Open challenge to "Dr" Rolf Furuli and Greg Stafford - ONLINE DEBATE on Watchtower Insanity.
Furuli seems to have gone to ground entirely, pushing only IKEA and his presumed misconstructions of cuneiform text.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/bible/218342/1/What-happened-to-Rolf-Furuli
Stafford, OTOH, has apparently moved entirely away from the Watchtower, perhaps even disassociating himself in so doing.
If so, he owes me a personal apology and thanks to me for helping him get out by gently showing him the errors of his ways. He had lost his debate with AlanF and then I demonstrated that, leaving aside the Koine, Greg apparently didn't even know the difference between a phrase and a clause in his own mothertongue, English. Needless to say, the dubdub didn't accept his error, and further remonstration ensued before he scarpered.
And then the TravisJ45 incident. I'll let the Prominent Bethelite relate, in his own inimitable style, what transpired:
Post from the H2O archives:
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Subject: "Stafford Wins..Now what?"
Posted by TravisJ45 [GregStafford] on November 03, 1999 at 07:53:07
{eZOTANvCI6/CPYT8orz2XxZ4XktaQ.}:
I spent all day yesterday and most of the night reading through Greg
Stafford's responses to AF. I am currently a member of a JW congregation
but over the years I have had doubts about some things. I still do. But as
far as this debate between Greg and AF goes Greg wins. To me AF's
arguments are not that strong and he comes across a bit arrogant. I am not
sure if I am more impressed with Greg's patience or his ability to argue.
I honestly cannot see the point in continuing this debate. I recommend AF
step out of the debate circle and let someone like COJ debate Greg about
something like the gentile times chronology. Or maybe we can hear more
about the blood issue. I for one do not plan on reading through nearly 100
pages of this debate again!
TJ45
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This was received at 7:53:07 a.m. (H2O time).
Then when the message appeared on his screen, this idiotic Jehovah's
Witness must have realized that the game was up as his real handle
(GregStafford) had shown up (on the post, and on the index of posts) in
square brackets next to the assumed extra handle (TravisJ45) - H2O allows
dupe-handles, but reveals the main one (especially to prevent this sort of
abuse).
Realizing that there was no time to contact a Moderator (H2O is run by
fellow JWs) and get it all deleted before the message got seen by
"apostates" AS THIS WAS A PEAK TIME OF THE DAY (indeed, the message got
its first reply at 8:02:52 a.m. - less than 10 minutes later) - together
with the giveaway ("[GregStafford]"), the shameless CHEATER then posted a
second post about 10 minutes after the first one - to whit:-
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Subject: Take a hint, please...
Posted by TravisJ45 [GregStafford] on November 03, 1999 at 08:03:18
{eZOTANvCI6/CPYT8orz2XxZ4XktaQ.}:
Events have happened that jeopardize his presence here, but that can be
overcome, as you now see. See below for more on AF.
Greg would rather move on to something else, but there is a new procedure
he must follow. Any questions, please email me. I have the details.
TJ45 (?)
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Firstly, this #2 post explains nothing - and IN NO WAY lets Greg Stafford
(Cheater) off the hook.
On this second post (not the predecessor) an email address appeared -
[email protected] - significantly, not the email he uses for posts
which he intended to show originating from himself (viz:
[email protected])
An obvious shoddy cover-up of a botched attempt at CHEATING.
Why else would it have been in TWO posts? At 8:03:18 a.m. (or slightly
earlier, as the time is H2O time), the posting-receipt time for this
second post he would *NOT* have had time to SEE, READ and RESPOND to the
first reply to his first post (H2O receipt time 08:02:52 a.m., sender:
"Friend"). So any claim the second Stafford post was to explain the
"misunderstanding" over the first one FAILS MISERABLY - for this to
happen, the TOTAL of ALL the times for:-
(a) H2O to place "Friend"'s post on the BB after receiving it;
(b) Stafford to refresh his H2O screen and notice the response, allowing
for Internet timing delays;
(c) Stafford to read the response (which spotted the botched forgery);
(d) Stafford to consider what and how to respond;
(d) Stafford to type out a 4 or 5 line response 9as above - not a short
one);
(e) Stafford to send this response to H2O; and
(f) Stafford's response to travel across the net and be received by H2O.
must be no more than 27 seconds (YES - IN TOTAL!!!!!!) - the difference
between 8:02:52 and 8:03:18, plus a second in Stafford's favour for the
maximal rounding difference..
LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! MMM-LOL! LOL!
WOW! We knew the Light flickered for these crazy JWs - a change in policy
every now and again - but this is ridiculous!
Well, so Stafford's second post was CLEARLY NOT IN RESPONSE to the first
response to his first post.
So, was it "second thoughts" - in just 10 minutes?
Sure it was - triggered by the appearance of the unexpected
"[GregStafford]".
Stands to reason it is nothing else.
That this cheat has written a couple of ~30,000 character (!!!)
explanations for "what really happened" speaks for itself. The truth, my
friends, is usually much shorter than "the truth" ;-)
He tried to cheat, and got caught.
Well, Greg Stafford, in my eyes and that of all right-thinking people, you
a MISERABLE CHEAT and a LOSER.
I will be contacting the News Services (using the non-angelic channels I
developed when I conributed to their coverage of mass- and child- murderer
Jwhovah's Witness Mark Barton) to ensure this fiasco by the JW's most
visible apologist and defender gets the news coverage it deserves -
SANCTIMONIOUS HUMBUG CAUGHT CHEATING!
Not to mention the Borg. I look forward to greeting you as an ex-JW, soon.
And, as you know, Greggie - the message has been copied to you too. Please
do respond to the NGs. had you simply responded when caught with an "I'm
sorry" I would have let you be. Your credibility is sub-zero, and falling
like... mercury ;-)
Remember, folks - the Watchtower Society of Jehovah's Witnesses is a SHAM
and a FRAUD from start to finish. They have been caught CHEATING and LYING
and WRITING NONSENSE any number of times - explore the links in my sig for
just a few (hundred) examples. So, it is hardly surprising when their most
"Prominent" (LOL!) Current Public Apologist also gets caught CHEATING.
Love
Prominent Bethelite.
--
Focus
("PB" Class)