Posts by Greyeyes

19

Father told me about the elders school a couple years ago about this topic.

by Greyeyes in

because my now ex wife was molested by her dad back in the 60's (while he was an elder), my dad and i were talking when he got back about how the issue of molestation was heavily discussed.

he also tol dme that the society's stand on it had always been that of that it must be reported to the athorities.

that there had been a problem for too long of local elders being the ones to sweep it under the carpet, to protect a friend.

Greyeyes

Because my now ex wife was molested by her dad back in the 60's (while he was an elder), my dad and I were talking when he got back about how the issue of molestation was heavily discussed. He also tol dme that the Society's stand on it had always been that of that it MUST be reported to the athorities. That there had been a problem for too long of local elders being the ones to sweep it under the carpet, to protect a friend. They also said that any elder who learns of it MUST report it to the police as their christian duty. The example used was that if a witness commits murder, that the elders would go to the police, and that this is no different. And that if an elder was found out to have hidden thetruth about a situation that he would be removed of all responsibility.

Can any ex elder confirm or deny this?

64

New member, question thats been asked many times, but how do you feel ?

by Greyeyes in

i came across this site, and while still my upbringing says i should stay away from such site, i had to join.

a bit of a background about me.

i'm 31, my parents became witnesses when i was born so they could give me the best upbringing they felt possible.

Greyeyes

Yes, and actually, its just the opposite. I'm tired of the responsibility. Tired of the lofty expectations. I've had many worthwhile goals in my life. The one at 6 was just the first. Exhustion is the perfect word. I'm exhusted of trying to live by the rules, tired of dealing wit the aftermah of my ex-wife leaving me, just to have her turn around in the end, and go "you were right, I want you back" and me having to tell her no every other day. I'm tired of not sleeping, not eating, smoking to much, and those nasty Sat morning hangovers. I'm tired of having no beter a sex life now than I had when I was married. And I'm tired of feeling like everyone is pulling in every direction. Some to get me back in, others to get me to stay away. All have the answers, all are speaking the truth, and the other ones are evil. I'm passive. Live and let live. Thats just me.

64

New member, question thats been asked many times, but how do you feel ?

by Greyeyes in

i came across this site, and while still my upbringing says i should stay away from such site, i had to join.

a bit of a background about me.

i'm 31, my parents became witnesses when i was born so they could give me the best upbringing they felt possible.

Greyeyes

Then, who is the most oppressed religious group? I remember being at Bethel, and remembering the constant reports at morning worship about the brothers in Greece, Different African countries, etc that were under constant percecution. So that was false? Show me proof. And not someone's web page claiming it was false, but solid, well known sources. The same with being conciencious objectors. Please show me another Christian group, that as a whole, dont fight in wars or assist in any way. Again, I would like to see solid well known sources. You see, I have looked at these issues before, and I couldnt find any. Are JW's the only people who wont fight? Of course not. Are they the only ones oppressed? No. Are they the only ones as a global worldwide whole that are? From everything I've seen yes. I'm not here to debate, so please dont take it that way. I came to this site to find others like me, who just dont have the energy to go anymore. Not to get bombarded with all thereasons people feel that JW's are the Anti-Christ. I've in my travels, and searches,still never found a group of people that were more devoted to bible standards (even if they are flawed) but still normal people as I have with the JWs. I personally dont feel that they are a Cult. A cult to me are folks that want to off themselves to catch a comet to another planet. Or Drink Kool-aid for a mass suicide. Or the leader of the group marrying every female 12 and up in the bunch. To me JW's are just devout. I dont consider the Amish a cult. They Isolate themselves fromt he world. Refuse technology to a large degree. But no one talks abotu them being a cult. So explain to me why JW's are? Because they hold strick to the Bible? ANd let face facts. Even if they did change some things around. The basics hold true. Love you neighbor, dont get drunk, dont have sex outside of marrige, dont lie, dont cheat, dont steal, dont gamble, dont kill, dont partake of blood. Whats so hard about that? How is sticking to those principles make you a cult? Just becuase other Christian based faiths are lax about it? Again, not trying to debate, just want to know why so many of you hate them so much.....

