Posts by truth_b

86

Is most of the promotion of creationism, not just that by the WT, charlatanism?

by Disillusioned JW in

is most of the promotion of creationism, not just that by the wt, charlatanism?.

https://www.fullmoon.nu/sources.bak/chapter%2010/part%202/gish%20exposed.html [which has an article called "creationism: bad science or immoral pseudoscience?

- (an expose of creationist dr. duane gish)"] says the following.. 'a look at the "scientific" creationist movement and a close examination of the tactics of a well-known and influential creationist will reveal that the creation "science" movement gains much of its strength through the use of distortion and scientifically unethical tactics.. .... with the facts explained and the lawsuits won, scientists declared victory and returned to their labs and offices.

truth_b_known

Has anyone else ever noticed that it seems only Abrahamic religions, especially Christianity, tend to be the only ones who create such disharmony over this debate. I find the debate itself very specific, though most do not spell things out.

The debate is presented in this way -

Life - How did it get here? By Evolution or Creation?

First, the question is inappropriate. No life comes from evolution. The correct question is - By abiogenesis or creation?

Second, it is misleading in that the question is often posed in a very specific context - Life? How did it get here? By abiogenesis or the God of the Bible?

Why is this? Because Christianity has the Biblical creations account as a foundation, a core principle teaching. To disprove it would be looked on as catastrophic by many Christians. Therefor, the very life of their faith is caught up in a life and death battle.

As someone once told me "If you find yourself in a fair fight your tactics suck." So, I don't think the Watchtower has a monopoly on the charlatanism used in attempt to prove the Biblical creation theory. I believe there is sufficient evidence of that.

What is sad is that by accepting the impending reality that the Bible's creation account and the Garden of Eden story are only allegorical would be a huge step in doing what is necessary to keep the faith, any faith for that matter, alive. That is to say, the faith needs to evolve or it will go extinct.

8

Parents of Different Spiritual Persuasions

by Thehermit05 in

jw
friends

i escaped the cult many years ago.

as a result, i have an eye for cultlike thinking, whether in terms of religion, politics, centrist thinking, etc.. last december my fiance and i had a baby.

she is black and i'm white.

truth_b_known

make sure that their kids get exposure to more than just one form of "spiritual food," while keeping things peaceful.

I think you have answered your own question.

First, expose your child to other spiritual practices. Don't force it on them.

Second, let your child know he/she should use their rational thinking. Do not believe something simply because someone told them or a book says so. Always examine and investigate.

Third, teach by example. Be peaceable. Be understanding. Be mindful. Do not argue with your wife. When your wife says something truly listen with 100% of your attention with the goal of understanding her. Do not listen with the goal to either agree or to think up a retort to counter her point.

I have been studying Buddhism for 2 years and have taken up the practice of Soto Zen Buddhism. My youngest soon asked for a copy of the Tao Teh Ching. I was excited as Taoism influenced Mahayana Buddhism and gave us Zen Buddhism. I would simply asked him about what he read and would listen. About a year later he ask me to buy him a book on Zen Buddhism.

So, great question. I guess one great question for any person to ask themselves is "What is the purpose of spiritual practice?" Is it not to experience life to the fullest? Why are we here? Is it not to learn that we are not separate from one another? Religions that divide will become self evident.

41

Is the door to door preaching work not the primary focus anymore?

by pistolpete in

a few months back, one of my uncles who was an elder, asked the co, why jehovah would allow the door to door preaching work, to come to an abrupt end.

this was when my uncle was starting to have serious doubts about the organization.. the co told him to be patient, and hang in there, because the governing body was on top of things and in time would explain what is happening regarding the preaching work.. my uncle asked; “what do you mean?”.

co said; “focus on the wt study articles in the coming months” .

truth_b_known

The door to door ministry presents a huge problem for the Watchtower. It means Witnesses will be exposed to scandals the Watchtower wants to hide from Witnesses. Every door taken by a Witness presents an opportunity for an informed householder to bring up a scandal or ask a Witness a question about something the Watchtower wishes to remain hidden.

