Posts by kelsey007

This board has been a wonderful experience. First I would like to thank everyone for tolerating my relentless criticisms. And I also do appreciate all the criticisms that were returned. Freeness of speech is a wonderful right that is new to most of us here and at times, at least in my case, I know that I might abuse it. But as I read through the "lengthy thread" I was touched at how, in spite of the confilct and differing opinions, most of you guys truly care for one another- in a way that is so much better than we enjoyed in the org. Most here express themselves in meaningful, heartfelt ways. What a blessing this is to all those here.

I apologize if I offended anyone or went over the edge in any of my post. Thank you Simon and thank all here for allowing me to express myself freely.

Kelsey

Edited by - kelsey007 on 6 October 2002 21:19:36

213

Governing Body Summoned For Jud Hearing

by silentlambs in

jw
friends

service committee .

25 columbia heights

brooklyn, ny 11201 .

kelsey007

For points of clarification. To those who have not heard my voice of concern let me explain where I stand. More than once in my post I have praised the efforts and stated goals of SIlent Lambs. If I did not care for the abuse victims I would simply remain silent and mute on the subject. Due to the great show of support shown to Mr. Bowne and given the fact that any criticism given to the movement was not accepted well by any of the supporters or by Mr Bowen himself I went on my campaign in hopes of getting dialoge started that may indeed reach those in charge and in support.

It is wonderful that such a movement is in place. I am simply saying: DON"T BLOW IT! This is at a whole new level. From where I am sitting Mr Bowen is getting all the praise he needs. He needs criticism. He has to be emotianal in regards to the movement and his feelings about the WT. That alone is enough reason to proceed with caution and consult with people who are willing to stand in his face and tell him he is screwing it up. It is not about Bill Bowen- it is about pediphioles and thier victims. Everyone around here was walking on glass around Mr Bowen- OH Dont criticise the man. He is working so hard. He is this and he is that. Then is it not time that he share the lead with others less emotionaly attached so that the vicitms are properly represented?

I am for the victims. Mr Bowen started a wonderful movement. It is about support for the victims- not undieing support for Mr Bowen. I still stand by my comments that Mr Bowens letters and actions will ultimately ruin what he has worked so hard to achieve. This should not be a YEAH We beat the WT rally! This should be a YEAH!!!! We made a diference for abuse victims. Bill Bowen may be a wonderful man- but he is no prophet sent by god and I am not the devil. The GB are not tools of Saten and neither are the catholic priests. They are all men who wipe their butts each day just as you and I.

If the founder of this good movement continues to brag about childish conduct and write such letters the cause will be defeated from within. This is not a funny movie it is a serious issue. Throwing stuffed lamb- then chuckling over such things over the internet is like two school children laughing over someone falling down the steps. If this is a serious movement then why are'nt the players acting serious about it? why would they allow such silly things to be posted and advertised as laughable conduct?

10

Bill Bowen's Letters to the Watchtower Society!

by UnDisfellowshipped in

jw
friends

william h. bowen.

kelsey007

Keep in mind this is the guy who proudly bragged about dissrupting a JW meeting at the KH to announce his own df'ing and then revved up his loud mufflers and squeeled his tires out of the parking lot. After, "spank those bad boys" and other such childish conduct this letter supprised me not at all.

The GB has received hundreds if not thousands of letters over the years demanding that they resign, that they change policy and all sorts of other things. Mr Bowens letter got more attention on this board than it ever will receive at the WT or in the press..

Over the past century bus loads of ex jw's have marched on the WT. They have gone to Brooklyn and to conventions. These attacks on the WT are both childish and non productive. It is no wonder that the media has grown tired of silent lambs- they have proven themselves to be just another group of ex-jws who are disgruntled and angry. The WT is not afraid of Mr Bowen nor are they afraid of lawsuits. They have been in more courts around the world than Mr Bowen could imagine.

GB member pediphiles? It is possible. Provable? All I can say is that so far the media refuses to touch this one. If the media saw any proof or put any credence in those accusations they would have pounced on this story- But no- not a word. If Mr Bowen could not convince the media I doubt he can convince a court of law.

Lets not forget to throw a lamb at a WT representative. That always does the cause a lot of good. Makes Mr. Bowen and Silent Lambs look like a real nice bunch of folks- In fact this whole program kind of makes ex-jw's look exactly like what the WT says they are- disgruntled ex jw's who lost thier minds- Grown, greying men squeeling tires in parking lots, dissrupting meetings, offering counsel to the GB (OK!) throwing stuffed lambs at WT representatives- Look at the pattern here. Where is this thing going?

