Posts by peacefulpete

9

Jesus and Thomas twin theory?

by Anony Mous in

in light of the recent attack on indian jws i did some research about christianity in india and found out that india has a long history of christian influence, and not, like many of us probably believed, brought by the british, rather india has had christians for 2000 years.. matter of fact, they may be similar length and claim to the ‘original’ christians only equal by the roman (european), syrian (middle eastern) and ethiopian (african) christians.

the story goes that judas thomas (aka doubting thomas or dydimus) (literally translated: dydimus = twin (greek) and tomas = twin (aramaic)), the twin brother of jesus travelled to india and did some miracles along the way, started the church there, hence deification of thomas is common there.. i found some articles written by eg.

bart ehrman supporting this theory, personally not that much of a fan, but i know many interested in jw exegesis as he supports various fringe theories including wtbts claim to the name jehovah.. the claims of jesus’ twin brother seem to be supported by the original writings, including the gospel as we know it in the west (almost every canonical gospel writer alludes to the twin), but also various other non-canonical writings and at least 3 complete gospels claimed to be by thomas himself (although the oldest writings stem from the first, second and third century respectively).

peacefulpete

Bart would be very surprised to learn he agreed 100% with the WT! No, he has quite clearly discussed how Christian theology grew and evolved. For example, the formulaic Trinity doctrine was arrived at after the majority of the NT was written, however it was an attempt to make sense of the often-contradictory descriptions of Jesus and the Holy Spirit. Most scholars understand this.

How can Jesus be the Alpha and Omega and the creator of all things while also be said to have been a 'Son'. How can the HS be said to have its own will and act independently of the Father. In other places Jesus is said to have control of the HS. The Trinity doctrine was a philosophical elegant solution. This is what Erhman teaches. The WT rather ignores the theological differences and dismisses half the texts through convoluted arguments.

6

Acts 15

by peacefulpete in

acts 15. the pericope has been long interpreted by the catholic church as a proof text for a central authority.

churches like the wt repeat this claim.

however, reading the text without this coloring reveals something very different.. the story starts with paul and barnabas going to the antioch church and there they encounter pharisee christians from jerusalem (15:24) contradicting the doctrine held by the antioch church.

peacefulpete

PetrW......No doubt your reasoning is shared by many here. Not to be offensive but if you rationally apply logic and textual criticism to works such as the Koran and Book of Mormon to conclude they are products of religious creativity, to not use the same rigor with the writings of the Bible, betrays a lack of objectivity.

37

If you were to design a new religion?

by ExBethelitenowPIMA in

what the jw sect has become and is slowly becoming is far more near what i thought could be a good religion based on the bible.. no more counting hours and no more blindly following direction now they admit they are not inspired.. i would like to design a new sect inside the jws.

it has to be kept secret because the elders would not like it.. this new sect involves giving a tick every month or so saying you are still kindof active talking about the bible.. going to meetings occasionally and attending on zoom sometimes.

very rarely go to ministry groups but don’t ever do first call, just say you are doing street work and have a nice walk somewhere maybe the shops or the park.

peacefulpete

W v2023 is the new kinder gentler organization, ........

Could not help but think of Neil Young, "We got a kinder, gentler machine gun hand."

Yes, the size the church has grown to, and the international progress toward civil liberties has necessitated many changes. Slowly less and less overtly cultlike. However, the ugly violence at the core is the belief that their God intends to kill nearly everyone to make it a 'peaceful world'.

Battlefield 'peace' never lasts, it just leaves scars and broken hearts. You'd think the God of the OT would have learned that.

124

JWLITE

by Teddnzo in

jw
friends

even elders can be part of the new jw lite brigade these days.

they don’t need to go on door to door anymore and there is no requirement for anything really.. taking meeting parts is all dead easy you could turn up on the day with zero preparation because it’s all in the meeting workbook.. quarterly elders meetings are just old men having a good old natter just like old men do down the pub.. congregations could be likened to pubs or bars these days just without the drinks, those come at other times.. no need for territory maps, these almost went away with covid letter writing now they are extremely slow getting finished as those who still go door to door only do ten mins.. you could even voice your questions these days about things the gb say and then just say “we can’t be dogmatic we just don’t know”.

i predict they will say this about 1914 soon..

peacefulpete

A double life is half life, half lie.