I think the best question to ask a Witness is "Can you prove your belief?" The answer given these days would be "Go to JW.org for the answer." To which I would reply, "So you cannot prove your own belief. You simply believe whatever the Watchtower tells you. That doesn't make the belief true. It just means you accept without question."

16

Theocratic Warfare

by Iamallcool in

jw
friends

most of us know what theocratic warfare means but maybe very few people reading this forum might never heard of theocratic warfare.

can you give them some examples of theocratic warfare?

.

truth_b_known

...if you have to cheat to defend your beliefs, your beliefs don't deserve to be defended.

That is a profound and enlightened statement. Add to that lying or being deceitful. Bible - God is truth and Satan is the father of the lie. Why would the God of truth encourage his people to be deceitful? That sounds like a lack of faith.

41

Is the door to door preaching work not the primary focus anymore?

by pistolpete in

a few months back, one of my uncles who was an elder, asked the co, why jehovah would allow the door to door preaching work, to come to an abrupt end.

this was when my uncle was starting to have serious doubts about the organization.. the co told him to be patient, and hang in there, because the governing body was on top of things and in time would explain what is happening regarding the preaching work.. my uncle asked; “what do you mean?”.

co said; “focus on the wt study articles in the coming months” .

truth_b_known

Growing up and even as an adult my father always told me that during the Great Tribulation the message would change from a "life saving work" to a "judgment message." There is a problem with what the CO told this elder - the Great Tribulation has not started according to the Watchtower's teachings.

The Great Tribulation was to start after the fall of false religion. The world governments were to shut down all religion. This would be the beginning of the real "last days". I just got a flyer in the mail inviting me to a local church. I guess that hasn't happened yet.

Wait! I can see it now - Babylon the Great has fallen...invisibly!

17

What JWs don't know they believe

by StephaneLaliberte in

in a post this morning, i suggested that a way to wake up fellow congregants is to plainly comment or make talks on teachings and rules the jws don't really know too well.

the idea is that you can say these things, other jws will be bothered by the comments, but will not be able to do anything about it as this is the official teaching or stand on this or that.

the key here is that when troubling rules and teachings are thought in the watchtower, they generally use wording that makes them go down easy.

truth_b_known

I was in for nearly 4 decades. I had no idea that the Watchtower teaches that Jesus is the mediator for only the annointed. I could only imagine being with a group of Witnesses and blurting out, "I am so happy not to be part of Christendom. Could you imagine actually believing Jesus died for my sins so I could make it into the New World? It is so freeing to know that Jesus is only the mediator between Jehovah and the annointed. I know if I am loyal and obedient to the Governing Body I might have a chance of making it through Armageddon."

I am sure I would be met with odd stairs and uncomfortable silence! However, is this not what the Watchtower has been teaching for decades? Every point I made could be support with a direct quote from the Watchtower.

9

9 Year Old Used Basic Logic And Came To An "Apostate" Conclusion

by pistolpete in

related experience;.

basically what happened is my mom was studying with my 9 year old sibling and they were talking about the paradise.

my sibling then proceeded to ask, in a clearly joking way, "what if jehovah was tricking us and we don't go to paradise?

truth_b_known

The Bible is true - Because it is God's word - God cannot lie - Because the Bible tells us so - So, the Bible is true.

Imaging that as a neon sign spinning around your head.

51

PIMO elder

by Reservations in

jw
friends

i’m reservations, pimo elder.

i’m in no position to leave the organisation, maybe some people will see that as weak or whatever, but we have to all go down our own path in life.. i would like to be able to wake people up in my congregation, how do you think best to do this?

any ideas?.

truth_b_known

I had to think about this before answering. I have to agree the previous commenters - the only way to pull this off is to do so by being and example. You cannot do this as an elder.

If you are not in a position to leave the organization at this time it is understandable. However, for your own well being I would recommend pulling back as far as you can. For example:

Step down as an elder.
Stop giving any talks.
Stop commenting at the meetings.
Report the minimum amount of time possible.
Live your life as you want without getting disfellowshipped or reproved.
Be happy.
Be happy.
Be happy.

