Posts by sd-7

21

This good news of the kingdom

by sd-7 in

jw
friends

if you'll open your 'benefit from theocratic ministry school education' books to page 279, you'll notice that it says, "the message jesus said would be preached in our time goes beyond what was preached in the first century.

" if you actually opened your books, i'm paraphrasing, but that's pretty close to the actual quote.. i remembered this quote from sometime ago, but couldn't understand how people overlooked this obvious violation of galatians 1:8: "even though we or an angel out of heaven should declare to you as good news something beyond what we preached, let him be accursed.".

of course, the answer is obvious: many jws don't pay attention to what they read.

sd-7

Thank you, zoiks. ... Got your PM. Will keep you in mind.

It just occurred to me that the logical JW defense would be, "Well, Jesus did say that 'this good news of the kingdom' would be preached as a sign of his presence. Bible chronology (and we all know how reliable that is [*cough*1799, 1874, 1918, 1925, 1975*cough*]) indicates that his presence started in 1914. Clearly, he would want THAT good news to be declared."

Well, therein lies the greatest problem with JW argumentation. The structure of this argument hangs entirely on a hook that the Society hung--1914. Which would be well and good, but we need to be able to prove 1914 scripturally. Let's go to Daniel chapter 4, the only prophecy in the book of Daniel that has two fulfillments. Even though the lesson learned is that "the Most High IS Ruler in the kingdom of mankind"--present tense--apparently this tree dream actually means that the Most High WILL BE Ruler in the kingdom of mankind, in October 1914. I've noticed how the present and past tense can be altered as necessary to serve doctrine. Time for a new post on that!

The whole point of the tree dream was to demonstrate that God runs the show whether there is a king on a throne in Jerusalem or not, right? The humiliation of Nebuchadnezzar serves no real purpose if God's rulership towards the earth has actually been cut off at this time, BY Nebuchadnezzar! Why do it, if God's rulership has been interrupted? How can it be that the "Most High IS Ruler" if, at the time the events of Daniel happened, the Most High IS NOT ruler? Hmm.

Here's the real good news: the Society is wrong. Thank God they're not going to be ruling over us in heaven.

SD-7

5

A Watchtower Blood ParadoxBuying a Service

by Marvin Shilmer in

jw
friends

a watchtower blood paradoxbuying a service.

watchtower writes:.

it could be seen that it would not be right for a christian to work exclusively for a blood bank, where everything was devoted to an end that was in violation of gods law.

sd-7

Devastating logic.

SD-7

63

Separating saucer section...General Order 14. [Borg cubes inbound!--Part II]

by sd-7 in

jw
friends

captain code named sd-7.

self-destruct code 0-0-0-alpha-gamma-1.

this will be my final entry on jehovahs-witness.net.

sd-7

You dropped some pretty serious wisdom, agonus. I'll have to remember that.

SD-7

21

This good news of the kingdom

by sd-7 in

jw
friends

if you'll open your 'benefit from theocratic ministry school education' books to page 279, you'll notice that it says, "the message jesus said would be preached in our time goes beyond what was preached in the first century.

" if you actually opened your books, i'm paraphrasing, but that's pretty close to the actual quote.. i remembered this quote from sometime ago, but couldn't understand how people overlooked this obvious violation of galatians 1:8: "even though we or an angel out of heaven should declare to you as good news something beyond what we preached, let him be accursed.".

of course, the answer is obvious: many jws don't pay attention to what they read.

sd-7

If you'll open your 'Benefit From Theocratic Ministry School Education' books to page 279, you'll notice that it says, "The message Jesus said would be preached in our time goes beyond what was preached in the first century." If you actually opened your books, I'm paraphrasing, but that's pretty close to the actual quote.

I remembered this quote from sometime ago, but couldn't understand how people overlooked this obvious violation of Galatians 1:8: "Even though we or an angel out of heaven should declare to you as good news something beyond what we preached, let him be accursed."

Of course, the answer is obvious: many JWs don't pay attention to what they read. If they did, they might notice little things like that. It's actually not their fault. Because the way the Society manages to dodge Galatians 1:8 is rather ingenious. It's by using what the YouTube video dude known as 'propagandatechniques' referred to as a 'hypnotic bait and switch'. By saying that 'Jesus said' the good news to be preached in our time goes beyond what was originally preached, it becomes legitimate. Did Jesus say that the good news of the kingdom roughly 2,000 years later would mean, not a focus on the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ and faith in his name, but that he became king in 1914? No. Nowhere is that recorded in any of the Gospels. But 'evidently', Jesus said it.