64

New member, question thats been asked many times, but how do you feel ?

by Greyeyes in

i came across this site, and while still my upbringing says i should stay away from such site, i had to join.

a bit of a background about me.

i'm 31, my parents became witnesses when i was born so they could give me the best upbringing they felt possible.

Greyeyes

Sorry for the Typo James. That should have read "I guess my reason for joining this site WASNT to find ways to turn my gf's back to it, or even my own."

My typing gets sloppy when i'm at work pounding away all day on my keyboard.

GBL:

Yes I agree that ones used to death, and frankly that bothers me. But at the same time, it doesnt change the fact that they are infact one of the largest globally persecuted religions in the world today, for whatever reason. But I wasnt using that statement to prove its "the truth"

64

New member, question thats been asked many times, but how do you feel ?

by Greyeyes in

i came across this site, and while still my upbringing says i should stay away from such site, i had to join.

a bit of a background about me.

i'm 31, my parents became witnesses when i was born so they could give me the best upbringing they felt possible.

Greyeyes

4Thought:

One thing that I learned from my experience with getting the boot, was that no one wants to shun you. All that have stopped talking to me have hated to do so, and all do care for me. The elders that where int he meeting, etc, I have known for many years. I worked at a job with one of them for another year bfore I moved to Atlanta. The elders in this congregation, while they never met me, never knew me, and were able to just look at me and tell that I am df'd still pulled me aside, and welcomed me, telling me that i was welcome anytime, and they would do anything for me and my gf they could.

I guess my reason for joining this site want to find ways to turn my gf's back to it, or even my own. I'm very familier with most of the arguements that are used repeatedly here, and to be honest, I've taken them all with a certain grain of salt. Such as the UN topic. All worldy governments are the hand of the Devil so to speak in their eyes. But that doesnt stp them from working with them to get, maintain and protect their freedoms to worship. I've always looked at the Un issue as just one more governemt body they've worked with to do so. Lets face it, as a whole these days, theres really not one other religion thats persicuted globally likehe JW's. But I'm not going to really spectulate the issue. I just joined looking to see what other people are out there, and what they deal with in their lives since leaving, hoping to find others like me, who dont hate the JW's, dont try to tear them to shreads, and even though they may not believe in it anymore, they still have respect for those that are JW's.

70

I NEED HELP

by Shawn in

here is my situation: i am in the sacramento area of california.

i have a good friend of mine that is a jw.

she has recently not been attending meeting and not reading her watchtower.

Greyeyes

Shawn,

Most everything on that page IS current and true about JW's. The following are some comments that I have made regarding the list.

NewLight2

I do not know if this is current:
63. You cannot wear jade jewelry*
23. You cannot buy girl Scout cookies
47. You cannot play chess*

Some of the KH's do have windows, some do not
66. Jehovah's Witness meeting places have no windows

You may now take some 'allowed parts' see - http://ajwrb.org/ - for clarification on the blood issue.
19. You cannot take a blood transfusion

-A person who does NOT do any of the following may be labeled as a weak Witness called "unspiritual" or "Un-theocratic"
24. You must attend five meetings per week

-A person who does any of the following may be labeled as a weak Witness called "unspiritual" or "Un-theocratic"
14. You are discouraged from attending college
26. You cannot marry a non-Jehovah's Witness
45. You cannot have friends who are not Jehovah's Witnesses
55. You cannot have a tattoo
62. You cannot join any clubs or sports teams - Unless it is with ALL JW's and even then it is frowned upon
97. You cannot be involved in martial arts, boxing or wrestling
- Unless it is with ALL JW's and even then it is frowned upon
98. You cannot participate in a school play

If I may I would like to answer some of these.

63. There is nothing wrong with wearing Jade jewelry. Wearing any jewelry that has a mistical symbol, or good luck charm on it is.

23. Girl Scouts are I believe Methodist or Babtist based, and as such, a JW would be discuraged from buying anything that even involunteraly supports such any other religious org. This also is true for the Salvation Army which is faith based.

