Posts by objectivetruth

56

So...Assuming God exists, if he were on trial and you were the prosecutor, how would you present your case?

by androb31 in

feel free to skip the intro down to the actual purpose of the thread lol!!.

i'm a born in, 32 years in and almost 6 out.

i've been out of the jw's since october of 2008. i came out due to a variety of factors, blood, historical roots, false teachings etc... my older sister helped me out back in 2008 and i subsequently helped my brother exit and the 3 of us became "born again" christians.. i've been mostly lurking but occasionally posting on jwn for around 5 years.

objectivetruth

- If I understand you correctly, you are saying God has made promises to certain of his servants that he absolutely had to fulfill in order to keep his word?Regardless of the collateral damage that would have to be inflicted?

Answer : There was really one Warning / Promise that he gave that has effected all of Humanity.. This was the Warning that said "eat this fruit (Whatever literal or symbolic meaning the fruit may have) and you and your offspring will live a life of pain and suffering."

It isn't really collateral damage. Because we are Adams Children, we are cursed just like He was. There is a Unbreakable law involved here, and this law is Genetics. Children inherent their parents Traits. In this case the Trait that we have Inherited is a Fleshly body that is not reconciled to Yahweh.

Yahweh is all Mighty & all Knowing.. But Free Will is Mighty as well.. The only way that Humans, can become what they're intended to become is with the Gift of Free Will.

If everything was laid out for us and Fate Existed.. How could it be said that we have Free Will?

Please also see my last post.. All over creation you see Duality and Opposites, I believe that the Reason for this is, that there is a Natural Law within us that only allows us to appreciate something, if we understand the opposite of that thing.

- Did humans put god in the position where his hands were tied and the choice was either mass slaughter or the universe ceasing to exist? Did he not know how things would go before he set them in motion?

The answer is Yes & No..

No To the Universe ceasing to Exist, as this is not an option and will never be an option.. Because it is impossible for god to lie.

Yes to the fact that Humans put themselves in this position, if our Father, did not sin, there would have been another method used to teach us Good vs Evil. I don't know if God knew that Adam & Eve would sin.. I do know however that it was not foreordained that they would sin.

56

So...Assuming God exists, if he were on trial and you were the prosecutor, how would you present your case?

by androb31 in

feel free to skip the intro down to the actual purpose of the thread lol!!.

i'm a born in, 32 years in and almost 6 out.

i've been out of the jw's since october of 2008. i came out due to a variety of factors, blood, historical roots, false teachings etc... my older sister helped me out back in 2008 and i subsequently helped my brother exit and the 3 of us became "born again" christians.. i've been mostly lurking but occasionally posting on jwn for around 5 years.

objectivetruth

androb -

If there are 100 people that Endure Suffering during their life times, does the Suffering of those 100 increase the suffering of each individual by 100% ?

It does not, One Person can only feel Pain with in their own Mind and Body.

With this in mind, view the History of the world with the Perspective of One Person, as opposed to many Billions.

One Person is Born and he lives 80 Years, with Constant Sorrow , Pain & Suffering.. No doubt those 80 years are TOUGH. He dies.

This One Person is then Resurrected, to an earth that is not Controlled by Evil..

This Person proceeds to live 1,000 years with Joy, Delight & Love..

At the End of the 1,000 Years God asks him, Do you wish to Live Forever?

What do you think this one person would decide? Do you think the 80 years that he suffered were so bad, that he cannot Enjoy Everlasting Life with no Pain or Suffering?

Or do you think, for eternity this person will Remember the 80 Years that he did not have God's support, and because of this appreciate God's support that much more?

If there is no Sad there is no Happy, if there is no Hate there is No Love, if there is no Hot there is no cold.

the only way we can appreciate what we have, is by having knowledge of what it's like not to have.

56

So...Assuming God exists, if he were on trial and you were the prosecutor, how would you present your case?

by androb31 in

feel free to skip the intro down to the actual purpose of the thread lol!!.

i'm a born in, 32 years in and almost 6 out.

i've been out of the jw's since october of 2008. i came out due to a variety of factors, blood, historical roots, false teachings etc... my older sister helped me out back in 2008 and i subsequently helped my brother exit and the 3 of us became "born again" christians.. i've been mostly lurking but occasionally posting on jwn for around 5 years.

objectivetruth

androb - I'm not the greatest with articulating my thoughts, but I'll try.