When you are doing only the absolute bare minimum the organization requires while simultaneously demonstrating your happiness those in the congregation will begin to question what is going on. People will notice your happiness and they too will want to experience what you have.

This is where it will get tricky. People will approach you and ask you why you are happy. You cannot bring up anything in regards to what you have stopped doing for the organization. You cannot bring up any thoughts or beliefs on the religion or the organization. Say nothing that can be used against you.

I would consider saying something like - "I am happy because I am content with serving Jehovah and being part of his organization. I really cannot put into words why I am so happy. I guess it can only be experienced and not explained." Then give a big, genuine smile. People will not be listening to what you say at this point. They will only be seeing how happy you are.

This is where those in your congregation will fall into one of two categories - There will be those who judge you as spiritually weak and break ties with you. There will be those who see your happiness, connect the dots, and become PIMO like you or may even go full POMO.

There is a brother I know growing up. He was an elder. I was friends with his sons, all of whom became Ministerial Servants. One day this elder had enough of being "used". Because he was friendly and kind he was constantly being called up all hours of the day and night by members of the congregation who felt the need to confess or ask for help.

This elder stepped down and was pretty much done. His sons did the same. These days they will attend most meetings, assemblies, and conventions, but that is it. They all spend their time being involved in what they want to do. They aren't doing anything that would be grounds for disfellowshipping. If you asked them "Is this the Truth?" they would all look you in the eye and answer "yes," but they sure don't live like Armageddon could be tomorrow.

21

What is the Jehovah’s Witness position on Unions and Labour action?

by hoser in

jw
friends

i remember you weren’t supposed to picket or be involved in labour unrest.

is this still the jw policy?.

truth_b_known

I have a low opinion of AFL-CIO unions in the U.S. I took a job that such a union "represented" the employees. The union did nothing but took $50.00 every 2 weeks from us and used the money to back political candidates we did not support. I created an employee run union to replace it. 100% of the dues went to the efforts to represent the employees. Things turned out for the better almost immediately.

Remember, "right to work" also means "at-will employment". That is a scary thing to be subjected to as a police officer. Be fired at any time without cause is a career ender when it takes 6 months to a year from the time of application to get hired.

24

Why wasn’t O’Donnell charged with receiving stolen goods.

by joe134cd in

firstly i appreciate the work mark o’donnell does for the xjw community.

no doubt this has also been discussed numerous times before.

but with regard to those documents that were illegally stolen in that vice documentary.

truth_b_known

In establishing whether or not a crime has been committed, one fact that must be obtained is "Who is the victim?"

The crime of theft usually reads in the corresponding statute something like: "Intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly taking property with the the intent to keep it without the effective consent of the owner." In such a case we must ask "Who is the owner?" because that would be your victim.

It appears what was taken were files involving congregation disciplinary matters. It would therefor be reasonable to conclude that the owner of the files is the local congregation - a legal corporation. One would have to read the corporate by-laws filed with the State to see who is authorized by the congregation to be in possession of said files. Based on the nature of the files I would imagine there is no mention of such a thing in the corporate by-laws.

We know that any congregation member in good standing is has voting rights. That makes any member in good standing a part of the corporation. I was never an elder, but I was a Ministerial Servant. As such, I was given a key to the Kingdom Hall and the alarm code. I had to pick up literature from the Assembly Hall and deliver it to 3 different Kingdom Halls. So, you can see this all muddies the waters when it comes to who is authorized to possess such documents.

I didn't get the impression the person in question burglarized the Kingdom Hall. It sounds more like this person just walked in and took the documents. It doesn't sound like the local elders found the front door of the Kingdom Hall busted open and the file cabinet pried open as well. It sounds more like an elder was just going through files and noticed some missing.

Either way, on the surface, it does sound like this person committed Theft. The crime of Receiving Stolen Property usually reads in statute that the offender possesses property he knows is stolen or would be reasonable to believe is stolen (e.g. buying a TV from a guy in the back of a van in a dark ally at a ridiculously low price). Whatever the case, it does put the Watchtower in a bind.

truth_b_known

Posts by truth_b_known