47. There has NEVER been ANYTHING wrong with playing chess. Ever.

66. Some Kingdom halls have windows some do not. It all depends on the style the local congregation chooses to build, as well as the neighborhood it's built in, for break in reasons.

19. Blood Transfusions are not allowed. Never have been never will be. Some other procedures, either with blood "parts" or organ transplants are left up to the patients decision, and his alone.

24. Yes, by attending all the meetings you can still be weak, but by not going to all of them, you can defiantely become weaker than if you attend them all. Also, by not attending them all, it can show a serious spiritual breakdown beginning, that can snowball if left unchecked.

14. Not true. As with all aspects of a JW's life, everything they do is to be for the praise and glory of God. There was a misunderstanding awhile back about this issue, and the Society came out and cleared it up. If going to college and getting a degree can help you advance lets say the full time ministry by being able to work less hours and make a better income, allowing you to spend more time in the field work, wonderful. If by getting a degree in a needed feild, that can help you get to Bethel, be it nursing, Dr. Lawyer, etc, wonderful. If getting a degree is so you can live a wealthy comfotable life, with the biggest house, nicest cars, etc, and not increasing what you are doing within the org, that goes against Bible principles. Its liek anything. Its not the thing itself thats good ro bad, but what you intend to do with it.

26. False. It is discouraged, because it can cause a severe strain on a couple with different beliefs, that can usually break up a marrige. I have seen cases where a person has stopped being a JW, and I've seen other ones where the non JW becomes one, to the point of becoming an Elder, and even serving at Bethel. But it is discouraged, not a CANNOT issue.

45. False. While assosiation with non JW's must be guarded, its not wrong. Most all now JW's who had friends before becoming one, still have them. Thats a commonn fear among those who have friends becoming one, and I can asure you, they won't stop being your friend. If they do, it's not by the hand of the JW's.

55. True. You cannot decorate your body. The bible states this. The JW's are just the only "christian" based faith that enforce it. You cannot be kicked out for getting one, or even reproved, but your privilages in the congregation if you have any can be taken away for a time.

62. Again, frowned upon. Anything that can take time out of or distract your ministry is discouraged. Thats not just clubs and sports teams. Thats ANYTHING. Hobbies, recreation thats not balanced, and is to the extreme is looked down on.

97. True. Any form of fighting is looked down on. As the group as a whole is a passive bunch, fighting, or learning how to fight goes against the bibles advice that those who live by the sword, die by the sword.

98. false. Again, its one of those things where it's what is taking up the most time in your life. Again Any extra-curricular activity that takes up too much time is frowned upon. Will this activity make you miss any meetings? Will you miss door to door service? What is the nature of the play? Does it promote non biblical standards? Those are questions again that must be asked to make a decision. Again, you wont get kicked out for doing it, but you may be questioned as to what the motives are, and how it will affect your spritual health.

64

New member, question thats been asked many times, but how do you feel ?

by Greyeyes in

i came across this site, and while still my upbringing says i should stay away from such site, i had to join.

a bit of a background about me.

i'm 31, my parents became witnesses when i was born so they could give me the best upbringing they felt possible.

Greyeyes

Thanks everyone for your opinions and insights.........

64

New member, question thats been asked many times, but how do you feel ?

by Greyeyes in

i came across this site, and while still my upbringing says i should stay away from such site, i had to join.

a bit of a background about me.

i'm 31, my parents became witnesses when i was born so they could give me the best upbringing they felt possible.

Greyeyes

No, I thank you for your blunt reply. Am I searching? No. I've searched in the past, and dont care to anymore. I just want to live out the rest of my life, to whatever end and outcome there is. Has she? Yes she has. While maybe still young (24) she's studied into 4 major religions before this one, as well as taking religion and theology in college. She has noted, and I saw it a few times myself, that she's gotten answers to things that other religions have glazed over or avoided answers to all together.

