Posts by ScenicViewer

(Shepherd the Flock of God, p69 (the 2010 Elder’s Manual))
“Christians should avoid gambling in all it's various forms, including lotteries. If a person makes a practice of gambling and after repeated counsel unrepentantly pursues a course of greediness, judicial action would be appropriate."

II. Petty gambling for entertainment is ok.

(Shepherd the Flock of God, p70 (the 2010 Elder’s Manual))“The elders do well not to involve themselves in what individuals do with regard to petty gambling solely for entertainment. They may need to give counsel if this becomes a cause of stumbling for others or affects the spirituality of the individual or the congregation.”

Once again the Organization seems to be saying it both ways.

It seems so unclear these days. I guess they can get you if they want you, but if they want to let you slide they have a basis for that too.

66

Still Waiting For the Governing Body To Explain Their New Light

by Cameron_Don in

jw
friends

regarding the governing bodys new light relative to matthew 24:45-47, anointedjw.org recently said the following:.

this new light certainly poses a problem for the governing body.

perhaps this is another reason why they have not yet published a sober and scriptural xplanation of this new light.

ScenicViewer

Cameron_Don said,

It may well be that their “new light” may just create an even bigger mess when or if they ever do try to explain it.

I believe you are right. There are a few issues that need to be explained; not that they will ever attempt to answer the hard questions, they may just ignore them for years, but I'm wondering about these...

Why did it take so long?

If the GB is the Faithful Slave (when they are gathered to gether and in session), and the Slave was appointed in 1919, why are we just now being informed of this in 2012? Why didn't the previous groups of men that formed the GB have a clue about their identity?

It doesn't inspire confidence in these men that they didn't know who they were for over 90 years.

Circular reasoning

Where is the proof that the new understanding is true? There should be hard Scriptural evidence, but instead we have a Governing Body declaring that they themselves are the Slave. How do we know it's true? Because the GB says so! That is curcular reasoning in a very simple form.

Where is Jesus?

If I remember correctly the Slave is declared to be Faithful by Jesus when he returns. At least the old understanding fit this scenario (Slave is appointed in 1st Century, then declared faithful after Jesus' 1914 return), but with the 'new light' where did Jesus go after he made the initial appointment in 1919? What is he doing there? When will he be back? Are there Biblical answers to these questions?

Faithful Slave, or Evil Slave?

The Slave was either going to be Faithful or Evil, which would be determined by Jesus after his return. At this point we are told the Slave has been appointed (1919), but we can't know for sure if the Slave is Faithful or Evil because Jesus has not yet returned to make that judgment. At this time it is impossible for the GB to declare itself to be the 'Faithful' Slave. Even if the 'new light' is partially true, the Slave might be judged 'Evil' when Jesus returns from where ever he is.

It seems like this new information about the Slave was made up by a group of children playing King-of-the-Hill.

(AnnOMaly has a great idea, that they are testing the waters by watching the internet before they publish it to Witnesses. That's funny! They need 'apostates' to help them clarify this silly belief.)

73

New Member...

by sosoconfused in

jw
friends

hello everyone, just wanted to say hi and introduce myself.. i am a mid 30's just stepped aside elder, who just couldn't handle it anymore.. i am a 3rd generation born-in and former pioneer and bethelite.

it has been a log somewhat confusing ride for me, but i am finally settling in to realizing that i need to really look at what me and my family are doing.. .

its funny though what really got me here... it wasn't the 40 year old men telling me they were looking at boobies on the computer and hoping not to get in trouble, it wasn't the watching young people bail left and right, it wasn't the ever changing new light etc... but a simple thought.. .

ScenicViewer

Ckickable,

http://www.freeminds.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=392:how-i-helped-my-family-leave-jehovahs-witnesses&catid=48:restoring-family&Itemid=365

103

New here and just sick!

by msconcerned in

jw
friends

hello, i am new and i feel soooo wrong about being here.

anyway i am an m.s and have been disillusioned ever since the new understanding that came out in october.

i have read many things on this board that i have and also have not thought about.

ScenicViewer

Msconcerned,

I am NOT an apostate….i have not turned my back on Jehovah.

