by Vanderhoven7 93 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
As I understood it the reason the JW's say Jesus used different physical forms was not only because they say he was a spirit. It is also an attempt to reconcile the Bible showing no one recognized him, even his closest associates.
One very possible reason of course could just be it was another person pretending to be the raised Jesus.
dear sheperd...
you said: "It is also an attempt to reconcile the Bible showing no one recognized him, even his closest associates."...
Jesus lives in and through His disciples and so it is the Holy Spirit who reveals or *expounds Him to others (using the bible) luke 24:27,32. in the case of those in the WTBTS they have "knowledge" of the Son from the scriptures but they strictly avoid any meaningful dialogue with His disciples to the end that the Holy Spirit might reveal Him to them.(they are trained to be opposers) those in the WTBTS have biblical knowledge...but they haven't wanted to receive extra-biblical knowledge.(1 tim 4:13-14)
*explain thoroughly, translate, interpret(-ation) # 1329 strong's (from 1223: through; 2064: accompany, appear, bring, come...)
love michelle
And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely. revelation 22:17
love michelle
Sacolton: excellent study...thanks... not exactly what I was aiming for though. I'll try to clarify.
Chalam: Thanks. Always appreciate your input.
Designs: True, being Trinitarian is no guarantee one knows or has a relationship with Jesus Christ.
My point is that one cannot legitimately say they know and/or have a personal relationship with a person that they have never communicated with in any way. A biblicaly normative relationship with Jesus Christ involves fellowship and commune with the Saviour.
Of course JWs do not fellowship with or commune with angels. And that includes their angelic Jesus.
Vanderhoven7- People's degree of intensity to a concept creates devotion. Servetus was a devoted believer of a Unitarian concept of Jesus so much so that he accepted Calvin's challenge to meet and discuss their opposite views. John Calvin, the Trinitarian, had Servetus tortured alive and then murdered him in public. Point being with the diversity of views on the Jesus character people are responding to an idea in their minds based on their interpretation of the Bible, their own culture's view of Jesus, religious affiliation etc.. A Byzantine based Church person communes with a very different Jesus than a westernized non-denominational person who likes the idea of Jesus as the Kumbaya Leader.
I am not defending the Watchtower's position just pointing out that their Greatest Man book was the most popular among JWs when it came out so people were responding to their Michael-Jesus imagery.
Someone saying they have a better relationship with Jesus than another person seems a bit juvenile don't you think, kind of like a sibling saying mom likes me best.
<<Someone saying they have a better relationship with Jesus than another person seems a bit juvenile don't you think, kind of like a sibling saying mom likes me best.>>
Yes, that would be juvenile...but that's not what I am saying.
What I am saying is that JWs are not permitted to relate personally to Jesus Christ in any way shape or form.
Relating to, calling on, coming to, communing with, sharing personal troubles with, petitioning etc. an angel is spiritism.
Vander
V- That's not true, as a former JW I know the emphasis is on Jehovah and I was a vocal critic of the JW position on Jesus but to say a JW does not call on or commune with Jesus is incorrect, its just not how a Protestant or Catholic does it. In the cornacopia of models on Jesus one guys Jesus is as valid as the next. Servetus was certainly convinced of his idea, he could have accepted Calvin's view and been spared being skinned alive and burned..
Remember when Reagan ran for President and Born Againers complained he didn't use the term Born Again, its like that.
<<to say a JW does not call on or commune with Jesus is incorrect,>>
Are you saying JWs talk to Jesus, share their burdens with Him, call on Him etc. For example, have you ever heard anyone at the hall talk to Jesus? If not, can you describe the relationship/commune a JW might have with such a high ranking angelic creature?
Sure JWs do those things, I did, just not in a Protestant or Catholic way. Now if you expect some JW to flail on the floor like a Charismatic and whowl Geeeezus in some ecstactic trance then No its not like that at all, and they don't talk directly to Jesus in public prayers.
Are you working under the premise that only ABC is orthodox but the group that likes XYZ don't or even can't have a relationship with their minds conception of a Jesus figure.
<<Are you working under the premise that only ABC is orthodox but the group that likes XYZ don't or even can't have a relationship with their minds conception of a Jesus figure.>>
Not at all. I'm working on the premise that calling on and communicating with invisible angelic spirit beings other than God is spiritism. How do you define spiritism?
