bohm

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Posts by bohm

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  98

  Steve Hassan. Can some one verify if this is true.

  by joe134cd in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  https://culteducation.com/group/1289-general-information/8227-disclaimer-regarding-steve-hassan.html.

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  bohm

  Yah okay this just keeps getting worse and worse.

  So they guy who is likely to have written the article is "Rick Alan Ross". From wikipedia:

  Ross faced charges of unlawful imprisonment over a 1991 forcible deprogramming of United Pentecostal Church International member Jason Scott; a jury acquitted him at trial. In 1995, a civil lawsuit filed by Scott resulted in a multimillion-dollar judgement against Ross and his co-defendants. Later, Ross and Scott reached a settlement in which Ross agreed to pay Scott US$5,000 and provide 200 hours of professional services at no charge.
  Ross was the only deprogrammer to work with members of the religious group Branch Davidian prior to the Waco siege; some scholars later criticized his involvement with the siege.

  Okay, so a deprogrammer who was part of the Waco fuckup.

  Since Hassan criticize deprogrammers left and right for unethical practices it is not hard to guess why he might not like Hassan.

  On top of that Rick Ross appears to have absolutely no professional education (his bio list him as never having attended college) which makes it kind of funny he criticize Hassan for his lack of training...

  Regarding the fees this Is Hassans own response:

  As for the accusations, my current fees are not $500 as Ross claims. I charge half that for an hour of counseling and have done so for quite some time. In response to his suggestions that I am unethical in my dealings with clients, I want to assert that I abide by the ethical guidelines of my professional organizations including the American Counseling Association. Every person I have ever worked with has known what I charge in advance and has agreed to it. In recent months, in accordance with the new federal HIPAA guidelines, clients must sign a written contract that discloses all necessary information, if they wish to work with me.

  https://st0rage.org/~graalreborn11/pet/rick%20ross%20steve/Steven%20Hassan%20responds%20to%20rick%20ross/Steve%20Hassan's%20Response%20to%20Rick%20Ross's%20Personal%20Attack.htm
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  35

  More money-grubbing: Give us your money even if you can't afford food

  by bohm in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the message would appear to be that jehovah needs money more than that old lady needs food:.

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  bohm

  Nevula: The January study edition. Paragraph 17 is about the woman who gave the two coins in the temple.

  https://www.jw.org/da/publikationer/?contentLanguageFilter=en
  
• 
  98

  Steve Hassan. Can some one verify if this is true.

  by joe134cd in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  https://culteducation.com/group/1289-general-information/8227-disclaimer-regarding-steve-hassan.html.

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  bohm

  Okay so what are the facts of the matter?

  1) Steven Hassan charge too much:

  I googled and found a random psychiatrist who charged more than Hassan per hour. I think 400 USD is WAY too much, but it appears to be in line with what other psychiatrists charge, in particular "big name" psychiatrists.

  2) Various allegations about NLP:

  This does not appear to hold water as Hassan many times speak out against NLP

  3) Other professionals speak out against Hassan:

  I think this is the most substantial charge. For instance:

  "Dr. Cathleen Mann, who holds a doctorate in psychology and has been a licensed counselor in the state of Colorado since 1994 points out, "Nowhere does Hassan provide a base rate and/or any type or accepted statistical method defining his results...""

  I think this quote raises some questions. Firstly, it is very vague. Is it really expected that a mental health professional provide such statistical evidence for his or her methods? How is that supposed to be evaluated, exactly? (hundreds of patients with a control group?). That seems to be a nearly impossible standard.

  Secondly, who is Cathleen Mann? She does not mention where her PhD is from on her personal website(!!!), but from her linkedin her PhD is from "Walden University. Doctor of Philosophy (Ph.D.), Psychology, usually us usually"

  I could not find any scientific work she did in her PhD program. On top of that, Walden University is an online university with a history of controversy. From it's wikipedia page it does not exactly appear to be a powerhouse in the psychology department:

  Not accredited[edit]

