Posts by DannyBloem

posted

35
The GB of the JWs guilty or naive and ignorant ?
by greendawn in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
some people believe that the gb of the jws are a bunch of well meaning but naive and ignorant individuals who do not really mean to cause the harm they do cause in the r & f and they may not even be aware of it.

i personally disagree with that and believe that everything they do is based on shrewd cold blooded calculations that are meant to promote their interests, that they sold their souls to the devil as it were in exchange of a huge intoxicating power trip.

they are fully aware of the harm they cause but their conscience is singed beyond all sensitivity.
DannyBloem

You can be quilty and ignorant at the same time.
To be ignorant (for example do n ot know that something is not allowed in the natianal law) does not make you less quilty.
I agree with most that it is not a big consipracy there. I do think they believe that they are doing actually good, and believe what they teach themselves.
Now what are they quilty of? Giving wrong information? Giving a wrong interpretation of the a story book? Hard to prove....
Lying? Probably not. (what is the definition of a lie?) Withholding information: yes, but that is no crime.
Torring families apart. It is the families that do it (they do not even teach it actually)
The blood policy. Causing dead (not murder of course)? Yes maybe. But here again the people themselves do it. Hard to say if some other teachings are actually benificial for people...
17
Resurection with no Soul
by jimakazi in
1. social
2. entertainment
it always puzzeled me how a person could be resurected it there were no soul.. if it is just a clone with your memories then it is not you - or is it.

are we no more than our memories?.

assuming as the jw's do that there is no soul or life essesnce that leaves the body and can be restored.
DannyBloem

What? Just becasue you have a perfect copy does not make it the same item, it may be identical, but they are 2 items. This may not matter if we are taking about toaster ovens. The discussion is about life.

If you din't track it, and there are two things exactly equal. Then there is no way of telling them appart. So yes they are the same.
Why would this be different with life then?
Of course they are two items. But if the one of the item is destroyed without you knowing there is no way of knowing that it is not the original.
10
Free-will V.S predestiny
by Sargon in
1. jw
2. friends
it's been a long-long time since i shared any deep thoughts on religion... so please bear with me.

i was fishing this morning...since they weren't biting it gave me time to ponder;.

one of the concepts that caused me to leave the x-tian faith is the conundrum that boggles my mind when i consider free-will.. i've made the argument in the past that adam didn't have any free-will in the garden of eden.
DannyBloem

Yet another thread about free will.
If Christ knew that peter would disown him 3 times before the cock crowed; then this means that peter's actions were pre-ordained, and therefore peter didn't have any free-will.

IF by chance, peter had not disowned Christ... then Christ would have been wrong... and hence imperfect.

If christ were imperfect... then the whole basis of christianity would not make sense. IE... the point in christs life, was to be a sacrifice to God... a perfect life in exchange for the perfect life Adam gave up.

So Peter had no choice... once Christ made his prediction.
Of course it was written afterward, so that explains maybe something...
The bible is not very clear about it anyway, but a free will seems to be the most realistic.
The whole thing about time and god mentioned above is how scientists see it (most of them anyway). It can be combined with a pre destination or with free will, as long as there is no information passes from to 'outside' the universe. This rule seems very logical, because information must have a carrier, and it is very unlikely photons or something like it to leave the universe.
Forf ree will there is of course a problem. Where does it scientifically come from???? Who can Answer this?
I think free will is a illusion. We do things because of current influence (states at the moment in our brain). Based on previous experiences, and random quantum fluctuations.
See as I see it. The universe is not deterministic, but free will is also a illusion.
Danny
17
Resurection with no Soul
by jimakazi in
1. social
2. entertainment
it always puzzeled me how a person could be resurected it there were no soul.. if it is just a clone with your memories then it is not you - or is it.

are we no more than our memories?.

assuming as the jw's do that there is no soul or life essesnce that leaves the body and can be restored.
DannyBloem
The following reflects the JW standpoint:
We our body and soul is computer hardware.
Our "spirit" is the electrical current without the computer and its memory is useless.
Our experience, ego and memory is the files and programs on our hard drive.
When we die our hardware stops functioning, but God copies the memory to his archive.
The archive is on static media (DVD or CD) not on his active computer, or we would still be "alive".
When resurrected, God creates a duplicate hardware system with a monitor, keyboard and mouse that look just like our originals.
Then God copies the archived "you" onto the new hardware--basically a system restore.
Some questions that arise from this are:

Could not God create more clones of you in this way?