9

Jesus and Thomas twin theory?

by Anony Mous in

in light of the recent attack on indian jws i did some research about christianity in india and found out that india has a long history of christian influence, and not, like many of us probably believed, brought by the british, rather india has had christians for 2000 years.. matter of fact, they may be similar length and claim to the ‘original’ christians only equal by the roman (european), syrian (middle eastern) and ethiopian (african) christians.

the story goes that judas thomas (aka doubting thomas or dydimus) (literally translated: dydimus = twin (greek) and tomas = twin (aramaic)), the twin brother of jesus travelled to india and did some miracles along the way, started the church there, hence deification of thomas is common there.. i found some articles written by eg.

bart ehrman supporting this theory, personally not that much of a fan, but i know many interested in jw exegesis as he supports various fringe theories including wtbts claim to the name jehovah.. the claims of jesus’ twin brother seem to be supported by the original writings, including the gospel as we know it in the west (almost every canonical gospel writer alludes to the twin), but also various other non-canonical writings and at least 3 complete gospels claimed to be by thomas himself (although the oldest writings stem from the first, second and third century respectively).

peacefulpete

Th 'Twin" belief is not a late tradition but rather apparently actually predates the writing, or at least distribution, of the 4 canonical Gospels. Not surprisingly many, many traditions circulated around the Jesus figure. The church Fathers themselves repeated stories that are not only not in the 4 Gospels (later Canonized) but contradicting them. Pious mythmaking was endemic for hundreds of years, in fact never ended. (e.g. Book of Mormon) The Gospels themselves differ regarding Jesus having brothers due to active 'enhancement' and editing to refute Adoptionism (Jesus the man was adopted by God) and Docetism (Jesus was merely a spirit appearing to be a man) . Ironically, the idea that Jesus had brother named Judas (aka, Didymus the Twin) was useful for refuting the Docetists but leant to the Adoptionists' argument that Jeus birth was not miraculous. The solution may well have been to make the identification of Didymus and Judas obscure in the forms of the Gospel that the Proto-Orthodoxy had massaged.

In other words, that Jesus had a twin brother was believed in some circles for many years. The 4 canonical Gospels were not the only pious stories. There were earlier versions and later ones.

1

The Moral World of the First Christians

by peacefulpete in

i've been slowly digesting another well researched book regarding christian origins.. the moral world of the first christians (library of early christianity): meeks, wayne a.: 9780664250140: amazon.com: books.

a wonderful review of the major streams of judaism and greek religion that contributed to the ethos of the first century.

strongly recommend it.

peacefulpete

Sorry for the duplicate threads. It did not appear for 2 days again.

16

A Coin With a Remarkable History

by cofty in

over the years i have shared a few examples of objects i have found while metal detecting near my home in northumberland in ne england.

i live in a rural estate that was the site of a medieval village with a manor house and defensive tower.

many of the things i find illustrate the amazing history of the location.

peacefulpete

Coins are minted history. All the intrigue and scandal, power struggles and assassinations become real when you hold them in your hand.

1

Book Recommendation

by peacefulpete in

i've been slowly digesting another well researched book regarding christian origins.. the moral world of the first christians (library of early christianity): meeks, wayne a.: 9780664250140: amazon.com: books.

a wonderful review of the major streams of judaism and greek religion that contributed to the ethos of the first century.

strongly recommend it.

peacefulpete

I've been slowly digesting another well researched book regarding Christian origins.

The Moral World of the First Christians (Library of Early Christianity): Meeks, Wayne A.: 9780664250140: Amazon.com: Books

A wonderful review of the major streams of Judaism and Greek religion that contributed to the ethos of the first century. Strongly recommend it. As the author makes abundantly clear "Judaism" was a very diverse identification, groups with perhaps little more in common than the belief that they were 'Israel' and God's chosen. Meeks, the author, then gathers documentation revealing the finer points of identification and contention among early Christians. I felt there was value in the entirety but especially in his outlines of pre-70CE Judaism.

5

If you love your life and freedom, stay away from your embassies.

by was a new boy in

german authorities kidnap reiner fuellmich in mexico – interview with fuellmich and the covid investigation committee.

https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/world-news/corruption/german-authorities-kidnap-reiner-fuellmich-in-mexico-interview-with-fuellmich-and-the-covid-investigation-committee/.

'on 2 october 2018, jamal khashoggi, a saudi dissident journalist, was killed by agents of the saudi government at the saudi consulate in istanbul, turkey'.

peacefulpete

‘Fake Pandemic’ Conspiracy Lawyer Arrested After Claims He Ripped Off His Followers (vice.com)

1

The Moral World of the First Christians

by peacefulpete in

i've been slowly digesting another well researched book regarding christian origins.. the moral world of the first christians (library of early christianity): meeks, wayne a.: 9780664250140: amazon.com: books.

a wonderful review of the major streams of judaism and greek religion that contributed to the ethos of the first century.

strongly recommend it.

peacefulpete

I've been slowly digesting another well researched book regarding Christian origins.

The Moral World of the First Christians (Library of Early Christianity): Meeks, Wayne A.: 9780664250140: Amazon.com: Books

A wonderful review of the major streams of Judaism and Greek religion that contributed to the ethos of the first century. Strongly recommend it. As the author makes abundantly clear "Judaism" was a very diverse identification, groups with perhaps little more in common than the belief that they were uniquely chosen to be God's people. Meeks, the author, then gathers documentation revealing the finer points of identification and contention among early Christians.