It does seem a strange example to choose. Likely, not doing it was making the GB and Commitees look peculiar in their business dealings with 'outside' companies!
HereIam60
JoinedPosts by HereIam60
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24
Toasting
by hoser inwhen did the jws make the rule that you couldn’t clink glasses together and raise glasses of wine?.
and why the change to being a conscience matter now?.
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Toasting
by hoser inwhen did the jws make the rule that you couldn’t clink glasses together and raise glasses of wine?.
and why the change to being a conscience matter now?.
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Fancy dress up parties were banned by Elders after our 2nd one
by Witness 007 inso i grew up in a small town with lots of witnesses so being bored we had two fancy dress up parties now some brothers came with swords and fake guns as pirates or cowboys one brother who was a pioneer came dressed as a woman!
the elders smashed us in a talk they gave and these fun parties were cancelled..
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HereIam60
When I was first "coming in", early 1980s in our area, Southern New York State, USA, there were frequent " congregation gatherings". baseball games, picnics, parties of various kinds. These were open not just to baptized witnesses, but interested calls, studies, even "unbelieving mates" and other family members. I recall these as fun, encouraging events that really showed good will and unity.
As we entered the '90s however there began to be frequent Assembly, Convention, and meeting parts on "The Dangers of Large Gatherings" - too difficult to supervise, things could get out of control and something might happen that could bring 'reproach' on Jehovah's name. Gatherings should be small, by invitation only, and an elder should be asked to oversee things.
Almost immediately events of this kind began to dwindle and eventually stopped.
Knowing now how "Bethel-centric" the JW organization is, I would bet that something improper had happened at some event at one of the headquarters facilities, and thereafter, the entire worldwide congregation had to be "counseled and disciplined"..
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Toasting
by hoser inwhen did the jws make the rule that you couldn’t clink glasses together and raise glasses of wine?.
and why the change to being a conscience matter now?.
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HereIam60
I don't know if it was ever a rule, but like so many things individual witnesses would make it an issue.
Much of this "You Must Not..." attitude was, I think, fostered by the constant stream of printed literature we once had. Remember there were 2 issues each of The Watchtower and Awake! every month for decades. They had to keep coming up with topics to write about. Awake! was supposed to be tracking current subjects, social trends etc. and there came to be an unspoken attitude of 'If it was discussed in Awake it's not for Christians"..So people were down on an endless number of things....soap operas, aerobics martial arts, gym membership and so on. They would also do articles on the origins of customs, pointing out the 'pagan' background, so no wind chimes, "bless you" after sneezing, games of chance....and on and on.
Even if it wasn't in print people would undertake to criticize and "instruct" others unasked on choices of entertainment. You shouldn't watch Pokemon, Dawson's Creek, Harry Potter....
While studying, right after I was announced as an "approved associate" The Brother who conducted my study invited me to go bowling with a group of brothers and sisters. .I had not been in years and had never been very good at it, but on my first turn I got a strike. I said "It must be luck, because it's certainly not skill!". The brother pulled me aside and told me severely " We don't say Luck!" and referred to scripture about "setting a table for the god of good luck.." I was embarrassed and asked "What should I say?". He said I could say I was 'fortunate'.
This, like many "explanations" sounded convincing on a first hearing, but later I thought What's the big deal. I was kidding and all I meant was it was a happy random occurence. Besides, isn't the word Fortune itself derived from the name of a false god?
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Why "Removed" instead of "Disfellowshipped or Shunning"
by blondie ini was mulling this over last night...too much free time, i know.
both disfellowshipping and shunning indicate the action of avoiding someone, taking them out of your sphere of associates.
probably is a better sound bite to say "removed.
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HereIam60
"Removed" sounds worse to me, as if the person had been physically escorted or carried out of the Kingdom Hall. Disfellowshipped should have meant withdrawing from close companionship for a time while continuing with normal, kind, social interaction, not total shunning.
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Is "Cessationism" A Correct Bible Understanding & Teaching . . . What Do You Say? (See 1 Corinthians 13:8-12)
by AbaddonProvesIt inis "cessationism" a correct bible understanding & teaching .
(see 1st corinthians 13:8-12).
the watchtower society believes and teaches "cessationism.
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HereIam60
My belief is that the miraculous gifts (healings, tongues, visions, prophecies etc) did eventually cease. Jesus told his apostles and disciples made during his time on earth that when they recieved holy spirit they would be his witnesses to the most distant part of the earth, then shortly before his death he prayed in behalf of them, and those putting faith in him through their word.
These two groups, original apostles and disciples, and those they taught would seem to be the "annointed" christians, as the scripures relate that holy spirit and its gifts were recieved and used by them. Once the Christian congregarion was established the gifts eventually ceased but their love and unity remained as their identifying mark.
I do think there are very rare "miraculous" healings that occur today , but entirely through the power of God, not using any human agent. What little I've seen of modern so-called speaking in tongues seems like pychological excitement rather than actual language. Modern religious visions (Bayside prophecies, etc.) are very questionable, and prophecies made today seldom, if ever come true..
