Posts by flipper

111

"We Already Forgive Him" - What Does That Mean?

by cofty in

the children of one of yesterday's shooting have told the media that they have already forgiven the killer for what he did.. dylaan roof has not apologised for what he did.

he hates black people and probably regrets not killing even more.. what does it really mean to forgive?.

if the legal system asked the victims relatives what they want done next would they ask for dylaan to go free and unpunished?.

flipper

BALLISTIC- Your view, " part of it is to realize that WE ARE ALL USELESS SINNERS and capable of MANY HORRENDOUS THINGS under certain circumstances. "

Speak for yourself. I am NOT a " useless sinner " . I am NOT " capable of MANY HORRENDOUS THINGS under certain circumstances. "

You are insinuating that most humans are bad or have ill motives or subscribe to the " original sin " theory of Adam and Eve. I think that view is bullshit. And I'll prove it to you.

When babies are born into the world and you get small children together- most times these children are VERY accepting towards any race, color, or creed of people without prejudices. It's not until the ADULTS in these children's various family chains start teaching children their own prejudiced views that children start forming prejudiced views. Before they are influenced by the adults - children couldn't care less if a person is yellow, purple, red, black , or green.

It is NOT inherited sin that is within these adults generation after generation spanning hundreds of years in which they teach their children to have the same warped prejudiced views that they have- it is warped , twisted, unjust minds based on prejudiced views of their ancestors and forefathers handed down to them that keeps the flames of racial prejudice alive causing nutcases to go berserk like this guy did in South Carolina. When he was born he probably didn't have ANY views formed yet- not until he started reading and being influenced by those around him. So don't give me that born-in " useless " sin and imperfection crap. It's just an excuse religionists use to excuse bad behavior and not take responsibility for wrongs committed.

The only thing that will change prejudiced attitudes is that people individually start making a positive difference in their homes teaching children acceptance, make a difference in their communities speaking positively about racial equality and show it by positive actions. To make excuses for insane murderers is insanity in itself

111

"We Already Forgive Him" - What Does That Mean?

by cofty in

the children of one of yesterday's shooting have told the media that they have already forgiven the killer for what he did.. dylaan roof has not apologised for what he did.

he hates black people and probably regrets not killing even more.. what does it really mean to forgive?.

if the legal system asked the victims relatives what they want done next would they ask for dylaan to go free and unpunished?.

flipper

This reminds me in a smaller way of my elder dad always making excuses for the unjust decisions elders make through the years and telling me after I left the JW cult, " Well Flipper, in time Jehovah will take care of those elders who hurt you , they are imperfect and made mistakes - he will judge them as unfit and will destroy them at Armageddon. " And I would tell my dad, " No He won't. Elders will keep doing this to people as they will never answer for their crimes so they don't deserve forgiveness. "

To me it compares with religionists saying about this white supremacist murderer, " Well, we need to forgive him as he was mentally unfit and it's important to stay positive instead of resentful. " And I'm like WTF ? It's NOT more important to stay positive about a person who assassinated 9 people and ripped their families, friends, and children's lives apart. In fact- it's insanity to forgive someone like that who deserves to be killed himself for what he did. To show forgiveness to a piece of crap human like that is showing disrespect for the dead people he killed.

The same way that " forgiving " or overlooking WT Society injustices and elders injustices is not a good thing either. Until our society starts changing it's prejudiced attitudes that are passed on from one generation to the next within families either in Southern States or anywhere else- more hate crimes like this will occur. It's NOT something that religionists will fix by just saying they " forgive " some wacked out murderer. It's not something that will just " go away " or not happen again. Ridiculous, the problems are much deeper , more systemic than that. Peace out, Mr. Flipper

24

The Weed AMONG the wheat ..NOT.."the weed overgrowed the wheat" Misunderstood parabel about anointed and about Gods patience

by TheWonderofYou in

referring to tim3l0rd who posted 12 days ago following message (see below) and the postings in which the "scattered" non organised anointed from 100 ce - 1900 ce are discussed, and the parabel of the weed among the wheat, i found out that it is not necessary at all that a "slave class" of anointed does itself distincts frome the weed , founds a new separated church,declares itself clean and holy, and begins a denunciating and destructive unnecessary harvesting.

the slave class of anointed should have better remained in the church and waited for jesus judgement.basis: .

tim310rd wrote: this goes along with the 2013 wt that changed the definition of the fdsl.

flipper

I wish there WAS " weed " available among the wheat when we used to attend meetings. Would have made meetings much more tolerable

