Elders coming...i'm shaking in my boots...NOT! Any help?

searchfothetruth

I had a phone call last night from one of the Elders asking if they can come around. When I asked him why he said it was to discuss whether I would be interested in having a study.

This is strange as I have been baptised since I was 14 and left about 4 years ago and have had little contact with any witnesses except my parents, but, the only thing that has changed over the last few weeks is that I put together a 50 page report documenting a range of subjects including the UN involvment etc and give it to my Mum. Then within a week the Elders want to ask my to have a study!

I had a meeting with the same elders last year and I gave them a list of 50 questions that I needed answering before I would consider stepping foot into a kingdom hall again. I never heard from them again and have been making good progress talking with my mum. She concedes that I am right on things but still won't believe that the society would purposely lie to her. She even wrote a letter to the Bethel in London asking about the UN involvement and they wrote back and confirmed that they had joined just to get a library card and she was flabbergasted.

What I would like from you is any killer points that you think I can use with the Elders tomorrow (Friday 14th) because I want to give them as hard a time as I can.

I have my dis-association letter ready to give them before they leave but I may aswell have some fun before they do.

Thanks everyone

RandomTask

If you just want to give them a hard time then ask the tough questions. Questions about their history, the changing doctrines back and forth. You obviously have done a lot of research, you know what will make them squeal. And yes have that disassociation letter handy, because its either going to be that or they will DF you. You didn't expect to win the argument did you?

searchfothetruth

The thing is I won the last arguement but they left me alone to my great surprise. But I can't see that happening tomorrow.The other thing that annoys me is this Theocratic Lying. Asking to come around to talk about the study but obviously thats the last thing on their mind.

RandomTask

Just remember that you are not dealing with honorable people, they are merely dumb terminals connected to a mainframe in Brooklyn. They don't have any personal conscience, just one that is dictated to them, so don't expect them to act like rational human beings. Their whjole life structure is based around this religion so they will defend it using any sort of twisted reasoning, the truth would be too damaging to their sense of purpose. They have to go around making gigantic mental leaps of acrobatic reasoning every day just to justify their way of life, its old hat to them and deeply ingrained.

searchfothetruth

I know...I was one of them! I have found it frustrating with my parents. I have spent long hours logically going through loads of info working through lines of reasoning like:

So, the society has stated on many occasions that it is God's prophet, do you agree? Yes

And Deutronomy tells us what a false prophet is? Yes

And the society has prophecied many things that did not happen, do you agree? Yes

So the society are false prophets aren't they? No, they were just over enthusiastic

The frustration eats me up sometimes! As you say they they are told what to believe and how to answer and that is what I need help in trying to combat.

Mulan

Ask them if they consider you to be one of Jehovah's Witnesses. If they say yes, ask why they waited so long to come around.

If they say no, ask them "what is the purpose of your visit?"

Ask why they never replied to your 50 questions.

Realize you won't reach them. They might be stumped and have to go ask for help on how to handle you, but you won't change them.

If they get around to asking you about the "faithful slave" and whether you believe it is God's channel today, a question one friend of ours asked is this: "Do you think its POSSIBLE that the WTS will ever change their view of the Faithful and Discreet Slave?" They should answer that it is possible, because it isn't an "etched in granite" doctrine. For example, they will never change their view of who God is, who Jesus is, are the dead really dead? Those are solid Bible teachings. The other things are all interpretation.

So, the point is, why should you be chastised or even disfellowshipped for questioning those kinds of teachings, that are subject to change?.............possibly.

If they answer, "no" that it will never change, you can either drop it, or use the information in the above paragraph about solid teachings and interpretations, and the difference.

Have fun and let us know how it goes.

LB

So the society are false prophets aren't they? No, they were just over enthusiastic

You have to remember that the society changed the meaning of the word prophet to teacher. They are God's teachers not God's predictors. Nice try

Shakita

Good Luck, you're going to need it. Why? Because logic doesn't have a place in the JW dictionary.

If they point to a dog and say it is a cat, you must praise God that the society has the insight to see something that you just can't see. In other words, it doesn't matter what you will point out to the elders, they are always right because they have Jehovah God on their side.

If you feel like arguing with them, or discussing a point that they will always gloss over with a pat answer, pick a subject that has to do with the life and death decisions the society has enforced on its members. Organ transplant, blood policy...... the issues that God has decided to change his mind on. Why would God sacrifice all these people who were upholding his righteous laws, when he would change his mind years later? I haven't heard a good explanation yet to this one.

Mrs. Shakita

teenyuck

Why not tell them NO! NO visits, no phone calls.

Since I have not been at the center of a JW witchhunt, I am curious why so many here let the dubs mentally persecute them. Why do you let them in your home? Can't you just ignore the door bell, get caller ID and when they come or call, ignore it. Don't answer. If they know you are home, even better.

I must admit, I did dive under my desk (which faces the street) when they came doing door to door work, about 1 year ago. I was suddenly terrified. Then I thought about it and realized that they cannot hurt me. My mother knows I am an apostate (and still wants a relationship) and since she is the only family I have had the last 20 years, I don't have a thing to lose if they DFd me tomorrow. I answered the door and gave them a hard time about the UN and women being in subjection.

I would be pissed that they said my name from the podium, however, when it comes down to it, I know they cannot hurt me. Since I grew up in Chicago, the likelyhood that they could even "hurt my reputation" is nothing. It is a big city and I never had contact with dubs outside of the KH. I never worked with any or saw them at the store.

I would ignore their calls or leave them a voice mail at the KH that said "Fucx off, leave me alone. I do not want to speak to you." "If you DF me or announce I am DAd I will sue you for libel." "My attorney's name is___________." I think that would shut them up.

RandomTask

The only time the elders visited me and my wife, it was a couple of months after we stopped going. They knocked on the door when I was sitting on my living room couch, I could see through the side of the blinds that it was them, I just didn't answer the door. I think they called a couple of times but I have caller ID and I screen calls that are blocked so they never got ahold of me or my wife and they just stopped bothering us. As far as I know we aren't disfellowshipped or Dissasociated, nobody has told us anything. We've moved around so much that the only way they could find us now is if my wife's family gave them our address. If she does I just plan on ignoring them.

Elders coming...i'm shaking in my boots...NOT! Any help?

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