This is a case of the 'slave' putting words into the Master's mouth, saying things he did not say, attributing those things to him. Notably, it's not far from this quote that this same publication instructs publishers to quickly acquaint interested ones with "the faithful slave", somehow thus establishing Christ as the Master. In short, successfully linking the 'slave' to Jesus Christ cements into the interested one's mind that anything this 'slave' says is actually coming from Jesus Christ. While the intent is stated as establishing Christ as the Leader and Head, is that the actual consequence? Well, certainly the new convert BELIEVES Christ is the Head. But is it true? Has Jesus said anything or done anything special to indicate that the Watchtower Society was his chosen instrument? Well, obviously that would be an untestable assumption, just like Jesus' invisible presence.

Wait...we could test it. If one simply considers what the Society published in 1914 and thereafter, we could probably find out, couldn't we? Yeah...about that...um...let's not be roving about in anything before 1950....the light wasn't too bright before that...but we can be sure that Jesus MUST'VE picked the winning team.

Okay...so maybe I'm not done here on JWN after all. I thought I could be. But there's no end to the obsession. Never will be, I suppose. Never will be.

SD-7

26

My mom got stumbled by today's Watchtower

by JerkhovahsWitless in

jw
friends

the photo on page 26. she noticed it and was wondering before i even brought it to her attention.. why is it ok for the jw posing as the "worldly person" to wear a cross necklace?

aren't jws suppose to destroy their crosses prior to becoming a jw no matter the monetary or sentimental value?

why can the watchtower keep cross necklaces on hand as props?

sd-7

Certainly calls to mind the cover from the 'Six Myths About Christianity' public WT recently. I wondered if they did some digital technology (ie. a guy sitting at a pew in front of a blue screen while the church building was digitally placed around him) or if they actually went into a church for that. Hmm. Of course, in hindsight, it all makes more sense. Anything is justifiable if it creates more followers. If they can overtly use double standards and even lie as necessary, what's the big deal about going into a church and sitting at a pew with a cross or rosary beads? It's a DF'ing offense for us, but for those in power, it's no big deal.

Remember, too, that the research that goes into the literature itself relies on what? Outside sources--Bible commentaries written by people who are not JWs. Bottom line? It's just another religion. The only main difference is that its adherents do not realize it.

SD-7

63

Separating saucer section...General Order 14. [Borg cubes inbound!--Part II]

by sd-7 in

jw
friends

captain code named sd-7.

self-destruct code 0-0-0-alpha-gamma-1.

this will be my final entry on jehovahs-witness.net.

sd-7

Perhaps so, VoidEater. Perhaps so. I didn't actually think this sort of situation would be happening to me. It's like a bad dream. So quickly, the joy that my wife and I shared in life is...

She's a good woman. It isn't fair that anonymous, untouchable individuals should be able to have this kind of control over people. I can't let them win.

... Having a few emotions to deal with right now. Going to have to step back.

SD-7

32

The Watchtower hates the word, "You"

by moshe in

jw
friends

dozy brought up a good point a few months back about how the wt uses third party terminology to obscure their real motives.

i thought it was a good idea to revisit this wt writing technique.. (http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/184897).

look at the nov 15th 2009 wt, "treasure your place in the congregation" and compare what happens when we replace the third party terminology (words in bold type) with first party words.

sd-7

If the GB says "we", they give the illusion that they are not above the law, either. Which is true only so far as anyone knows about what they do and so much as a particular rule violation would endanger their political cred. But reality is that they ARE the law, and if they as a whole (or at least a 2/3 majority) had a problem with any particular rule, doctrine, or policy, they would change it. If WE have a problem with a rule, doctrine, or policy, we (that is to say, YOU) have to wait on them to change it, not try to change it yourself--and certainly not ignore it, regardless of whether it makes sense or is true or not.

Besides, there is no YOU. There is only "us". Doctrine over person, remember? Lifton's 8 characteristics of mind control?

SD-7

63

Separating saucer section...General Order 14. [Borg cubes inbound!--Part II]

by sd-7 in

jw
friends

captain code named sd-7.

self-destruct code 0-0-0-alpha-gamma-1.

this will be my final entry on jehovahs-witness.net.

sd-7

I actually considered the implications of such a system. As Obi-Wan Kenobi once said, "And there's an even bigger danger." Who's to say that a uh, triple agent might not just bait someone into revealing their true identity and outing themselves unintentionally? You'd have to be sure whoever is sending it could be trusted. I wouldn't chance it, but then, now I have nothing left to lose. So I don't mind.

