Sir 82,
The former Soviet Republics gave up their nuclear weapons and Russia assumed responsibility for all debts of the Soviet Union.
scotoma
JoinedPosts by scotoma
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Moscow - the only world power able to turn the United States into "radioactive dust"
by scotoma inthose are the words of a prominent russian tv broadcaster.. president putin recently appointed kiselyov as head of russia's newly restructured state-owned news agency rossiya segodnya (russia today), which was set up by an unexpected presidential decree to replace the longstanding ria novosti and voice of russia media outlets in december.. .
do you think the watchtower writers are doing some recalculations?.
will they switch the identity of babylon the great from a religious entity to the usa.. "rev.
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Moscow - the only world power able to turn the United States into "radioactive dust"
by scotoma inthose are the words of a prominent russian tv broadcaster.. president putin recently appointed kiselyov as head of russia's newly restructured state-owned news agency rossiya segodnya (russia today), which was set up by an unexpected presidential decree to replace the longstanding ria novosti and voice of russia media outlets in december.. .
do you think the watchtower writers are doing some recalculations?.
will they switch the identity of babylon the great from a religious entity to the usa.. "rev.
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scotoma
What's the point of having nuclear weapons if your don't flash them once in a while.
It's hypocritical the way conservatives fight for their right to have guns but they want to prevent other countries from having the same ability to defend themselves with nuclear weapons as the USA has.
The so-called "legitimate" government that carried out a coup in Ukraine is now setting about confiscating all private firearms.
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Moscow - the only world power able to turn the United States into "radioactive dust"
by scotoma inthose are the words of a prominent russian tv broadcaster.. president putin recently appointed kiselyov as head of russia's newly restructured state-owned news agency rossiya segodnya (russia today), which was set up by an unexpected presidential decree to replace the longstanding ria novosti and voice of russia media outlets in december.. .
do you think the watchtower writers are doing some recalculations?.
will they switch the identity of babylon the great from a religious entity to the usa.. "rev.
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scotoma
Those are the words of a prominent Russian TV broadcaster.
President Putin recently appointed Kiselyov as head of Russia's newly restructured state-owned news agency Rossiya Segodnya (Russia Today), which was set up by an unexpected presidential decree to replace the longstanding Ria Novosti and Voice of Russia media outlets in December.
Do you think the Watchtower writers are doing some recalculations?
Will they switch the identity of Babylon the Great from a religious entity to the USA.
"Rev. 18:16
"Too bad, too bad-the great city, clothed with fine linen and purple and scarlet and richly adorned with gold ornament...because in 1 hour such great riches have been devasted...cried out as they looked at the smoke from the burning of her and said 'What city is like the great city?' And they threw dust upon their heads and cried out weeping and mourning and said "Too bad, too bad- the great city, in which all those having boats at sea became rich by reason of her costliness because in 1 hour she has been devastated."
They probably won't change their idea that Babylon the Great is Religion. If the USA were Babylon the Great it would require them to conclude that at some point they would have to physically get out of the USA. That would be too much to ask JW's to do. And besides they've got that marvelous building project underway in Tuxedo.
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A contribution from one of the members!
by Atlantis ina contribution from one of the members who doesn't get to post very often.. ... .......... ........................ ......... ..........atlantis
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scotoma
My father was the "stock" (literature) servant in the early 1950's at our "Company"(congregation).
I had to fold those things for everyone.
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JW's Never Closed the Door On A Russian King of the North
by scotoma inking of the north.
union, the "king of the south" can be none other than the rival non-communist bloc, under the .
so who is the king of the north now?
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scotoma
What is amazing about this current confrontation is the fact that Europe and the USA have no interest in engaging Russian troops.
They threaten to mess with Russia's money and that's the extent of it.
There really isn't a military option to stop Russia from doing what it wants in Ukraine.
Those who like to talk about how weak Russia is forget that they have a couple thousand nuclear weapons, quite a few of which just need a few keystrokes and they target any military or civilian target they choose.