When Yahweh asked Abraham, to sacrifice Isaac, What did Abraham place bis faith in? Did he say to himself, "well I know that the Bible says that God is Love" so I'll put faith in God, because the Bible, says I should"?

No he definetely did not.l he considerd Yahweh's track record.. He considered whether it not Yahweh stuck to his word when he spoke it.

2 Hypothetical Questions he may have asked himself..

1. "When Yahweh, told my Forefather Noah, that he was bringing a deluge upon the Earth, to destroy all but 8 did he do it?

2. "When Yahweh, promised. Sarah and me a son, despite our old age. Did he fulfill his promise?"

The answer to both of these questions would be Yes.. There would have been 100's of other examples that Abraham could have mentally referenced as well.

Now.. Let's consider another hypothetical situation..

Let's say Yahweh had fulfilled 99 out of 100 Promises that he had made pre Abraham.. And the 1 promise that he did not fulfill, was justified because it would have meant death of a lot of Innocent people.

Could Abraham have COMPLETE trust in Yahweh? No, he could not he could only have 99% faith.

Hebrews 6:18 "So God has given both his promise and his oath. These two things are unchangeable because it is impossible for God to lie. Therefore, we who have fled to him for refuge can have great confidence as we hold to the hope that lies before us."

The impossibility of Yahweh telling a Lie is Absolute..

So when he tells Yahweh tells Adam

“Because you have listened to the voice of your wife and have eaten of the tree of which I commanded you, You shall not eat of it,’ cursed is the ground because of you; in pain you shall eat of it all the days of your life" Genesis 3:17

He cannot go back on his word. Yahweh withdrew his presence from Mankind, once they transgressed, and this has lead to pain,Suffering,evil and all types of unspeakable atrocities. If he were to exclude some from this pain, he would be a liar, and if he were to maneuver the situation so that there was not SO MUCH pain, this would be tampering with Free Will.

The fact is that Yahweh, allows everything that happens to Humans, because he Has to. If he did not allow it, he would be A Liar, and the Universe would cease to exist..

Another simpler example can be seen in Math.

Math like Yahweh never lies and cannot lie., the reason for this is That God is Math and Math is God. They are the same, in their absolute truthful nature.

Consider this hypothetical situation..

99 times out of 100 2+2 = 4 / However 1 in 100 times 2+2 = 8 - if this were to happen, the Universe would literally self destruct and all of humanity would instantly Die.

A child with polio Lieng in the Dirt in South Africa, is a Disgusting thing.. But Humans only live 70-80 years.. 80 years of torment, pain and suffering is better than every living being in the universe ceasing to exist.. Do you agree?

19

Another Gem from the Golden Pen of the Faithful Slave

by Slidin Fast in

look at this pile of steaming horse sh*t. this is meant to soften the horror of this god of war destroying 7,000,000,000 men, women and children in a holy jihad.

draw close book p 65 .

19 consider an illustration: suppose that a mans family was being attacked by a vicious animal and that the man jumped into the fray and killed the violent beast.

objectivetruth

Gingerbread - you missed one point..

Here's a better version of this illustration that draws a parallel between this man and God :

The man destroys the vicious animal to protect his family then uses his 'army' to go and kill all the other animals in the jungle. The man uses his own distructive power to napalm the jungle. This further exposes any animals who have sympathy for the destroyed animal. His henchmen kill every last living being. Other humans who fight against the man and his 'army' are destroyed excecution style. The loving father takes their homes and all their possessions and gives it to his family and army.

They all worship this loving, protective man forever and enjoy everlasting happiness.*

* After a Final Test.

The end.

18

This Generation.

by objectivetruth in

matthew 1:1 is called "the book of the generation" - everything in matthew refers to this same generation.. similar terminology can be seen in genesis 5:1 " this is the book of the generations of adam.

when god created man, he made him in the likeness of god.

" all of the descendants mentioned in genesis 5 cover a time period of 1656 years.. another example of this type of generation, reference can be seen in genesis 37 "v.2 these are the generations of jacob.".

objectivetruth

Interesting, thanks on the way out.

