Open challenge to "Dr" Rolf Furuli and Greg Stafford - DEBATE.

by Focus 36 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  Dis-Member

  Focus your anger on those responsible for formulating the policies, not those once taken in by them who have now changed their minds.

  There may be a point that most are missing here. True the majority here have changed their minds and beliefs and no longer adhere to WT practices.. this does not mean they are not responsible and completely innocent ('I was just following orders' or 'I was duped') for what they spent years and often decades teaching and promoting in the past. All the shunning they too willingly did.. all the committees they (elders) were part of.. all the poor children and whole families they raised in the Borg with iron resolve. All the people they preached to and also duped and deceived with what they now claim they themselves were duped and deceived with.
  
  As those responsible for formulating the policies are no longer alive It could be that Focus is taking issue with those here (right or wrong) that were the foot soldiers for and took a great part in this 'work'.
  
  Just a thought...
• 

  Antioch

  AnnOMaly,

  I think I love you. I know I respect you.
  
  Focus,

  Thanks for all the research, sweat, and tears it sounds like you've been investing over the years. I was there when part of that internet JW apologists thing went down. I even counted a ton of time from about 2003 to 2006 as a pioneer for my time on the internet (Beliefnet, Touchstone, CARM, etc.). I probably read a lot of your discussions. My point is I have a personal stake in thanking people like you for helping me break free. So thanks.
  
  Your current post here, however, reminds me of a war veteran who is back in the USA after the war is over, but you're still holed up in your house in suburbia clutching a rifle and mumbling about foreign enemies long gone. Yes, you invested a TON into the clash of minds back then, but move on. Find your humanity again. Re-evaluate your objectives and current self-assignments.
  
  Btw, those old enemies do not owe you a damn thing. Nobody owes you anything man. We're all fighting a hard battle and it's not over til you die. You're making this all too personal and frankly we'd like to see you fighting to help them break free, not fighting so hard to destroy them.

  DriveslikeJehu

  AdamN

  Antioch
• 

  problemaddict

  Drives like Jehu is here!?

  Wow!

  Ann I think your post in the other forum basically sums it up. I can't believe Newtonian is still there! How about pHronesis? I did not know solomon Landers was dead. That is too bad. I liked him more than most.
  How about Edwin n Florida? He went by Apologist on B-net for a while. He was pretty adept, but kept his responses to certain topics which always made me think there were some things he knew better.

  Focus, I am sure I know the professor you speak of. I live close to him, and have had amny conversations. Heads up the Hebrew group, and unfortunately lost his wife some time back.

  I think you nailed it Ann, sensible ones will only argue if they feel they have a strong case.
• 

  Focus

  Dis-member, you have evidently managed to understandd what the "Fool" Class won't or can't grasp. Saludos!

  Dear DriveslikeJehu (which humorous avatar I remember; I don't know the other ones mentioned by problemaddict or yourself, and indeed the only worthwhile posters still here who I recognise were SixofNine (from a year ago), NathanNatas and metatron. Plus "good ole Simon". That's how out-of-date I am),

  You should be happy and unsurprised that I actually agree with almost everything you wrote.

  Thankfully, I wasn't bivouacked in any (figurative) hideyhole for 12 years before re-emerging here. Though I guess it could appear that way, as the virtual guns had to start blazing when the trolls began to attack, lol.

  I gave freely of my time 12-15 years ago, with perhaps 10% of my spare resources (I typed real fast - I can still manage a consistent 60-70 wpm, and it lags thinking by 500%) devoted to fighting the Great Harlot, and then - assured that a competent successor cadre was adequately trained in cult-crimefighting, went on to other battles entirely. As may have many others of the old H2O team. Though my days of WTS-bashing predate that too, going back into Usenet.

  There's a lot more wrong in the world than the Watchtower... which occupied those 12 years.

  Stories about which, alas, I cannot share.

  Why?

  It is a very small world today, and there are some very smart wannabe detectives out there. Not that I ever believed all those Nazi death threats and all sorts of other silly carp - but I value my privacy. Notwithstanding six different threads (of which I'm aware) on JW.com alone devoted to "tracking me down" to "bust my head open with a hammer" and similar fantasies.

  So, if you read something somewhere else, unconnected with this odious bloodcult, where the style of writing or arguing makes you think - hey, that could be Fookus - please just gently pass it by...

  'cos you just might be correct.

  __

  Focus

  ("Thanks" Class)
• 

  AnnOMaly

  Antioch -

  problemaddict - I know! Having Antioch/DrivesLikeJehu here! I remember him from Touchstone too (lurking, never joined, can't recall if Wrench ever invited me or not). Some great discussions.

  Phronesis posts on Bnet occasionally - usually on the 'safer' subjects like Trinity-related stuff.

  Newt, yes he's still there touting his fantasy version of JWism - we've had many spats and I like to show him up when he's telling porky pies or passing off drivel as truth. Good fun when I have the time.

  Yes, it's a shame about Solomon. Our last online encounter ... well, he was rather contemptuous of me but no hard feelings as I was an anony-WT-critic who raised his hackles; I did once know a different side to him.

  APOLOGIST (Ed Andrews) - you never heard? Read this!

  Focus, is it paranoia or is everyone really out to get you? Btw, did you know Ros? (Another RIP.)

  Ann (of the 'Memory Lane' class)
• 

  problemaddict

  Ann....... *mind blown*.

  Wow. ed and I used to communicate pretty regularly. He was in my mind at the time, a loyalist. That is absolutely amazing. He was in the middle of his studies back then however.

  I tried my hand at touchstone one time (went by the name stepstone, and argued with Sulla along with a gentleman from southern Cali whos screen name escapes me). He was a good guy.

  Newtonian is a good egg. He really keeps it up doesn't he?

  B-net is actually what woke me up. Vinny over there bullied me into taking a harsh look at blood. I was just a "study" at the time. :)

  So now I think I know why there are no active JW apologists out there......they are no longer active JW's!!

  I mean....

  Stafford

  Heinz (from the hub days and jehovah.to)

  People like Dave at scriptural truths and DLJ/Antioch here

  People like Ed

  I am sure there are more. Wow, just wow. I believe the society has basically given up on all attempts at apologetics from the margins using the elite in their corner. I wonder if Hal still presides over that once a year meeting of the more learned apologetic type guys that the society at one time gave its blessing to have.

  Problemaddict (of the anonymous nostalgia class)
• 

  Focus

  Focus, is it paranoia or is everyone really out to get you?

  Well, just one, AFAIK.

  Though, for some reason I simply cannot fathom, I do seem to occasionally stir up a little bit of controversy. (scratches non-bald pate contemplatively).

  Now, be a good lass, and with the other sentient ones, please scroll down the page on:

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/281308/1/A-precious-gift-to-all-from-Jehovah-channelled-via-Focus#5045463

  and find the answers to the questions you didn't know you had. And then - act. :|

  __

  Focus

  ("Coming Out" Class)

  Note: Thanks and yes, I have sent a friendly "WHACK!" headed AlanF's way; I assure you he will understand, unless time has robbed him of such marbles and assorted other faculties of which he was originally possessed. The weakness of his apostatical qualifications was a matter about which I had to occasionally chastise him.