parents out either, although as you say, it would be the ideal, but I accept their choices.
I just want to live a normal relationship with them, one where every conversation doesn't descend into an argument... understanding and respect would do me, I hope to get that with time.
I swear I try. My bipolarism WILL flare up in the presence of stupidity though.
I'm sick and tired of prancing around this idiotic and toxic confidence in this corporate cult!
I will NOT be gagged by the superstition of demonized inquiry the the Borg imposes on the weak .
I do NOT want to explode anymore... hence, my family is dead to me. Period.
Im glad this thread has been revived! I missed it the first time...
Great suggestions Billy!
My departure is coming on very soon...I can sense it, and as much as I would like to be in control of the situation, I am surrounded by some hot headed arrogant elders in this area...They get my blood boiling....
So, your comments about keeping cool etc will be very helpful to me. I am very quick to think of a smart as5 reply when I feel wronged...but I know it is wiser to show restraint.
Yes, to keep one's dignity throughout difficult times is a sign of a strong person...
Another thing that helps me to control my anger , especially towards the WT Society and/or JW relatives is that I stay busy with my life in my employment and my involvement in playing music , it really IS an outlet for me that helps me to let steam off by just plaing guitar and singing. Wonderful therapy
