To new Christians on JWN (page 5)

snowbird

He corrected himself, NVL.

As to who created God, I like the rendering of the JPS Tanakh, which refers to God as The ETERNAL.

'Nuff said.

Syl

cantleave

The Eternal - leaves more questions unanswered than answered.

notverylikely

Creationists have an argument about First Cause. Evolutionists don't.

Of course they don't. That's not their field of study. To suggest otherwise is showing that you are criticizing that which you do not understand. Once you demonstrate your lack of a basic understanding of the thing you are criticizing, any credibility you had in that discussion just went away.

But every theory they have depends on something existing BEFORE the first cause. The big bang is a great example.

Creationists view God as eternal. He is an eternal intelligent being. What do evolutionists have that could be considered "eternal"? Something doesn't come from nothing.

You're first cause is god. you just move the question back a step. The problem is that Christians tend to take two contradictory views on god. One is that he is eternal, which means he is in the flow of time, otherwise "eternal" means nothing. Then they also say that he is outside of time and created it, which means that time means nothing to him, so he can't really be eternal since that is a meaningless term. Either way, the answer "god did it" is a meaningless answer about the origin of the universe since that answer means there can never be anymore knowledge on the subject.

The argument is not tired. Information CANNOT come from nothing.

No one is suggesting it did. Who do you think is suggesting that?

There MUST be some sort of intelligence to cause what we see existing in the universe. From the power of the macrocosm to the fragile detail of the micrcosm, it is inexcusable to not believe in some sort of intelligent design.

Extending that argument out, if god is infinitely more complex and powerful and fragile, then some intelligence must have designed him.

snowbird

The Eternal - leaves more questions unanswered than answered.

Not for me.

Syl

notverylikely

As to who created God, I like the rendering of the JPS Tanakh, which refers to God as The ETERNAL.

So god has always existed in the stream of time? or is he outside of time?

brotherdan

MadSweeny, we've discussed this before. I know that "versions" or "translations" of the Bible are not inspired. But I do feel that IF God directed the writing of the Bible, He wouldn't allow its message to be completely contaminated. I sometimes think that he allowed certain people (I.E. WTS) to corrupt portions of the Bible so that an honest hearted person would have to search for the truth of his Word.

You are correct that are are countless ways to interpret the Bible. But by making these comments, we take the Holy Spirit out of the entire discussion. We imply that we can only find truth through our own knowledge. But Jesus (and his apostles) did not say this would be the case. The Holy Spirit also went by the name "The Teacher". The Holy Spirit would teach us what we need to know. Does that mean that we all have to have the exact same ideas about what a particular passage means in the Bible (like JWs do)? I think not. I think we have beautiful diversity. However, there are essentials that all Christians believe. They believe in sin, the redemption of sin, and the hope for an end to sin. The Bible gives a very simple definition of what is essential. 1John 5:1 says that all those that believe that Jesus is Christ are born of God. That's the essential. We can have differences in viewpoints on many other things.

I have established my faith in the Bible (or more correctly the revelation of God). And seeing the godlessness in the world only goes further in proving that true peace lies in KNOWING God.

snowbird

So god has always existed in the stream of time? or is he outside of time?

My personal belief?

Both.

Syl

notverylikely

My personal belief?

It can't be both, sylvia. you can't be sort of pregnant.

And seeing the godlessness in the world only goes further in proving that true peace lies in KNOWING God.

Christians have just as many issues as anyone else. I guess we need to define what true peace is.

wasblind

In & Out of Time by Maya Angelou

The sun has come.
The mist has gone.
We see in the distance...
our long way home.
I was always yours to have.
You were always mine.
We have loved each other in and out of time.
When the first stone looked up at the blazing sun
and the first tree struggled up from the forest floor
I had always loved you more.
You freed your braids...
gave your hair to the breeze.
It hummed like a hive of honey bees.
I reached in the mass for the sweet honey comb there....
Mmmm...God how I love your hair.
You saw me bludgeoned by circumstance.
Lost, injured, hurt by chance.
I screamed to the heavens....loudly screamed....
Trying to change our nightmares into dreams...
The sun has come.
The mist has gone.
We see in the distance our long way home.
I was always yours to have.
You were always mine.
We have loved each other in and out
in and out
in and out
of time.

snowbird

It can't be both, sylvia. you can't be sort of pregnant.

You can if you're God.

"With God all things are possible ..."

Ta da.

Syl

To new Christians on JWN

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