64

New member, question thats been asked many times, but how do you feel ?

by Greyeyes in

i came across this site, and while still my upbringing says i should stay away from such site, i had to join.

a bit of a background about me.

i'm 31, my parents became witnesses when i was born so they could give me the best upbringing they felt possible.

Greyeyes

Wow, defiantely not the types of responses I expected, but at least you answered how you feel! hahahahaha

While I have just joined this site today, I've read the information on this site as well as others on such things as the UN, the RC engine, child molestation, etc. for quite some time.I do not want to get into any arguements or anything of that nature either. I know the other side of the coin with some topics, and nothing with the others. I also dont want to bash the JW's in any way. I am more looking to see how others feel about it, both from those who have left, and those who are thinking about it.

64

New member, question thats been asked many times, but how do you feel ?

by Greyeyes in

i came across this site, and while still my upbringing says i should stay away from such site, i had to join.

a bit of a background about me.

i'm 31, my parents became witnesses when i was born so they could give me the best upbringing they felt possible.

Greyeyes

Hello all. I came across this site, and while still my upbringing says i should stay away from such site, I had to join. A bit of a background about me. I'm 31, my parents became Witnesses when I was born so they could give me the best upbringing they felt possible. I gave my first talk when i was 5, started setting the goal of Betel Service when I was 6 or so, became a Pioneer at 17, M.S at 17, went to Bethel at 20 for a year, and then I started to loose steam. Now its not that I ever questioned the way I was taught, the things I was taught, or anything along those lines. To this day, I still will give the best Witness possible to anyone who asks what Witnesses believe. It still bothers me that so many people have nooooo clue whatsoever.

About 4 years ago, my now ex wife, who was raised a Witness in Brooklyn all her live, cheated on me, and left me. That final thread I had been hanging on with finally snapped, and I went downhill fast. I had been inactive for probably 7 years or so at this point, so weakness set in, and i started going out to a club down the street, making friends with bartenders, the owners etc. Getting drunk on the weekends, ended up dating an ex witness for a short time I had been friends with growing up, having sex, etc. Then, while I had hated it all my life, I started smoking. I was reproved for it, (since they didint know about the sex part) but I couldnt break the habit, so last January I was DF'd. Of course thats killed my parents, old friends etc, but I havent had a real desire to go back. I dont hate the organisation, I dont blame them or God, or the bible for playing by the rules and still getting screwed in the end either.( The ex and I waited 4 1\2 years before getting married before having any type of sexual contact) I just got tired. Tired of being good. Tired of trying to make everyone happy. Tired of trying to live up to the reputation I had growing up. So I dont hate thme. There are problems, but it's an imperfect organisation, with imperfect members. I still think that the group as a whole try very hard to do whats right, to live by bible standards, and from what I've seen in the "world" very few other religions have come as close. But I dont want to go back. I dont have it in me anymore. Interestingly though, the girl I have been dating for the last 2 1\2 years, raised a Lutheran, started asking me questions about what we believed from the very beginning. She would read different publications I had still, always asking more and more and more. A month ago or so, a Pioneer started coming by her job and leaving magazines. She went to the Memorial. She has been attending the Sunday meetings and even studying the Watchower artcle on her own to prepair. No one has pressured her for a study, no one trying to beat it into her head. I went with her to her first meeting to make her comfortable, and the elders were sooooo warm and accepting. Even to me, who the PO recognized right away as being DF'd. One elder even went so far as to hug me in appreciation for coming, and for trying to help my gf. They know we live together, and they didnt even blink. My gf, is so hungry for answers. Answers she says she has searched for her entire life, from all major religions. Just from what she's seen, heard, and read, she looked at me the other night and said, "If this isnt as close to the truth as possible, then there is no truth." Of course she knows and understands that if she continues, we cant stay together. And as much as that upsets her, she's willing to make that sacrifice. She said she finally feels like life has a purpose, and that she understands why bad things happen.

I miss the old days sometimes, but dont want to go back. I've given up my family, friends, now possibly my gf. And I dont want to go back. Yet I still love everything i was taught. Everything I believed.Everything i did. But I just cant seem to do it.

Thanks for letting me vent