  • Walden University’s Ph.D. specializations in Clinical Psychology and Counseling Psychology are not accredited by theAmerican Psychological Association (APA) and have not received designation by the Association of State and Provincial Psychology Boards/National Register (ASPPB/NR), which are requirements for licensure in some states. The M.S. and six other Ph.D. in psychology specializations offered by Walden are not governed by APA.[27]
  • Walden University's Counseling Psychology advanced degrees are also not accredited by the Council for Accreditation of Counseling and Related Educational Programs (CACREP), a specialized accrediting body, which is a requirement for licensure as a counselor in many states. [28]

  
  

  I think the critique of Hassan smells.. it is verging on being false (the hints Hassan engage in or support NLP) and supported by quoting "experts" who has degrees from online universities with a controversial reputation...
• 
  39

  More Anti Tight Pants Content

  by konceptual99 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  just skimming the latest study wt that has been posted and what did i see...?.

  i wonder what the message is that they want the flock to take from this picture?.

  there is also an article about training younger men to take over responsibilities.

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  bohm

  Ah I read that article, wasn't the title: "You can be smartly dressed as a Jehovah's Witness"?

  oh wait---
• 
  35

  More money-grubbing: Give us your money even if you can't afford food

  by bohm in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the message would appear to be that jehovah needs money more than that old lady needs food:.

  .

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  bohm

  The message would appear to be that Jehovah needs money more than that old lady needs food:

  
  
• 
  98

  Steve Hassan. Can some one verify if this is true.

  by joe134cd in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  https://culteducation.com/group/1289-general-information/8227-disclaimer-regarding-steve-hassan.html.

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  bohm

  I agree 400 USD Per hour is excessive but so what? Where is the Scandal? I am pretty sure hiring dr Phil is expensive as well, but that does not mean you cant read his books and does not have any impact on what he sayes is useful.

  regarding not being a psychiatrist, okay, but has he claimed to be? Is anything he writes harmfull or invalid?
• 
  70

  2016 annual meeting

  by obarac in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  just a few minutes till the start ..... we hope for a news from absalom and wifibandit very soon.. wifibandit, any tread on reddit for am?.

  also there were some info about live stream.

  any news about that..

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  bohm

  Well, a booring meeting is disappointing and unsatisfying for us, but fortunately it is equally booring and unsatisfying for the still ins which is good news.
• 
  70

  2016 annual meeting

  by obarac in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  just a few minutes till the start ..... we hope for a news from absalom and wifibandit very soon.. wifibandit, any tread on reddit for am?.

  also there were some info about live stream.

  any news about that..

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  bohm

  Well, that was anticlimatic..
• 
  26

  The bOrg Cult Tactics

  by pale.emperor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'm wondering if the borg actually studied mind control and coercion tactics deliberately or wether they just evolved over time through trial and error.

  from reading steve hassans books, studying hypnosis and methods psychopaths use it all seems very complex.

  like it would never occur to me to do a, b and c in the right order at the right time in order to get control of someone or control their lives.. for example, repetition of words (the word "loyalty" was a big one in the last convention), using loaded language, encouraging people not to trust their own thoughts, restricting their information, demonising those who leave etc.

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  bohm

  pale.emporer: The "my brain needed brainwashing" quip was also used by father moon, lol. (see "combating cult mind control").
• 
  26

  The bOrg Cult Tactics

  by pale.emperor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'm wondering if the borg actually studied mind control and coercion tactics deliberately or wether they just evolved over time through trial and error.

  from reading steve hassans books, studying hypnosis and methods psychopaths use it all seems very complex.

  like it would never occur to me to do a, b and c in the right order at the right time in order to get control of someone or control their lives.. for example, repetition of words (the word "loyalty" was a big one in the last convention), using loaded language, encouraging people not to trust their own thoughts, restricting their information, demonising those who leave etc.

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  bohm

  Good question. I think they came to the mindset that it was their duty to do whatever they could to persuade people to join/stay years ago (for their own sake) and once you are in that mindset, it is not mind-control but helping people. The various tools they use are things that are either obvious (shunning makes people reluctant to leave) or known from the advertising industry (play on emotions, simplify the message and repeat). So I don't think they feel they are brainwashing people, but I do think they talk about the strategy for making their religion as persuasive as possible and I doubt the question of ethics ever come up in those talks (they think whatever they do is ethical by definition).