How many people watched "The Princess and the Frog?"

by garyneal 150 Replies latest jw experiences

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  AGuest

  What I hoped to show by putting the term in speech marks is that I was borrowing it from Gary's wife and don't own or necessarily agree with that usage myself.

  Ahhhhh! Thank you for that clarification, dear TD (peace to you!). I understand, now, yes.

  would it hurt for you to look things without your racist glasses on?

  Of course, not, BP (again, peace to you!); however, when it is racist... I don't need glasses: I can see it just fine.

  Hopefully one day you'll understand there is only one race, the human race.

  I realize you addressed this to dear Wuz (peace, my sister!), but I would counter that that works two ways: one, when EVERYONE... and not just "us"... sees this, which I am sure you know is NOT the case, nor has been (then again, you truly may NOT know that); and two, when "they" stop treating "us" as if we're not "really" a part of that [human] race.

  Seriously, girl, I know the issue is [very] uncomfortable for some of "you" and that "you" wish it would all "just go away". Trust me... so do "we". Giving "us" the same thing... and nothing less... would have gone greatly toward showing that "they" truly wish this, too. Didn't happen. Again.

  Peace to you, both!

  SA, on her own...
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  tec

  I don't remember ever playing princess when I was a little girl. I don't remember ever wanting to be a princess either, for that matter. So I thought it was kind of cool that she had a bigger dream than just being a princess. I admit to not having thought about the movie itself being racist. I hear you though. I guess I thought that they made a black princess and the frog as a sort of pc thing... for legal purposes, sort of to say, 'see, we're not racist!'. Perhaps that was the cynic in me. Perhaps that is racist of me? If it is, then please say so, because on this, I am pretty ignorant. But why not do something completely original instead of rehashing an old story with a different race in the lead? I think we're 'getting' there (where people don't see color, really)... each generation moving a little farther away from racism... but we're not all the way there yet, and in some places, we're not even close! My boys don't even see race though. I love that. And the schools are pretty multi-cultural. In fact, we were the minority at one of them, one year.

  I never wanted to see this movie in the first place though. My boys ( - yeah, that was the look on my face) wanted to see it and so I took them. I thought it was boring. I didn't like the voodoo character (and I can totally see why Garyneal's wife would hate the movie - sorry Gary - simply because that would have been demonic to her; I admit to some discomfort though as well). I also hated that they were both turned into frogs. Did that happen in the first Princess and the Frog? It worked for Shrek, but in this instance, I didn't really care about watching two frogs, sorry :P

  I guess there just didn't seem to be anything TO the movie. No real substance. Nothing original. Lots of cliche.

  Peace,

  Tammy
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  AGuest

  No real substance. Nothing original. Lots of cliche.

  Yep, there was that, too, dear tec (the greatest of love and peace to you, girl!) - LOLOLOLOL!

  SA, on her own...
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  ziddina

  I enjoyed the movie - watched it several times while it was a "freebie" on "Encore" - but...

  I can see how people would consider it to be racist...

  It's set in the 1920's or 1930's - I think - which was definitely NOT a good time to be black. Pre-Civil-Rights movement, 1920's - 30's New Orleans...

  [Btw, I think that "NOrleans" is the local pronunciation... Just like "Buena Vista" is pronounced "BOOna Vista" by the Anglo boys here in Colorado, and "Cashiers", North Carolina, is pronounced "Cashers" by the local??...rednecks??]

  Plus, there's some local pronunciation for Los Angeles - and I can't remember what it is/was, 'cuz it's been a few decades since we lived there...

  Anyway, about the movie...

  The big fat white guy is the quintessential "Big Daddy" [think Tennessee Williams...], rich as Croesus and TOTALLY oblivious to the struggles of the poor black girl - Tiana. I kept wondering why Tiana couldn't have just presented her business plan to "Big Daddy" to get the money to start her restaurant - her mother had certainly worked her fingers to the bone providing his spoiled little blonde child - Charlotte - with beautiful dresses - and was obviously NOT paid what her labor was worth, or that restaurant would have been in existence before Tiana grew up...

  The characterization of the skinny VooDoo man - the "Shadow" man - seemed racist to me, too, though I enjoyed Keith David's voice in the role - he has a rich, sexy voice and he sounds a LOT like Laurence Fishburne!!

  Oh, but that Charlotte... She was a SCREAM!! Too typical of some of the Southern women I've seen... Spoiled, hyper-excitable, focused on getting "A Man!" and sorta two-faced - but in "Charlotte", it was funny!

  I enjoyed it, but yeah, it contained some irritating stereotypes...

  Y'know what would have made it much more interesting? Place it in modern times, put a sort of "Jackson Five" in the lead as the rich black family - minus the dysfunctionality, enhance the "Royalty of Rock 'n Roll" role of the family, and make the "princess" a variation on one of the Jackson girls...

  Zid
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  Yr Wyddgrug

  I thought the Princess and the Frog was not based on the traditional Grimm's fairytale "The Frog Prince" - the one where the Princess loses her golden ball and the frog gets it back for her, but on another book called "The Frog Princess."

  My elder daughter and I like the film, but reading this thread has really made me consider it from another viewpoint. I like the story, but I think Disney decided to introduce a black princess to its line and found a story to justify that. Why does having a black Princess need justification? It's almost giving the message "Hey, only white girls are real princesses, but look, you black girls can be one too, sort of, aren't you lucky."