Yes he could, so what?
If our memories, ego and experience are stored in God's memory are we not alive in some way, anyway?
IF a program is not running, it is not alive.
Since there is not continuity between the original you and the resurrected you, can it really be you? Isn't that a copy?

If a copy is a perfect copy there is no difference between the two. So to say the one is something and the other one is not is useless.

In what way is a "Stepford Wife" different from a resurrected mate? Perfect in every way...

Jehovah's Witness hope, does it remove the sting of death?

by free2beme in

jw
friends

recently i was speaking to my witness sister, and the topic of someone dying in her husband's family came up.

she mentioned that her husband (a non-witness) has a hard time with death and will not even go back to his grandparents property, 20 years after their death, as he does not do well with the memories and death itself.

my sister made the statement, "i explained to him that i hoped one day i could help him come to terms with death, by learning what it really is and the hope in store.

DannyBloem

I think that if someone you love dies it is always painfull. If you are a JW or not. And later when you miss someone you can feel very sad. I think it does not depend that much if you are a JW or not.

I think the idea of the ressurection makes it easier for JW's to handle some things than maybe for non christians. Although I think it depends also much on personal strength how somebody handles it. To be part of a group it can also ease the pain. (there are a lot of JW's of course who really care about fellow believers and given them attention). That can help also.
So I think it depends so much on the situation.

p.s. what I hate hate hate is those funeral talks that are used as a convient time to give a preaching talk. Like she is dead, but if you want to have a bible study bla bla bla.
Some brothers do it more respectfully, and I know a lot of dubs who have asked the one who will give there talk not to do this in advance

Danny

Comments You Will Not Hear at the 6-26-05 WT Study (Exercise Restraint)

by blondie in

all, keeping himself restrained under evil.

''-2 timothy 2:24.

elders yell at each other, at the ms, at their wife and children, at the rank and file, and at the co at times.

DannyBloem

Just want to say thank you for doing this Blondie.

p.s. you study the wt a lot harder then most dubs do

What kind of a response would I get if I asked the JW's at my door

by Agnes in

jw
friends

to explain theocratic warfare?

agnes

DannyBloem

I think a lot will think that you are talking about pauls illustration with the bible as the sword, etc. They would probably feel that they are in a war against satan, and that the warfare is the preaching or something like it...

Thanks for all of your very interesting responses. This subject just drives me up the wall. It is hard to fathom that a ~~cult~~ religion would really encourage it's members to lie or shut down instead of anwering a simple question. Have family members that were once honest people until they became JW's and now find it so easy to lie. I don't intend to offend anyone...just venting. Agnes

I respectfully do not agree with you here Agns. I do not think that JW (the ordinary dubs) are lying. They do believe what they are saying. The do not have the feelng of theocatic warfare, what it is good telling lies etc. I think they are mostly honest. That is that they are fooled by the org, etc.
Only the ones with a dubble life need to lie... Danny

Are young JWs staying in or moving out of the borg?

by zagor in

jw
friends

really, just wondering if new generation of dubs is mostly faithful or tempted to try it all out.

are they faithful to the mother borg or are they starting to question it all.

i mean 10 to 20 years ago it took ages to come across some undesirable info about the borg, but now it is everywhere.

DannyBloem

In my opinion about 60% of the people growing up are leaving. From this 60% some, maybe 1/3th are coming back to the (b)org after having a experienced the world.

Danny