18

This Generation.

by objectivetruth in

matthew 1:1 is called "the book of the generation" - everything in matthew refers to this same generation.. similar terminology can be seen in genesis 5:1 " this is the book of the generations of adam.

when god created man, he made him in the likeness of god.

" all of the descendants mentioned in genesis 5 cover a time period of 1656 years.. another example of this type of generation, reference can be seen in genesis 37 "v.2 these are the generations of jacob.".

objectivetruth

It wouldn't be that human Race / all humans since it's only Spirit Annointed christians.

18

This Generation.

by objectivetruth in

matthew 1:1 is called "the book of the generation" - everything in matthew refers to this same generation.. similar terminology can be seen in genesis 5:1 " this is the book of the generations of adam.

when god created man, he made him in the likeness of god.

" all of the descendants mentioned in genesis 5 cover a time period of 1656 years.. another example of this type of generation, reference can be seen in genesis 37 "v.2 these are the generations of jacob.".

objectivetruth

John 10:16 " And I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them also, and they will listen to my voice. So there will be one flock, one shepherd."

Same thing.

18

This Generation.

by objectivetruth in

matthew 1:1 is called "the book of the generation" - everything in matthew refers to this same generation.. similar terminology can be seen in genesis 5:1 " this is the book of the generations of adam.

when god created man, he made him in the likeness of god.

" all of the descendants mentioned in genesis 5 cover a time period of 1656 years.. another example of this type of generation, reference can be seen in genesis 37 "v.2 these are the generations of jacob.".

objectivetruth

Matthew 1:1 is called "The Book of the Generation" - Everything in Matthew refers to this same Generation.

Similar terminology can be seen in Genesis 5:1 " This is the book of the generations of Adam. When God created man, he made him in the likeness of God." All of the Descendants mentioned in Genesis 5 cover a time period of 1656 Years.

Another example of this type of Generation, reference can be seen in Genesis 37 "v.2 These are the generations of Jacob."

With Jesus, the meaning of Generation(s) changes drastically though.. The Generation, is no longer Flesh & Blood, rather it is a New Creation.. All that receive Jesus, and receive Baptism by Holy Spirit encompass This Generation.

John 1:13 " who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God."

The Generation is comprised of Sons of God, and is mentioned in Generation 3:15, in addition to the Righteous, there is another Generation / Seed.

The other Generation mentioned in 3:15 is Mentioned at Mark 8:12 " And he sighed deeply in his spirit and said, “Why does this generation seek a sign? Truly, I say to you, no sign will be given to this generation.” (Matthew 12:39,Luke 11:29)

When Jesus says " Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened." Matthew 24:34. He is not pointing to a time Period starting in 1914, rather he is re emphasizing what He says in Matthew 24:21 " if those days had not been cut short, no human being would be saved. But for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short. "

"This Generation" is all Spirit Annointed Christians, on earth up until the time of the Great Tribulation. Thoughts / Other Perspectives?

20

So my mom called me out on Facebook today

by lriddle80 in

my dad posts the daily text on facebook everyday.

today's text had to do with disfellowshipping and this is what my mom commented on it:.

mom: i have a daughter also who is baptized but not disfellowshipped but doesn't want to learn about jehovah i pray that she see's soon before jehovah closes the door!.

objectivetruth

Beautiful Comment Iriddle, what you and Larry are experiencing, is the same thing that my Wife & I have experienced..Ezekiel 36:26 "And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh."

Many people look for a sign, and they ask Yahweh for a sign... When your heart begins to change, and you start to love you neighbors more, you know that Yahweh has answered your prayers..

Remember that the wheat & the weeds are scattered thought out the world in and put of many different churches and religions.. It is our privilege as Wheat to help the weeds to become wheat, and gain Salvation Now. : )

6

OMG!! Worldly people ARE so greedy and hateful!! I am leaving JWN!!!

by DATA-DOG in

check out this greed and lack of financial transparency by this worldy a-hole!!

no wonder the gb keep the finances confidential!

hurry and repent!

objectivetruth

LOL @ never ! Yeah all of these humanitarian efforts.. What a waste of time and Money! Don't waste your life helping people.. Instead give out 43.5 Million Watchtowers.