  I take the point most well known fairytales are european in origin. Well, Disney has a perfect opportunity to take some African stories and make them well known. (And there's a wealth of amazing stories there) Look at Mulan, a little-known Chinese legend, suddenly accesible to everyone(Though there was a bit of a furore over making her too european looking at the time I remember)

  I didn't know Prince Nazeem was Brizilian though. I thought he was a prince from an unspecified middle-eastern land who had been cut off from his money because of being lazy, thus looking for a rich american to marry. He definately is an official prince though, rather than just a bloke, even though he doesn't act in a typical "Disney prince" manner.

  Thanks for giving me a new way of seeing it. I don't think I'd ever even seen someone who wasn't white until I was in my teens. In fact, I knew nothing of the transatlantic slave-trade/antebellum south/american history/african history until I came across the late, great Octavia E Butler. Her novel, "Kindred" about a modern black woman married to a white man who gets sent back in time to the antebellum south to save a white plantation owner's son time and again is still the best novel I have ever read twenty years after I first read it, and it opened up history to me. Until then I thought history started and finished in Britain.
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  AGuest

  THANK you, dear Zid and you, as well, dear YW (peace to you, both!) for those comments. I realize not everyone "gets" some of the perceptions and stereotypes brought out in the firl. Of course they don't and I had/have no expectations that they should. It's just that I don't think some should be telling me what a certain thing is to ME... when it was supposedly "for" me... I have given the reasons as to why it was not... for ME. I am sure you both understand that.

  Again, thank you... and peace to you!

  SA, on her own... and admittedly having said, "Thank gawd, there IS a gawd"... after reading your comments... LOLOLOL!
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  AGuest

  I thought he was a prince from an unspecified middle-eastern land who had been cut off from his money because of being lazy, thus looking for a rich american to marry.

  You may be right, dear YW (again, peace to you!): I will admit that my vision may have been "clouded" to this after, say, the first scene or two! I didn't get, though, that he was from the middle-east (the middle east?? Why NOT Africa??). They used a Brazilian actor to play the part so that they "prince" wasn't really "black" (i.e., African AMERICAN)... so, that might be where that came from in me. But even still, he was the stereotypical sweet-talking, good-looking, lazy, loser "cat"... looking to capitalize on a black woman. In the deep South. If that isn't stereotypical... and smack of racism... I'm not sure what is.

  I mean, couldn't he have been just a prince - maybe with some issues with his dad (like the other princes)? Why broke, lazy, and looking for a woman to live off of? My father would roll over in his grave... and my son, SIL, and their friends would be utterly offended. As I was. So, okay, she got a prince, after all - if so, I stand corrected. But he certainly was portrayed as many perceive the black man in this country... which is true for SOME, but certainly not ALL, and so was insulting to some of the rest of us, women included.

  (And please, BP and others: don't give me that, "Well, some ARE like that!" Because THAT "dude" runs the gamut: black, white, brown, yellow, pink... even rainbow-colored. So, nope, that won't fly, either.)

  But, thanks for the clarification, dear YW... and peace to you!

  SA, on her own...
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  Broken Promises

  They used a Brazilian actor to play the part so that they "prince" wasn't really "black" (i.e., African AMERICAN)... so, that might be where that came from in me.

  You've got something against Brazilians?

  Did the prince HAVE to be black, or do you have something against mixed marriages?

  But even still, he was the stereotypical sweet-talking, good-looking, lazy, loser "cat"... looking to capitalize on a black woman. In the deep South. If that isn't stereotypical... and smack of racism... I'm not sure what is.

  Sweet-talking men don't try to capitalise on white women? Hmm, ok....

  I mean, couldn't he have been just a prince - maybe with some issues with his dad (like the other princes)? Why broke, lazy, and looking for a woman to live off of?

  As I've stated before, they've brought the fairy tale into the 21st century. Some men are like that, and it was a good lesson that young ambitious women have to be careful of losers.

  But he certainly was portrayed as many perceive the black man in this country... which is true for SOME, but certainly not ALL, and so was insulting to some of the rest of us, women included.

  Ok, so "SOME" black men are like that, not all. But there are losers who try to live off women of all colours.

  (And please, BP and others: don't give me that, "Well, some ARE like that!" Because THAT "dude" runs the gamut: black, white, brown, yellow, pink... even rainbow-colored. So, nope, that won't fly, either.)

  But you just said "which is true for SOME" black men in this country- so now you don't want ppl to agree with you???
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  AGuest

  Seriously, BP? If "some" black guys are like that... but the truth is that "he" runs the gamut... and that IS the truth... why isn't "he" portrayed in the others?

  Look, girl - I know the "cure" for what's ailing you on this: a book entitled "The Help". Read it. Then see the movie. No, don't just see the movie - read the book AND see the movie.

  Perhaps, then, you will at least be able to put on some kind of "glasses" so as to "see" what I see. I mean, maybe not, but you will NEVER be able to wear my moccasins (and you should be grateful for that!). But, again, don't try to correct my perspective on this. You have neither the ability... nor the right.

  So, back that keister up, sistuh, and step off. YOU don't see it as I do. I neither expected... nor asked... you to.

  Peace.

  A slave of Christ,

  SA
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  Broken Promises

  But, again, don't try to correct my perspective on this.

  Is that what your beef is? Where did I say that you were wrong for feeling or thinking as you do?

  All I've done is ask questions, questions to understand your thinking, and also to see if you could understand other points of view.

  As it's become glaringly obvious, you are unable and unwilling to see things through other ppl's eyes - yet you want others to do the same for you. Sorry, but it goes both ways. If you want ppl to understand where you're coming from, then you have to be just as willing to look at things from the point of view of others.

  Why do you refuse to do so? Are you afraid that your long-held prejudices about white people might have to be changed? Is that such a huge threat for you?