.........."So they can reject Jesus"..???..LOL!!...OUTLAW
Why does the great crowd go to memorial?
by *jeremiah* 37 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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*jeremiah*
Thanks Blondie,
Although the "great crowd" was identified in 1935 and the general calling said to be ended, the GC was not invited to the memorial until 1938........!!!!
*** w95 7/1 p. 15 par. 5 "The Israel of God" and the "Great Crowd" ***
In 1935 they were identified with the "great crowd" of Revelation chapter 7. In 1938 they were invited to attend the Memorial of the death of Jesus Christ as observers
*** w79 11/15 p. 27 par. 23 Benefiting from "One Mediator Between God and Men" ***
Today, according to authentic records, there is a "great crowd" of dedicated, baptized Christians who actively collaborate with the small remnant of spiritual Israelites. Ever since the spring of 1938 they have been invited to attend the annual memorial celebration of Christ’s death, not to partake of the memorial emblems, the unleavened bread and the red wine, but as respectful observers.
Of course,...I'm not reading the entirety of the above articles,...but I like how they really don't offer any solid biblical evidence for the change,....or any biblical evidence for that matter.
...and what is the correlation between Revelation chapter 7 and the great crowd being allowed to be observers at the memorial?
I just read Rev. chapter 7 and I personally don't see any correlation once so ever.
I just find it interesting how the WT gives other christian religions such a hard time about adopting traditions that cannot be found in the bible, yet,...there most holy event is that very thing which they supposedly detest.
The great crowd as observers is nowhere to be found in scripture.
If you are an active JW reading this, according to your own view of scripture, you should not be attending the memorial celebration.
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Leolaia
What a load of BS the "great crowd are invited as observers" is. In every Memorial I ever went to, we were participants in passing around the bread and wine. Someone (usually a professed member of the great crowd) passed me the bread and wine. I was not observing people partake the bread and wine....in fact, there was no one in our congregation for several years who was an "anointed". If no one there was an anointed, how would I be only an observer. We all were there to participate in the ritual of passing plates of bread and glasses of wine. Everyone who is given a plate and glass is thus offered an opportunity to partake, and everyone gathered there together denied this opportunity. That is what we observed....we were gathered to observe other members of the great crowd pass along the Memorial emblems, and each of us get a chance to do the same. Even if there were anointed there, there would have been no division between observers and participants....the JWs don't gather the anointed in a special section (like the baptismal candidates when they take their vows) for everyone else to observe them partake. What is more, the whole event in our congregation was arranged by professed members of the great crowd. We had to usually rent out a school auditorium for the event, and the elders who did this were not "anointed". The Watchtower teaching is fifty years behind the times. Maybe in the 30s and even in the 50s there was a good number of anointed in each congregation. But today there are whole congregations without anointed people at all. So why should those congregations meet together when no one in that congregation is allowed to partake of the bread and wine (according to their doctrine about the great crowd being outside the New Covenant)? What is the point of getting bread and wine to pass around if you already know no one will partake? Is it just in case of the rare occasion that an anointed might just show up out of the blue to partake of the bread and wine?
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Pachemu Nyet
I have read somewhere that the refusal of the emblems is from the Satanists. More or less a 'rejection' of Christ.
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mcsemike
Many of you know me. I'm no WT defender whatsoever. But I have a question. Someone asked me who the "other sheep, not of this fold ......." were if the WT didn't have it right with the literal 144,000. I know there are verses about inheriting the earth, and other ones. What is an alternative to the WT fiction about the great crowd on earth for eternity and the 144,000 in heaven for eternity?
One person told me the Jews were the small flock and the Gentiles who became Christians were the other sheep or great crowd. Can anyone share your beliefs or whatever you've heard that fits these verses? I need an answer when my old JW friends (?) question my leaving the WT and ask about this issue. I don't know how to explain.
Many thanks and my best to all.
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choosing life
Mike,
Luke 10:16 refers to the Gentiles who would be added to the Christian congregation. It is interesting that the Mormons use this same scripture to defend a major doctrine of theirs. They claim the other sheep are the ones Jesus preached to on the American continent. (Joseph Smith) So you can see how taking a scripture out of context can lead to different fabrications.
The 144,000, mentioned in Rev. 14:1-5 are also literal Jews as stated in Rev. 7:1-8 where the tribes of Israel are mentioned. When you look closely at the scriptures about the great crowd, you will see they are in heaven also. Do some comparing and check different translations.
To stay on thread, I don't know why we attend the Memorial and don't partake. It has always bothered me. I was raised taking communion and it leaves me feeling really hollow to attend and refuse the emblems. It is hard to explain to my Witness family, though, who have never taken communion and feel it is normal to refuse.
It is the equivalent of what Easter was like in the church I used to attend. Everyone got new, fancy clothes and shoes and all the ones who only attended once a year came. And then there was a big dinner. The Witness version of Easter.
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mcsemike
Choosing life: Thanks for the material. It will give me some good information to check on. I had heard that the great crowd was also in heaven and a third group lived on earth forever. The Mormon thing I also had heard. I'll check some other translations.
When I was a book study conductor in the early 1980's, we had a very old (near 100) sister who was the fleshly sister of Brother DiCecca (sp?). I believe he was one of the Atlanta eight. (Or he almost went to jail, she had a picture of 8 men together in her house.) She's dead now, but she said there used to be a teaching about a second group in heaven, not the 144,000, who weren't quite holy enough to be of the 144,000, but also lived in heaven. I think there was then a group that lived on earth, but I don't know where they came from. You know how often they change stories. And she wasn't exactly real sharp with her memory at that point.
Thanks again for your help.
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Hondo
"If Jesus at the last supper is speaking directly to "the annointed class",...that they should parttake and "do this in remembrance",...then why do the R & F even go to the memorial?"
MONEY, MONEY, MONEY...
How much does the WTBTS take in for 2 or 3 days of a memorial? This is why the R&F go, or are told to go. I read, and I can't remember where this article was, that somewhere in Oregon or Wash, during a memborial there, the city that was hosting the memorial provide the facilities (a stadium and lot of parking) for free. The WTBTS then went ahead and charge everyone for parking. Add this to all the donations taken in during the memorial, and you get a pretty good chunk of moola.
Sick!
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blondie
Hondo, are you thinking of the district conventions in the Tacoma area, the parking scandal?
http://www.watchtowernews.org/tacoma.jpg
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What-A-Coincidence
i am not of the annointed but my doll is so I will be attending with her