But this actually seems like a good idea, though. I'm sure you have the patent pending on it, though. ;)

SD-7

63

Separating saucer section...General Order 14. [Borg cubes inbound!--Part II]

by sd-7 in

jw
friends

captain code named sd-7.

self-destruct code 0-0-0-alpha-gamma-1.

this will be my final entry on jehovahs-witness.net.

sd-7

...By the way, I still haven't thrown the away the books. And if this marriage survives, I'm quite certain I will encourage her daughter to rebel against the status quo as much as possible--but only so far as she understands why it's necessary. But I'm not so sure this will last long enough for me to form that kind of bond with the kid. ... I hope so. Fact is, I love both of them. And I do so in spite of what my wife believes. ... I don't know if it'll mean anything in the end. But those books just might save someone else. Perhaps it's not my place to merely get rid of them. People do deserve to have their faith rewarded. But they don't deserve to have their faith taken advantage of.

... I do need you guys. I don't want to keep going back and forth between leaving the site and staying. Sometimes I do wonder if I'm doing the right thing. ... But I need to go. Have to check my PMs. Take care.

SD-7

63

Separating saucer section...General Order 14. [Borg cubes inbound!--Part II]

by sd-7 in

jw
friends

captain code named sd-7.

self-destruct code 0-0-0-alpha-gamma-1.

this will be my final entry on jehovahs-witness.net.

sd-7

What I find truly sad about all of this is that I get more logical support and comfort from people I've mostly never met than I do from anyone inside this religion. When I talk to them, I already know what they're going to say. Just think of whichever WT article relates to the situation and you're already there. That's why I became disillusioned. I knew there were more answers than the ones in the paragraph.

For your support, I'm very grateful. I appreciate Jamie's kind words here. Your support means a whole lot to me. Jamie was kind enough to remind me that it's a cult. Sometimes, just saying that to myself helps me to let go a little more.

I contacted my old therapist, who I couldn't (and still can't) afford to go to. I'm going anyway, just because I'm not able to pay all the bills regardless; why bother kidding myself? So...should be going to therapy more regularly again.

AllTimeJeff--you're one of my favorite posters here. I'm ashamed. A guy has to have a nervous breakdown just to get a post from you. :) But thanks for your thoughts. They're actually, in a lot of ways, the same thoughts I've had in my head but have been unwilling to face. I've thought about asking her to leave for awhile. She might not mind it much. It was her suggestion, after all. But the thoughts I could share would create another post altogether. And I said I wouldn't. But thank you.

I've started to lose faith in everything. But here, amongst you, I found people who understood. All those victims the Society suppresses while declaring to the public that they're not running a cult, that if they were, there would be many victims coming forward. You're all here. A testimony to just how low they are willing to sink.

It won't be over anytime soon for me. My mood has improved slightly, but...my mom and brother are in this, too. My aunt and my cousins and their kids. None of them will think anything of me save that I was the oddball, the black sheep who dared to question everything. Or who just 'went crazy' and did some stupid stuff.

The Thought Police called Saturday night. Called my phone at 10:00 at night. Hung up on him, simply because I don't appreciate being called at that hour by someone who doesn't really care in the first place but is going out on a limb to create an appearance of concern. Can't even sit down with my family and watch a movie without being interrupted by the [blanking] cult. Maybe that wasn't proper, but...I think I've become much more of a jerk now that I realize I've been lied to and all.

I'll just tell them to skip the committee and make the announcement. I find myself feeling a lot like the character Rorschach in the 'Watchmen' comic series, who was the one person who didn't compromise when he saw the truth for what it was. The price for him was just as high. At least he met it without compromise, without cowardice. "What's one more body amongst the foundations? Well? What are you waiting for? Do it. DO IT!"

They'll try to get me to reconsider. But I've nothing more to give this religion. It's time they knew that. And honestly, I never thought living in 'the new system' with the people I worshiped alongside sounded particularly appealing. They didn't seem like the 'best people in the world' to me. So even if it was true, I'm not sure it would be worth being a part of anyway. Who wants to live under a rulership like this? And what logic is there in God creating us with the capacity for free will, then demanding unquestioning obedience anyway? Why not just create the broken pottery? Why create it whole and then shatter it?

I've repressed a lot of emotions over this weekend. I wrote about doing things I never thought I'd be capable of doing, and I felt better. But those things were horrible. It was the first time I'd written about seriously disturbed things that I wanted to do to people. I realized then that I needed help. Because the rage is a micrometer from coming to the surface, and I don't think I could turn it off this time. So I'm going to get help.

I need to do so before I see these people again. Because...I've never felt like this before. I don't want to do something I'd regret forever. They don't deserve to see me bleed. That'd be too much to give them.

I still say Oompa's got it worse than me. Doesn't make me feel any more sane, though. I mean, I volunteered for this insanity, thinking I could make something of it. I thought love was all that mattered. Then I quickly learned that there is no love save that which is reserved for the Governing Body.

Special assembly day is this weekend. Hmm. Doesn't that mean we don't have a meeting this week? I can't believe I still care about that.

But hey, don't worry about me. There are more relevant people out there, people with genuine suffering. I'll manage. Take care of yourselves.

SD-7