Atheism

by avatar 837 Replies latest jw friends

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  NewChapter

  There are two ways to go about it, NewChapter. One way is to start arguments on the subject and try to FORCE others to accept your viewpoint.

  The other way is to quietly state your own position, but not belittle the position of others. This is the way I prefer.

  So your suggestion on a discussion board, is that we don't start any arguments, and when debate comes up, we say one thing and bow out---even if our comments are challenged? We've said our peace and counted to 10? So the responsibility of the atheist is to not upset the believer or argue a point, but just to firmly state our view. And their responsiblity is---well none. They've always allowed us to state our view and left it at that, neither progressing the discussion or challenging what we have said. These discussion have always been one sided---with atheists not letting them drop, while believers just wanted to be left alone. We followed them around and demanded they come back and answer for themselves. They've always quietly stated their views and left it at that. They've never belittled our positions.

  It really sounds like you think the adults on this board should be treated like children. It sounds like you think that debate hurts them. It sounds like you want atheists to be the adults, and simply shrug it all off. I am kind of stunned---but whatever. That's fine.

  You disapprove of debate with believers. Okay. Some atheists have decided that remaining silent has not brought the best results. As we continue to be maligned and trusted less than rapists, some of us feel it is our right to stand up and defend our views. Millions of churches do it everyday. They congregate and discuss, but when atheists get a little backbone, some just can't handle that. Which is ironic, since they are the majority and have countless support centers and communities to build them back up. Atheists, for the most part, tend to be on their own.

  I am tempted to go with this reasoning. Tempted to just treat believers like children that don't need their illusions busted. I just gave them more credit than that, and perhaps I was wrong. I tend not to think so, but this line of reasoning has been----enlightening?

  NC
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  james_woods

  All I can say, is that if you feel fragile, that is your right. We all have our sensitive spots.

  I do not feel fragile - I have asbestos lizard skin. For example, I debate conservative politics with BizzyBee and Beks. However, my point was that some believers can be very sensitive emotionally to this subject. If the non-believer is less sensitive, (and they really should be) - then they should realize that and set a polite example. Being polite is always far more important and effective in making a point than yelling things back and forth at the top of your voice.

  But if you feel that way, then maybe the healthiest thing would be to not challenge an atheist and then become hurt when they don't back down.

  I think I already made the point that I do not challenge either atheists nor believers on matters of faith or belief. I think that doing so is really pointless.

  However, I have been known to stand up for people on this forum who I think are being bullied - even if I do not agree with their religious or political point of view.

  BTW - You made a very important Wibble earlier today, NewChapter. I was very proud of you for that.
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  THE GLADIATOR

  NewChapter I agree with what you say. The thing is, that the way to win is to play your cards close to your chest. Attacking believers views, increases their faith. They feed off opposition because that is what they expect. You confirm their bias every time you attack. Go in slowly, make small points that can be accept. Build a brick at a time. Softly, softly catchee monkey.
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  FlyingHighNow

  Tempted to just treat believers like children

  You're pretty accomplished at this. I hope one day you will understand what it is that you are actually doing. I have a feeling you may wish, at that time, that you could go back and delete a lot of posts.
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  N.drew
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  NewChapter

  New Chapter, how long has it been since you believed in the WT religion and practiced it?

  That's hard to answer. I stopped 'practicing' sometime around 2007/2008 because I was very sick and that religion takes so much freaking energy. As to when I stopped believing---again difficult---because I think it was a process that was happening for a long time before I acknowledged it. It seemed to come to me in a split second in 2010, but really it had been happening for a long time, it was only the moment I acknowledged it. I started identifying myself as an atheist then.

  Through the years, I saw that the process had been going on for a while, even when I was a believer. Questions with no good answers. Finding I often agreed with nonbelievers more often than believers. Conceding that they made very valid points that I agreed with on some level. Then I would push it away and do damage control.

  My brain is an odd one. It works when I'm not concious of what it is doing. For instance, when I'm writing, and feel like I'm taking a break, when I sit down again, the story is already completed. I had been working it out the whole time without really putting effort into it. It kind of reveals itself to me when it's ready. i don't know if I explained that right. Let's just say that this was a long process with my brain, and I was the last to know.

  NC
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  james_woods

  Atheists, for the most part, tend to be on their own.

  That is because we don't need the support system. We have the asbestos lizard skin.

  I am tempted to go with this reasoning. Tempted to just treat believers like children that don't need their illusions busted. I just gave them more credit than that, and perhaps I was wrong. I tend not to think so, but this line of reasoning has been----enlightening?

  You have to treat most of them just like you would treat a devout JW who has not yet realized that they are in a cult. You can at least still be friends with most of the non-JW believers and it is not necessary to worry about insulting their feelings if you are the least bit careful.

  It is not like some Old-Testament War God is going to come down and kill them if you don't evangalize YOUR belief to them, right?
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  FlyingHighNow

  Go in slowly, make small points that can be accept. Build a brick at a time. Softly, softly catchee monkey.

  Good avice to New Chapter and anyone really. I'll add: keep your mind open. You were once convinced the WT religion was right.
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  cofty

  
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  FlyingHighNow

  New Chapter: the reason I asked how long it had been since you believed is this: I can see how your approach is affected by being a recent JW. I believe that given time, your approach, towards those who do not share your views, will change.