Rev. 13:3,4 "And I saw one of its heads as though slaughtered to death (Dissolution of the Soviet Union) BUT... its death-stroke got healed and all the earth followed the wild beast with admiration. And they worshiped the dragon because it gave the authority to the wild beast, and they worshiped the wild beast with the words: "Who is like the wild beast, and who can do battle with it?"
APPARENTLY the USA and the EU aren't able to do battle with it.
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JW's Never Closed the Door On A Russian King of the North
by scotoma inking of the north.
union, the "king of the south" can be none other than the rival non-communist bloc, under the .
so who is the king of the north now?
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scotoma
nonjwspouse,
What are the significant differences between Russia and the Soviet Union besides the fact that the Soviet Union no longer exists.
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JW's Never Closed the Door On A Russian King of the North
by scotoma inking of the north.
union, the "king of the south" can be none other than the rival non-communist bloc, under the .
so who is the king of the north now?
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scotoma
You don’t always have to wait for time to disprove an
interpretation of prophecy. Whether or not there really is any
truth to prophecy, sometimes an interpretation is totally out of
synchrony with what the actual words of the Bible are saying.
Here is an example which I mentioned I would deal with.July 15 Watchtower 1981 says:
"Concerning the "king of the north," the prophecy states: "He
will have to come all the way to his end, and there will be no
helper for him." (Dan. 11:45) Moreover, a parallel prophecy
says of the Anglo-American World Power, also pictured by the "king of
the south," that "it will be without hand that he will be broken."-Dan. 8:25.This expresses the JW notion that the King of the North and
King of the South both are destroyed directly by the army of
faithful Angels led by Jesus at Armageddon. Is that really what
the Bible says?Look at the last time the King of the South is mentioned in the
Bible.Daniel 11:40 “And in the time of the end the King of the
South will engage with him (King of the North) in a pushing,
and against Him the King of the North will storm...The rest of Daniel 11 has only one dominant actor which is the
King of the North which seems to proceed with his plan and
no one is standing in his way. The King of the South is not
mentioned again - ever. If the King of the South was so
important in the pushing and shoving why isn’t he mentioned
as the King of the North expands his aggression to the extent
that he will “actually rule over the hidden treasures of the gold
and the silver and over all the desirable things of Egypt.”Daniel chapter 11 ends describing the end of the King of the
North: “and he will have to come all the way to his (King of
the North) end, and there will be no helper for him.OK so we know the King of the North has some kind of
sudden end. We assume it is by supernatural means similar to
the stone that is cut out of the mountain, not by human hands,
and which struck the iron/clay feet and brought the whole
sequence of human rule to an end.Whatever happened to the King of the South? Since nothing
is heard from the King of the South after the King of the North
goes forth in a great rage it is more than likely that it was
destroyed by the “human hands” of the King of the North. How
else can you account for the exit of the King of the South from
this final scenario?The Watchtower believes that the King of the South won’t be
destroyed by the King of the North because they assert that the
King of fierce countenance that is destroyed without hands at
Dan. 8: 25 is the Anglo-American combine. They teach that
the United States profaned the sanctuary.When you compare the description of the Little Horn in
Daniel 8 it fits nicely with the description of the King of the
North and the beast of Rev.13Little Horn Daniel 8:25 “Against the Prince of princes he will
stand up”
King of North Daniel 11:36 “Against the God of gods he will
speak marvelous things.
Wild Beast Rev. 13:6 “And it opened its mouth in
blasphemies against God to blaspheme his name and
residence.Little Horn Daniel 8:24 “And in a wonderful way he will
cause ruin and he will certainly prove successful and do
effectively. And he will certainly bring mighty ones to ruin.”
King of North Dan. 11:39 “And he will act effectively against
the most fortified strongholds”
Wild Beast Rev. 13:4 “Who is like the wild beast and who
can do battle with it?”Little Horn Dan. 8:11 “and from him the CONSTANT
FEATURE was taken away and the established place of his
sanctuary was thrown down... and it kept throwing truth to the
earth, and it acted and had success.”
King of the North Daniel 11:36 “and he will certainly prove
successful until the DENUNCIATION will have come to a
finish.
