Star of Bethlehem

by HAL9000 10 Replies latest jw friends

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  HAL9000

  Last night my wife came home from a Book Study at which the topic of the star of Bethlehem was raised. She asked me (UBM) whether I was taught that the star of Bethlehem was from Jehovah (God) or the demons. The response from her was that it was from the demons as (I think that this was the response as my interest was evaporating faster than ether) "the light shone on Herod first" plus 1 or 2 other reasons.

  First time I've heard this line. Is this a "local interpretation" or a "published fakt"? Your comments please to this increasingly perplexed UBM!

  PS I owe some people reply PM's - sorry for long delay, but will respond soon (I hope!)

  9K
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  MidwichCuckoo

  As a young dub, I was taught it wasn't from God, but from 'Demons' who were pinpointing Jesus' location in order for Him to be found and slaughtered.
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  Narkissos

  Welcome HAL9000,

  An old JW teaching, still in force, cf. Watchtower 12/15, 2002:

  "The

  Three Wise Men"—Who Were They?

  Nativity scenes usually depict three robed men with their camels, arriving at a stable where the babe Jesus is lying in a manger. The splendidly dressed visitors are commonly called the three wise men. What does the Bible have to say about them?

  According to the Bible, the so-called wise men were "from eastern parts," and it was there that they had learned about Jesus’ birth. (Matthew 2:1, 2, 9) It must have taken a long time for these men to travel to Judea. When they eventually found Jesus, he was no longer a newly born babe in a stable. Instead, the men found Mary and "the young child" living in a house.—Matthew 2:11.

  The Bible calls these men magi, or "astrologers," and it does not say how many there were. The Oxford Companion to the Bible explains: "The connection between magic and astrology is reflected in the visitors’ fascination with the star that had led them to Bethlehem." The Bible clearly condemns all forms of magic and the Babylonian practice of trying to get information from the stars.—Deuteronomy 18:10-12; Isaiah 47:13.

  The information conveyed to these men did not lead to any good. It aroused wicked King Herod’s jealous anger. This, in turn, resulted in the flight of Joseph, Mary, and Jesus to Egypt and the murder of all male children in Bethlehem "from two years of age and under." Herod had carefully ascertained the time of Jesus’ birth from what he learned from the astrologers. (Matthew 2:16) In view of all the troubles caused by their visit, it is reasonable to conclude that the star that they saw and the message about "the one born king of the Jews" came from God’s enemy, Satan the Devil, who wanted to do away with Jesus.—Matthew 2:1, 2.

  This, of course, ignores one essential feature of Matthew's Gospel, namely that Gentiles or "pagans" succeed where Israel has failed, which is exactly the point of the Magi's story. Moreover, if one is to judge the cause by the negative consequences, is not the whole Gospel plot, which results in violence against Jesus, entirely ascribed to God?
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  Finally-Free

  When they eventually found Jesus, he was no longer a newly born babe in a stable. Instead, the men found Mary and "the young child" living in a house.—Matthew 2:11.

  This never made any sense to me. The society has suggested that Jesus could have been 2 years old here, based on the age of the children Herod had killed. Since Mary and Joseph were from Nazareth, why would they have remained in Bethlehem for so long? I thought the only reason they were there in the first place was to register, as Caesar had decreed. I would think they'd want to get home once Mary recuperated from childbirth, which shouldn't take 2 years, and it shouldn't take that long to register.

  W
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  Narkissos

  FF,

  That's the unending problem of conflating two originally independent (and narratively incompatible) stories, i.e. Matthew's and Luke's:

  Since Mary and Joseph were from Nazareth

  Only in Luke. In Matthew they only move to Galilee at the end of the story, because they are afraid to come back to their place, Judea (2:23).

  I thought the only reason they were there in the first place was to register, as Caesar had decreed.

  Again, only in Luke (and Quirinius' census actually occurred 10 years after Herod's death).

  If you forget about Luke and focus on Matthew, the house in 2:11 is simply Joseph's home where he receives Mary (1:20).
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  Hecklerboy

  I think this was also taught in the "Greatest Man that ever lived" book as well. I remember reading that and it making perfect sense to me. Man was I brainwashed.

  I recently saw a show on the history channel that talked about the "sign" in the night sky that is mentioned in the Gospel. They showed how it could have simply been a convergance of 3 planets. However, to 3 astrologers this would have been a powerful sign.
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  Narkissos

  it could have simply been a convergance of 3 planets. ; However, to 3 astrologers this would have been a powerful sign.

  Too bad Matthew doesn't tell us they were three.

  The account has more to do with literature than astronomy imo.

  Cf. http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/82425/1.ashx
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  ithinkisee

  One of the best explanations of this I have EVER read is located here:
  
  Was the star of Bethlehem Satan's Star?
  
  The beauty of that article is how it is written in dialogue format.
  
  Enjoy!
  
  -ithinkisee
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  Kenneson

  My question is, how did easterners know that the Jews were going to have a king, in the first place? Do you think the Jews spread this message during the time of their exile (Diaspora) and that's how the magi knew about the prophecy?
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  Leolaia

  Ignatius of Antioch, who knew of the Matthean tradition but not the present story as preserved in Matthew (note also that Antioch is also the likely place of origin of Matthew; according to William Schoedel, Ignatius reflects a more original version of the story, drawing on Genesis 37:9 in the same way that Revelation 12 does with reference to Jesus' birth), wrote early in the second century and claimed that Jesus and Mary were actually "hidden from the prince of this world" and God revealed the star as a sign that the rule of evil on the earth has been "abolished" and "overthrown" (Ephesians 19).