23

My dear old Dad's (RIP) observation

by punkofnice in

my dear old dad was the po of a congregation.

he had been in the british marines during ww2.. one jolly day we were in the coach park at twickenham convention.. dad was watching the brothers and sisters getting off the coaches.. he looked at me and said quite pained: 'they all look like loonies.'.

i kid you not..

flipper

PUNK- At least your elder dad could occasionally slip into his non-cult personality- my dad was a P.O. and City Overseer for 35 years and never ONCE did I ever see him come out of the cult personality or cult mode- ever. He was the stuffiest, most feared elder in our town. People walked in terror of him - but not me - I saw through his veneer. One reason he didn't like me and we never got along. He's still alive, almost 90 years old now- and I still really do not know the man himself after all these years. I,m closer to my mom as she is a sweet woman who accepts my exiting the Witnesses.

Hang in there Punk, we are all survivors bro. I was born and raised in the WT filth as well and after exiting at age 44 almost 12 years ago I've washed myself clean of it. But it takes time to get over some of the stuff, Some of it we may never get over- but we just have to move ahead , play our music and live each day to the fullest like it's our last ! And make and treasure new friends who accept us for who we are as beautiful people. Take care, Peace out, Mr. Flipper

44

How do you manage to keep JW friendships after you left the organization?

by Bonsai in

jw
friends

it seems incredibly difficult.

those who leave the org.

(or fade) no longer have anything in common with jehovah's witnesses, nor do they want to stick around to get radiated by the fear and guilt that saturates every aspect of a witnesses' life.. i've lost all but one of my jw friends quite simply because i can no longer condone the evil things that they condone.

flipper

BONSAI- I haven't kept ANY of my JW former friends. They have been told so many rumors about me without even verifying anything with me- that they stay away from me out of fear. Who needs conditional friends like that who are going to judge you without even giving you a chance to explain yourself ? I sure don't.

My real friends , ex-Witnesses and non-JW's accept me and understand me for who and what I am as a real human being who accepts and loves other people and not a JW who is instructed to hate. My older 88 year old JW mom is about the ONLY JW who accepts me for who I am without judgment. She's respectful of my beliefs and does not condemn me for exiting the Witnesses. She knows I had good reasons for leaving almost 12 years ago. We still have a great relationship.

My advice to you is pursue relationships with people who are going to accept you for who you are and what you believe without judgment- if that means letting go of your JW friends- then that may be what you have to do in order to have more peace of mind in your life. I know I have much more peace of mind without judgmental people running around me calling me up constantly telling me how deficient I am. My 2 cents

39

Jehovah's Witness woman refuses blood, then dies.

by Lee Elder in

another jehovah's witness woman has died while giving birth due to massive blood loss and refusing a blood transfusion.

she leaves nine children behind.

she finally consented to the transfusion but it was too late to save her.

flipper

This is an important thread which needs to be bumped up to the top

109

The Confederate Flag

by Simon in

the latest controversy over the confederate flag just sums up to me the state of dysfunction that exists in american society.. in summary: a white supremacist nutter shoots 9 black people dead in a church.

he's clearly inspired by the messages of others which the confederate flag is often a symbol of.. it seems like a no-brainer to remove it.

not only isn't it removed, it isn't even lowered at all as a mark of respect.. and of course now there are the people who want to defend their right to have it.

flipper

ZOOS- In the Southern part of the U.S. A. I don't think prejudice of both races is in the "minority " as you stated. I think it's a very common thing that happens WAY too much in the South. . You stated that there were multiple white men in your office that feel , " when crimes committed by blacks hit the news the boys at work are quick to judge the entire race on the stupidity of the black offender. " But you hear crickets from these racists when murders by a white man happen towards blacks as it just did there. And the comment by a co-worker, " The sad part is there were so many empty seats " ? Wow, just wow. Disgusting murderous attitudes of people who have allowed hundreds of years of Southern prejudiced attitudes to corrupt their minds.

I can honestly state that you would RARELY if ever hear those kind of malignant , prejudiced comments out here in the state of California in public places like offices, restaurants, around children by adults in public , etc. Sure- we have prejudice out here, but it's more of a private back and forth between people- the prejudiced attitudes between races is outwardly CONDEMNED in our state as being unacceptable.