Wild Beast Rev.13:7 “And there was granted it to wage war
with the holy ones... And all those who dwell on the earth will
worship it.”The little horn parallels the King of the North - NOT the King
of the South. Therefore the Watchtower is erroneously
assuming that the King of the South isn’t destroyed by the
King of the North. The King of the South is off the scene by
the time the King of the North is destroyed without hand.This re-orientation presents further problems for JW
interpretation. If the King of the North is the Wild Beast in
Revelation then where is the King of the South in Revelation?
What is Babylon the Great? Could it be that the great Harlot
that keeps the worlds economy going due to her craving of
luxury and that has hegemony over the Kings of the Earth is
the King of the South/USA? If so God’s people are told to get
out of her. If that is the case why would Jehovah get them
involved in a 4 year intensive construction project that would
take YEARS of use to justify the huge investment in man-
power and money.Maybe they are building their own Magic Kingdom that will
survive while everything else around them crumbles. -
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JW's Never Closed the Door On A Russian King of the North
by scotoma inking of the north.
union, the "king of the south" can be none other than the rival non-communist bloc, under the .
so who is the king of the north now?
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scotoma
Respectful,
The biggest mistake the Watchtower has made is due to their bias from having their headquarters in the USA.
They are stuck on hanging the Anglo-American label as a place marker on every convenient prophetic hook.
Clearly there are only four metals in the dream image.
Gold = Babylon
Silver = Persia
Copper = Greece
Iron = Rome.The strength of Rome was pictured as extending all the way to the point where the Kingdom of
the Heavens brings an end to these world powers.The Watchtower likes to believe that Britain and America are the continuation of the Roman
empire.History indicates something quite different. Britain may have been a Roman colony but it was
never the ruling center of the Roman empire.The ruling center of the Roman empire shifted to the Eastern, richest and most populous part of
the Roman empire. The Byzantine empire was the real successor to Rome and continued as such
until 1476, almost a millennium after the fall of Rome .Russia claims it is the “Third Rome”. The Russian flag with it’s double headed eagle facing East
and West was also the emblem of the Byzantine empire. It is worthwhile to read about the
concept of the “Third Rome” and Russia’s historical link to that idea. Look up Third Rome on the
internet. The Babylon book published by the Watchtower in 1963 has a section devoted to the
Third Rome and Russian Orthodoxy but they never jumped on the significance of the Third RomeIn Russia you have the most significant features of the feet of Daniel’s dream image.
Russia is described by scholars as an Ethnofederation. Look up “ethnoferalism and think CLAY).
It is made up of many distinct nations and language groups. They are held together loosely by
force of arms (Iron). Look up Ethnic Groups in Russia on Wikipedia. There are 185 listed. This
is why Russia beat up Chechnya. They are fighting against disintegration. Without Ukraine
Russia will likely disintegrate completely. They will lose any chance of building a strong central
power. This is why the situation in Ukraine is do or die. The principle route for invading Russia
is the flat plains of Ukraine. Hitler and Napoleon took that route. -
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JW's Never Closed the Door On A Russian King of the North
by scotoma inking of the north.
union, the "king of the south" can be none other than the rival non-communist bloc, under the .
so who is the king of the north now?
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scotoma
There is an attitude of observers of the JW world that the org closed the door on Russia as the
King of the North. I’ve also had that attitude. There is the idea that, now, with Russia, once
again asserting itself against domination by the West that the Watchtower has been caught flat-
footed. But have they? The facts in print indicate that this time they left themselves a little
wiggle-room.Their interpretation prior to the fall of the Soviet Union was quite clear and dogmatic. The
Watchtower carried a series of articles on Daniel that were derived from the 1958 book “Your
Will Be Done On Earth”. This series ran from November 1958 to June 1960.The Watchtower Part 30 paragraphs 26, 27
The Germanic king of the north as a rival of the seventh world power, the Anglo-American world power, no longer existed. A new politically strong power must step into his shoes, that the rivalry between the two kings for world domination might go on to a final decision or a draw, a standstill.