There are a lot of people here that are not apostate, even though we sometimes say we are in a tongue-in-cheek way; certainly the Society would say that anyone here is apostate simply because we recognize problems with the Organization, and we're never supposed to question God's Organization.

Some here absolutely believe in God and Jesus, while others are agnostic or athiest, and still others haven't clearly decided what to believe.

I have personally come to value the diversity of thought and opinion that is found here because it opens you up to concepts not considered before. I hope you come to apprecdiate it too.

BTW, the resources that can be found here regarding Wathtower teachings are amazing!

94

14 months after printing the "Steve and Selma" article, guess what the Society's latest Awake is about...

by cedars in

you guessed it.... .

http://www.jw.org/download/?fileformat=pdf&issue=201304&output=html&pub=g&langwritten=e&option=trgchlzrqvnyvrxf&txtcmslang=e.

cedars.

ScenicViewer

Splash, thanks for the reply and the idea of posting on another thread. I'll be watching for it!

94

14 months after printing the "Steve and Selma" article, guess what the Society's latest Awake is about...

by cedars in

you guessed it.... .

http://www.jw.org/download/?fileformat=pdf&issue=201304&output=html&pub=g&langwritten=e&option=trgchlzrqvnyvrxf&txtcmslang=e.

cedars.

ScenicViewer

Splash: I've got 26 pages of these flip flops.

I would love to have a look at those! Are they available online, or can you post them here on JWN?

70

A Message to Active Elders Lurking on JWN

by 00DAD in

there are really only a couple of reasons an active elder would be lurking here on jwn.. .

[if !supportlists]i. your ever growing doubts about the organization have led you here, or.

[if !supportlists]ii.

ScenicViewer

That OP was a joy to read.

Beautifully said 00DAD!

25

1975 AWAKE!!! Predictions

by iamwhoiam in

over at the archives..enjoy!.

http://archive.org/details/1975predictionsinawakemagazinebyjehovahswitnesses.

*click on pdf at the left side of the page.

ScenicViewer

Iamwhoiam, thanks for that link.

Those are some pretty amazing forecasts for 1975. I have never seen all of the late 1960's Awake references, and it's an eye-openeer.

I was struck by the quotes that Watchtower used from 'worldly' sources; they were the most dire of doomsday predictions, and the predicted date of 1975 fit in perfectly with the Society's own time calculations.

A sample from Awake! 10-8-1968, page 15,

"One of the greatest problems, beyond man's solving, is the coming food shortage due to the population explosion. In the book Famine-1975! food experts W. and P. Paddock state:

"By 1975 a disaster of unprecedented magnitude will face the world. Famines, greater than any in history, will ravage the undeveloped nations.”

"I forecast a specific date, 1975, when the new crisis will be upon us in all its awesome importance."

"By 1975 civil disorder, anarchy, military dictatorships, runaway inflation, transportation breakdowns and chaotic unrest will be the order of the day in many of the hungry nations.""

Naturally defenders of Watchtower will say 'It wasn't the Organization that said it, it was worldly people.' Yes, but Watchtower jumped on it and quoted it to further it's own ends, since 1975 was the also Socitey's prediction for the end of 6,000 years of human existance.

Looking back on it, I can't believe I fell for this.

It's no wonder the Awake! reprints only go back to 1970!

51

Did we ever fulfill Mathew 24:14?

by raymond frantz in

i know ... many mistakes and a nasty leadership ,but did jehovah's witnesses fulfill even partially matthew 24:14 :"the good news will be preached in all the inhabited earth and then the end will come "are we to expect a final or a completely different fulfilment of this verse ?

.

ScenicViewer

I remember a CO attempting to explain this prior to 1975.

He said there are 3 basic national groups, referring to the descendants of Noah's sons, Ham, Shem, Japheth. His point was that Mt 24:14 had been fulfilled because these 3 goups of people had been witnessed to.

I was new in the Organization then, but I thought...

'What does that prove? Isn't it the people that matter? Much of mankind will be killed at Armageddon, even though they have never heard the msg of JWs, just because someone else of their race has?'

That was one of the early signals to me that JWs can rationalize anything. I should have taken it more seriously and made an exit sooner than I did.