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What was your deconstruction process from being a jw?
by Touchofgrey ini became aware of jws and the un ,so i checked the internet and found it was true that they were a member, and that led me down the rabbits hole and started to look into the history of the bible students and the behaviour of russell and rutherford etc ,and how much the teaching changed and the internal politics and the failed end of the world teachings etc.. i then found myself in a no man's land regarding god and the bible, i then began to use critical thinking regarding the bible and if there was a god , looking into the origins of the bible and it's stories eg adam and eve story, flood legends, exodus from egypt and if the jesus story was historical or not etc .. looking at the origin of our universe and the planet earth led me to the conclusion that no god exists.
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the purpose of this topic is just to understand your deconstruction purpose from the jws and not to get into arguments about our now held beliefs or lack of.
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HereIam60
I still believe in some basic doctrinal teachings, but the 2 things that have shaken me most were:
The Governing Body announcing in 2013 that it Alone was "the faithful and discreet slave", after decades of it being believed to be the "annointed remnant". (I've always been in doubt about there being a special annointed class on earth at all today, so do not think either interperetation correct, but much Watchtower teaching was based on the former view, so this was a major change)
....the JW Broadcasting program of March 2015 on which Stephen Lett began by saying there was more money going out than coming in, and each part thereafter was about making contributions This, after years of claiming they would never beg or solicit funds. Clearly they had mismanaged " the Master's belongings"...
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Armageddon 50th Anniversary
by apostrate inwell, it's been 50 years since armageddon occurred.. seems to me that things haven't really changed all that much.
is it just me or does anyone else seem to think that things have actually got worse??
?.
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HereIam60
"...our creator must step in and clean up our mess...". Curiously perhaps that was never the way I looked at it, according to what I was tught during my first Witness bible study publication, though admittedly that was many years ago now.
It wasn't that God was going to clean it up, but rather intervene to stop it, and provide a new beginning, a re-set, when everyone would have to learn peace and righteouness, and thereafter work together to rebuild everything from the ground up, Armageddon supposing to have completely devastated the former world.
In more recent times, many seem to have the idea that, the Watchtower properties and structures at least will still be standing and functional. I thought it was supposed to take the thousand years to get everything in perfect order...
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Armageddon 50th Anniversary
by apostrate inwell, it's been 50 years since armageddon occurred.. seems to me that things haven't really changed all that much.
is it just me or does anyone else seem to think that things have actually got worse??
?.
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HereIam60
Of course they do not define "soon" and while still arousing hope, it doesn't really foster anticipation anymore. I recall a video talk some years ago from a convention. Poor Kenneth Cook, probably the least dynamic Watchtower speaker ever, was evidently trying to rouse the audience to a fever pitch of excitement, after describing blessings in the new world he asked, "... When will these promises be fufilled?....SOON! Very Soon!!!.." He looked like he was expecting a tremendous burst of applause...which did not follow...
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How Can The Governing Body Be Considered The "Channel Of Communication" From Jehovah Without Being Inspired . . . How Is That Possible???
by AbaddonProvesIt invideo # 1,246: how can the governing body be considered the "channel of communication" from jehovah without being inspired .
the collapse of governing body member jeffrey winder's arguments: a critical look at a jehovah's witness excuse [by watchtower examination, winston gillum - montego bay, jamaica].
the governing body of jehovah's witnesses believe & teach millions upon millions of jehovah's witnesses world wide that they as a body, are not inspired or infallible.
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HereIam60
Around 2013 the Governing Body announced that it alone, rather than the "annointed Christian remnant" was "the faithful and discreet slave" The 7/15/2013 Watchtower study article discussing this "Feeding Many Through the Hands of a Few" used Jesus' miaculous feeding of the large crowd listening to him as the basis for this change, in that only his apostles passed out the food to the crowd.
Since then, the statement has been made, verbally, and in print, that "Jesus did not say the slave would produce perfect spiritual food...". However, Jesus did not say that the slave would 'produce" the food at all, merely distribute it to the Master's household. On other occasions he said that man must not live on bead alone, but on God's Word, that his food was to do the will of his Father, and that his, to be sacrificed, flesh and blood was true food and drink.
This says to me, that the 'job' of the slave is to distribute the Bible, and the Christian message, not to issue directives and commands or to oversee the lives of the fellow domestics of God's household. The GB has said they are "spirit-directed" but not "inspired", but like so many things this is purposely kept vague with no clear explanation given.. One contoversial statement made was the " the Governing Body could be likened to the voice of Jesus...." (NO!)
This change was probably planned for a long time, as for years unclear statements were made that "The FDS was 'closely associated" with brothers serving at world headquarters, that there was 'no worldwide network' of annointed ones, and implications made that many professing being annointed were mentally confused. (Frankly, I always had a hard time believing that anyone in this day and age were annointed, in the sense of being selected for heavenly rulership with Christ.)
Although it's still being said the remainng annointed will eventually be gathered to heaven, the self election of the GB to being the FDS, essentially dismissed the idea of there being an annointed class on earth today.