27 Who could do so? Who did? Events quickly revealed—the Soviet Union, the Communist
power that, since it seized power in Russia in 1917, has held world domination as its aim to this
day.In 1981 the story remained the same: Watchtower July 15 Pages 5-7
The Power Struggle-What Outcome?
There can be no doubt that the modern-day "king of the north" is the Communist bloc, headed by
the Soviet Union. Since the modern "king of the north" is the Communist bloc, led by the Soviet
Union, the "king of the south" can be none other than the rival non-Communist bloc, under the
leadership of the United States. Concerning these "kings," the prophecy of Daniel goes on to say:
"And in the time of the end the king of the south will engage with him [the king of the north] in a
pushing."-Dan. 11:40. Soviet reactions to the tough line recently adopted by the "king of the
south" show that the "king of the north" does not intend to be ridden over roughshod. Since
World War II, the Soviet Union has been "thrusting out his hand" to grab control over various
"lands" and "hidden treasures," including oil.Whatever the extent of the "pushing" by the "king of the south" may be, and whether the "king of
the north" literally 'floods over' by invading other lands or not, one thing is certain: According to
Daniel's prophecy, neither "king" will achieve a decisive victory over the other. Concerning the
"king of the north," the prophecy states: "He will have to come all the way to his end, and there
will be no helper for him." (Dan. 11:45) Moreover, a parallel prophecy says of the
Anglo-American World Power, also pictured by the "king of the south," that "it will be without
hand that he will be broken."-Dan. 8:25. (This is a bizarre interpretation arbitrarily imposed on
Dan. 8:25 under one of their favorite tools - Parallelism - more about this later)So it is clear that they dogmatically insist that at that particular time the shifting identity of the
King of the North pointed to the Soviet Union.Ooops. By 1993 the Soviet Union completely disappeared. More on this amazing event later.
The thing that is unusual is JW’s never anticipated this event. Let’s see how they dealt with it.Watchtower 1993 November/1 p. 21 par. 12 The Final Victory of Michael, the Great Prince
So who is the king of the north now? Is he to be identified with one of the countries that were
part of the old Soviet Union? Or is he changing identity completely, as he has a number of times
before? We cannot say. Who will be the king of the north when Daniel 11:44, 45 is fulfilled?
Will the rivalry between the two kings flare up again? And what of the huge nuclear stockpiles
that still exist in a number of lands? Only time will provide the answers to these questions.Let’s look at that last sentence again.
“Only time will provide the answers to these questions.”
In the words of Dana Carvey as SNL’s Church Lady “Now isn’t that SPECIAL”
No it’s not special. It is typical of all of JW’s interpretations. Isn’t waiting and watching what
all so-called Christians do? It is clear why the organization condemns speculation. They have
speculated their members right into a frantic depression as they bury each successive generation. .
The only thing left is to say it’s SOON. And that’s what they have been saying. That’s what
Jesus’ followers were saying for a 100 years after his death. The early Church stopped that
nonsense early in the 2000 year epoch that followed..Back to the wiggle room. JW’s didn’t name a successor to the Soviet Union. They even left it
open to the possibility that Russia as “one of the countries that were part of the old Soviet Union"
could emerge from the collapse.So, their strategy might now pay off. They will surely jump on current events and give strong
hints that their members should keep an eye on Russia. They might even say that it was a good
thing that they didn’t stick to their old interpretations so that it would allow people in the former
Soviet Union to preach the word without hindrance. It would have surely been self-defeating to
be telling the newly liberated people of Eastern Europe that they are destined to be citizens of the
feared Soviet Union again. -
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What is the purpose of Field Service??
by quellycatface inthe so used to say it was life saving work.i wasn't convinced.it was soul destroying in the area i lived.i didn't want to be so cynical as to think, it was just to gain converts, therefore more money but it certainly looks that way now..
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scotoma
Purpose of field service?
I am assuming field service includes ALL forms of outreach - Kiosks, Bus Stops, Street Corner, Door-to-Door, Letter writing, Phone Calling
1. Get new members. (Which is believed to save lives)
2. Publicity. (Attract attention. Put the world on notice.)
3. Build group loyalty.
4. Assess individual zeal for appointment to positions in organization.