How can such conduct damage the support for abuse victims? We live in a media driven society. Mr Bowen has put himself on the front line in this movement. His every move will be scrutinized by all interested parties. His actions may not be offensive or seem out of line to all- but, if he or others associated with this movement have the opportunity to testify in court against the WT how will this letter and such above referenced conduct reflect upon the credibility of the silent lambs movement? All the things referred to above have been posted by MR Bowen on the internet. An open, public venue. Should the WT be collecting data for potential litigation everything posted by Mr Bowen is printable straight from the internet. Would reasonable people- who have no WT connection- no history of dealings with the WT and no negative views toward the WT view such actions as actions of a reasonable, credible person? Would a group of 12 non-jw's give credence to the testimony of a man who has written such a letter or letters? In each case in a trial the defense is allowed to challenge the credibility of the witness. The WT has years of litigation experience under thier belt and above all the WT is best at public image control. To the media and to the WT it would now be very easy to paint this group as nothing more than a dissgruntled group of ex-jw's filled with anger. Mr Bowen is fighting a rightious war in an unrighteous world against an unrighteous organization. As he and silent lambs stand and point fingers toward the WT in an effort to accuse the GB of wrongdoing- and doing so in such a public fashion- all will be asking_ Who is this accuser? Yes, Mr Bowen has put himself in the spotlight. When people think of Silent Lambs they think of Mr Bowen. When they visit the Silent Lambs web site they read Mr Bowens story. And when Mr Bowen takes the WT to court he himself will be on trial. If you do not believe me, ask any rape victim who decided to take the alledged rapist to trial. Once the accusations were made the accusser must prove her credibility. Accusations are easily made and hard to prove.

Added point: The WT has developed a legal structure of hiarchy that shields them as best as possible against responsibility from the actions of local elders and individual members, GB or rank and file. Though direction is provided from the GB each local congregation is a seperate legal entity. It is set up in a similar fashion as that of a franchise. If an elder or group of elders stand accused of violating laws in protecting pediphiles they would have to stand up against the WT to defend themselves against actions in court. The likelyhood of that happening is slim. Then if they stood up against the WT in court the WT would refer back to printed material to show the direction they gave was solid and the elder was wrong. The printed statements would hold more credibility in court than any verbal testimony. Especially given that once someone takes a stand against the WT they are removed from the org. They are then labeled as disgruntled ex- jw's. The bottom line can you prove that the WT has violated the law? Keeping in mind that proving this in your own mind is totally diferent than proving it in a court of law. Any hopes of demonstrating such proof in court are greatly diminished by actions of Mr Bowen. Remember the OJ SImpson case? I was convinced that he was guilty- were you? This case hinged on the actions and statements of one detective. His credibility was shot due to use of ONE word. So you don't think these actions, words and conduct of Mr Bowen hurt the actions for relief for abuse victims of the WT? Think again!

Edited by - kelsey007 on 5 October 2002

Edited by - kelsey007 on 5 October 2002 10:25:34

10

Bill Bowen's Letters to the Watchtower Society!

by UnDisfellowshipped in

jw
friends

william h. bowen.

kelsey007

This letter makes the fifth attempt in offering counsel to properly address the problem of child protection in the organization.

Yes, Bill I am sure that they are seeking out your counsel-

"My fellow GB members. It has come to my attention that there is this man from KY who has started a campaign against the WT. He is now df'd and an apostate. He has not attended but one meeting in over 15 months, And at that 1 meeting he interrupted things to announce his own df'ing as a show for the local reporter he brought with him. Then he revved up his loud mufflers and squeeled his tires out of the KH parking lot- bragged about all this on the internet. He then threw a stuffed lamb at one of our representatives here in NY. Bragged about that also on the internet. He has accused us of terrible deeds. So therefore, fellow GB members, I say that we get down to KY and counsel with this man. I am sure that he can do the WT a lot of good. By the way did ya notice that he will even stand against his own mom to defend truth as he sees it- Why I saw on his silent lambs web site a personal letter that he posted from his mom. Yes, this is the man we should all seek counsel with. Mature, stable- some here even say genius."

213

Governing Body Summoned For Jud Hearing

by silentlambs in

jw
friends

service committee .

25 columbia heights

brooklyn, ny 11201 .

kelsey007

Keep in mind this is the guy who proudly bragged about dissrupting a JW meeting at the KH to announce his own df'ing and then revved up his loud mufflers and squeeled his tires out of the parking lot. After, "spank those bad boys" and other such childish conduct this letter supprised me not at all.

The GB has received hundreds if not thousands of letters over the years demanding that they resign, that they change policy and all sorts of other things. Mr Bowens letter got more attention on this board than it ever will receive at the WT or in the press..