My 30 year old son and his girlfriend just traveled through South Carolina and North Carolina on a road trip and while sitting at a restaurant in North Carolina they were appalled to see a white lady in her late 20's just very casually use the word " nigger " in conversation while talking quite normally at her table with her white friends. Something like , " Oh, it's just some dumb " nigger " lady. "

When you see people of any race using disrespectful, prejudiced words like this it is a throwback to the times of slavery when those attitudes were prevalent and permeated the American Society. Have we as a country really NOT progressed at all in over 150 years since slavery was abolished ? I think we have not unfortunately. I think people are just as prejudiced and ignorant as they ever have been, perhaps worse. And it's like a dormant volcano in the South where these pent up aggressive, violent attitudes towards blacks just keep brewing until one of these hate crimes by a white comes out and everybody wonders what happened. Wake the hell up people. It's been brewing for years sadly, and the only thing that can change it is if parents change the attitudes THEY have which were handed down by their ancestors and we begin to teach OUR children true acceptance of any race, color, or difference

14

Normalcy bias keeps JWs from leaving

by zimunzucz in

i have been frustrated by the inability of most jws to escape their bondage to the kh, despite repeated exposure to negative information about their religion and belief system.

perhaps it's due in part to something called normalcy bias- a definition i have found is:.

normalcy bias is part of human nature and, to some extent, we are all guilty of participating in it.

flipper

Very good post. I am forever and a day frustrated by my adult JW daughters who just can't see the good in people outside the cult. And the rest of my still in JW family is similar. They can't see the forest through the trees. It's frustrating but all we can do is patiently wait for them to see it in their own time. And be there to catch them once they decide to finally leap from the criminal organization called the WT Society

39

Jehovah's Witness woman refuses blood, then dies.

by Lee Elder in

another jehovah's witness woman has died while giving birth due to massive blood loss and refusing a blood transfusion.

she leaves nine children behind.

she finally consented to the transfusion but it was too late to save her.

flipper

This is very, very sad . The quote from the article, " Information available to the Chronicle indicates that a few years ago, Rebecca allowed medical doctors to conduct a blood transfusion on her at the same hospital during childbirth , and was ex-communicated from her Church ( JW's ) for going contrary to it's beliefs. "

It continues, " It took the leaders of the community and chiefs from her hometown, to intervene for her to be reinstated into the Church. It is, perhaps, for this reason that she might have rejected advice from the medical doctors to allow the process to be conducted on her once again to save her life" , Mr. Anna explained.
And therein lies the problem. This poor JW woman was SO MUCH in fear of being ostracized from her own people and DFed from the JW's that it caused her to allow herself to die just in order to " please " the WT Society and appointed elders in her JW church. The WT Society IS a criminal organization and it's officials SHOULD be brought up on charges of murder for not only THIS woman but thousands of other JW's who have lost their lives due to following insane advice about not taking blood transfusions to save their lives ! Now 9 children of this lady have lost their mother forever due to the irresponsibility of following WT Society rules and regulations. But the main blame goes to the WT Society for blackmailing it's JW followers with fear of being shunned to force it's members to make life endangering decisions .

The GB are MURDERERS as are the other upper echelon leaders of the WT organization. It's time for the public to make an outcry over it because the WT Society will probably skate away free from any responsibility of these deaths whatsoever ; and then more victims will follow in years ahead. It is absolutely infuriating and disgusting

109

The Confederate Flag

by Simon in

the latest controversy over the confederate flag just sums up to me the state of dysfunction that exists in american society.. in summary: a white supremacist nutter shoots 9 black people dead in a church.

he's clearly inspired by the messages of others which the confederate flag is often a symbol of.. it seems like a no-brainer to remove it.

not only isn't it removed, it isn't even lowered at all as a mark of respect.. and of course now there are the people who want to defend their right to have it.

flipper

I agree with you Simon- it is utterly disgusting to have a confederate flag flying at political buildings when it totally represents slavery and all that the " south " stood for during the civil war and before. It's a no-brainer to me too in that they should remove it. Especially after these murders.

In the High School I attended in Southern California years ago it was called " South " high school and their flag in the 1970's had a confederate soldier on it and the football team was called the " South High Rebels " . That was at a time when the mini series Roots was coming out and having this flag at our school caused a lot of racial tension in a school that was 33 % Hispanic, 33 % African American, and 33 % Caucasian . The principal was forced to remove the flag due to the riots it was causing within our school grounds and they FINALLY got the message on how offensive it was .

You are correct- America just does NOT get it. There are so many prejudiced attitudes especially in the Southern States and Midwest that it's ridiculous. It's so ignorant. Out west here in California it's better- however it just depends what community or part of the State or city people live in. One reason I wrote a song titled , " Prejudice and Ignorance. " Because prejudice and ignorance really IS all just the same