Can you accept hard to swallow reality?

by AK - Jeff 14 Replies latest jw experiences

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  AK - Jeff

  For instance: In the matter of 'shunning' - are individual Jehovah's Witnesses EVIL?

  Due to our previous 'training' it is still difficult for many of us to accept that Jehovah's Witnesses are actually EVIL. I don't mean the organization - an 'organization' is just a term to describe people who unite for a common goal or purpose. An 'organization' cannot possess human qualities - it can only reflect the human qualities of it's membership.

  That said: Are individual Jehovah's Witnesses, even a majority of them, evil in their application of the teachings of the organization - in this particular instance, the 'shunning practices' of Jehovah's Witnesses. What can we observe?

  1. Parents who kick children out of the house for no other reason than leaving a religion.
  2. Children who ignore grandparents, parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, cousins, former best man at their wedding for similar.
  3. Grandparents who refuse contact with all of the above, for any of the above.

  Often we are inclined to give the standard 'excuses' for this conduct.

  • They are 'indoctrinated', 'mind controlled', etc
  • Like sheep, they are following without thought.
  • The truly believe that God is watching and expecting them to 'shun' these people

  This question comes to mind with a parallel of sorts - please don't take the analogy too far - because that is to distort the point.

  The Nazi's also 'indoctrinated' people. People followed Hitler without thinking. Perhaps some of them actually believed the hype that God would bless the 'Fatherland' if they followed the 'führer' without question.

  But here is the catch - Not all of them did. In fact, many thousands of Germans did not. And, among Jehovah's Witnesses, many thousands of them do not follow the 'rules' in every case, or sometimes in any case.

  Are we guilty of excusing conduct that is clearly community oriented, therefore accepting that the 'shunners' are not guilty - only those who ordered it? I don't know. I don't think so. I believe that there are people who actually seek to live with 'real integrity', not that manufactured and insisted upon by leadership.

  Just as there was a 'German resistance' against the evil of the führer, there is a small percentage of Jehovah's Witnesses who refuse to 'shun' long time friends, relatives who have left, or others who have been DA'd or DF'd for some reason. They do not allow a blanket condemnation to distract the real issue - human kindness, love, unconditional friendships.

  I think it a choice. I think they like the choice, as it elevates them in their mind, and perhaps in their social circle.

  Well, that's my opinion. I know that it won't set well with all. Some refuse to see evil in a relative who clearly sees evil in them for leaving. Interesting dichotomy/duplicity in that too, eh?

  Your thoughts?

  Jeff
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  little witch

  I do hold them individually responsible for their actions. I agree with You that it is a concious choice. It is mean, dirty, soul scarring, spirit distructing evil behavior.
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  PSacramento

  All evil needs to succeed is for good people to do nothing, isn't that the saying?

  Well, maybe nothing is not the right word anymore, perhaps it should be "...for good people do NOT do ENOUGH to stop it".
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  serenitynow!

  I can appreciate what you're saying. It's hard to say that individual JWs are evil for observing the shunning. In most cases, I think that they think that d/f'ing and shunning are scriptural. I think that because they believe it's scriptural, and that JWs have "the truth" that it is necessary to shun to make people come back. Most don't have the knowledge that what is perceived as "keeping the congregation clean" by refusing to associate with d/f'd ones is really emotional blackmail pure and simple.

  What I found evil when I was in, were the people who refused to follow the bible by setting matters right about wrongdoing other than fornication. I had a bunch of elders tell me there was nothing they could do about my JW father abandoning his family- never repenting for it, and continuing to ignore his children even as he is an "upstanding" member of the congregation.
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  leavingwt

  Thought Reform (or Mind Control) explains to me WHY they do it and why I did it, previously. However, they are responsible for their actions, just as I was responsible for my own.

  I have forgiven myself.
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  tec

  I think those who taught it are responsible for their wrongs, AND the wrongs of the people following their teachings. But I also think the individual is responsible for his own wrongs.

  We could take that a step further, and say that all those who turn a blind eye to the wrongdoing being done right in front of their face, without trying to correct it (by speaking against or by doing the right thing instead - leading by example, or something else I can't currently think about) is also responsible... for doing nothing.

  I would apply that to every aspect in life, though, and not just religion.

  Tammy
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  Farkel

  :Your thoughts?

  Jeff, you should read M. Scott Peck's book "People of the Lie." I highly recommend it because of your topic in this thread. The entire book is about evil and the nature of evil. There is a whole chapter devoted to group evil and it is most appropriate for this discussion.

  I was a little uncomfortable about his chapter on exorcism, though. I'm still skeptical about such things, but all-in-all, I learned a lot from it.

  Farkel
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  AK - Jeff

  Thanx Farkel. Sounds like an interesting read.

  Jeff

  Just ordered the book.
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  OUTLAW

  

  ............................. ...OUTLAW
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  OnTheWayOut

  I like LeavingWT's middle-of-the-road answer. I believe it's highly WT-pressure and the fear of displeasing Jehovah. A Nazi war criminal would be someone who went too far and killed Jews in the camps. While I don't think that shunning is the same thing, I would understand if a shunned person were to equate his family treatment to that of a war criminal, especially when the shunned person is a teen or elderly person or in need of family care.