Over the past century bus loads of ex jw's have marched on the WT. They have gone to Brooklyn and to conventions. These attacks on the WT are both childish and non productive. It is no wonder that the media has grown tired of silent lambs- they have proven themselves to be just another group of ex-jws who are disgruntled and angry. The WT is not afraid of Mr Bowen nor are they afraid of lawsuits. They have been in more courts around the world than Mr Bowen could imagine.

GB member pediphiles? It is possible. Provable? All I can say is that so far the media refuses to touch this one. If the media saw any proof or put any credence in those accusations they would have pounced on this story- But no- not a word. If Mr Bowen could not convince the media I doubt he can convince a court of law.

Lets not forget to throw a lamb at a WT representative. That always does the cause a lot of good. Makes Mr. Bowen and Silent Lambs look like a real nice bunch of folks- In fact this whole program kind of makes ex-jw's look exactly like what the WT says they are- disgruntled ex jw's who lost thier minds- Grown, greying men squeeling tires in parking lots, dissrupting meetings, offering counsel to the GB (OK!) throwing stuffed lambs at WT representatives- Look at the pattern here. Where is this thing going?

How can such conduct damage the support for abuse victims? We live in a media driven society. Mr Bowen has put himself on the front line in this movement. His every move will be scrutinized by all interested parties. His actions may not be offensive or seem out of line to all- but, if he or others associated with this movement have the opportunity to testify in court against the WT how will this letter and such above referenced conduct reflect upon the credibility of the silent lambs movement? All the things referred to above have been posted by MR Bowen on the internet. An open, public venue. Should the WT be collecting data for potential litigation everything posted by Mr Bowen is printable straight from the internet. Would reasonable people- who have no WT connection- no history of dealings with the WT and no negative views toward the WT view such actions as actions of a reasonable, credible person? Would a group of 12 non-jw's give credence to the testimony of a man who has written such a letter or letters? In each case in a trial the defense is allowed to challenge the credibility of the witness. The WT has years of litigation experience under thier belt and above all the WT is best at public image control. To the media and to the WT it would now be very easy to paint this group as nothing more than a dissgruntled group of ex-jw's filled with anger. Mr Bowen is fighting a rightious war in an unrighteous world against an unrighteous organization. As he and silent lambs stand and point fingers toward the WT in an effort to accuse the GB of wrongdoing- and doing so in such a public fashion- all will be asking_ Who is this accuser? Yes, Mr Bowen has put himself in the spotlight. When people think of Silent Lambs they think of Mr Bowen. When they visit the Silent Lambs web site they read Mr Bowens story. And when Mr Bowen takes the WT to court he himself will be on trial. If you do not believe me, ask any rape victim who decided to take the alledged rapist to trial. Once the accusations were made the accusser must prove her credibility. Accusations are easily made and hard to prove.

Edited by - kelsey007 on 5 October 2002 9:45:43

213

Governing Body Summoned For Jud Hearing

by silentlambs in

jw
friends

service committee .

25 columbia heights

brooklyn, ny 11201 .

kelsey007

jt- I think it was Mr Bowen who drafted and if I read it correctly mailed the letter. You have hit the nail on the head. A little known book was written just a few years back called "The Report". Though the auther did not reveal himself he did claim to be a current elder. He made claims of being a modern day "jeremiah" much as you said in your post. I doubt the GB or any rank and file read the "Report" and from what I have seen few if any here have heard of the book. It reveals much about the Wt''s economics.

Believe me the WT and the GB are used to getting bashing letter and demands such as Mr Bowens. I have personally read several that were sent by others who thought they could get justice in such a way. To think that you could get such justice from the WT one would also have to believe that the WT is god's organization- personally I do not believe such.

Edited by - kelsey007 on 4 October 2002 20:3:12

213

Governing Body Summoned For Jud Hearing

by silentlambs in

jw
friends

service committee .

25 columbia heights

brooklyn, ny 11201 .

kelsey007

Ok vitameat- for sake of argument let's use an anology. I have been exiled from my country for not following the laws or rules. After I have been removed from my country I start an anti campaign to expose the leaders of my country as frauds.

Sitiing in exile I form an organization on the premise of aiding abuse victims of the government. I march outside the borders of the country. Then I draft a letter demanding that the rulers of the country submit to my counsel. I demand that they be brought before a judiciary that I will form.

Also consider that this country that I am exiled from is one of the smallest countries in the world. It is a passive nation. The do not battle with other countries though they may be outspoken about other countries.

So what value does my letter of demand have? Given that the remaining citizens of this country look at me as an outcast- What point have I made? Where will such a demand take my cause?

213

Governing Body Summoned For Jud Hearing

by silentlambs in

jw
friends

service committee .

25 columbia heights

brooklyn, ny 11201 .

kelsey007

Of course, Island Woman, remember it was the "strength of god" that aided the terrorists accomplish their mission on 9-11. Do worship a reasoning god or an unreasonable god?